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I'm saying that someone who does not know how to communicate/share in an equal relationship and can only cope if they are in charge and calling the shots, is emotionally/socially immature and selfish. Do you disagree with that?
Of course! When have I suggested otherwise? Or are you posing a strawman argument to suggest that Christian men in general are incapable of doing so?
I think the OP needs to back away from this situation before she gets hurt and loses her friend. Her friend is stubborn and does not want to join her husband so let it be, as you have given your friend ample amount of counseling, the best thing is to pray for her and let God take control.
Yea, there is definitely something wrong with this relationship as they are not making God ,"Head of Household", they are doing their own separate thing, there is definitely something wrong at home if there is divisiveness in their individual church worship. I feel for the child as the child will suffer the most, thank heavens the child is only 2 right now, yes prayers are the only answer.
Last edited by perry335654; 09-27-2014 at 12:44 PM..
The discipling model sounds similar to the Alcoholics Anonymous model of having a sponsor to help you. As I understand it, an AA sponsor is farther along in the journey of being sober and is in a position to help the more junior person, who has no obligation to accept the sponsor's advice. It's there for the taking. I assume there's a difference between the AA and discipling partners. Discipling partners are there to guide each other through advice and support and that one isn't in a de facto position of being the lead guide--if my assumption about how they work is correct.
Do discipling partners have to take each other's advice? Are they on an equal footing in the relationship? Are they there to help each other without either person having veto power over the other? If so, this sounds healthier than Vizio's marriage model.
Do discipling partners have to take each other's advice? Are they on an equal footing in the relationship? Are they there to help each other without either person having veto power over the other? If so, this sounds healthier than Vizio's marriage model.
Please don't say it's "Vizio's marriage model". It's God's model. It's spelled out in scripture. If you don't like it......oh well.
Do you think a company would run well if there were no hierarchy of authority? Someone has to make decisions and be accountable.
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Originally Posted by perry335654
Because when there is not order than there is chaos. It doesn't mean one partner is better than the other it means there has to be a sense of stability in a household and that has to be one put in charge.
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Originally Posted by Vizio
I'll go with Perry's response. When you have more than 1 person calling the shots, things tend to not get done, or they go in different directions.
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Originally Posted by Ceist
Manager/subordinate then.
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Originally Posted by Vizio
Different roles.
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Originally Posted by Ceist
I'm saying that someone who does not know how to communicate/share in an equal relationship and can only cope if they are in charge and calling the shots, is emotionally/socially immature and selfish. Do you disagree with that?
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Originally Posted by Vizio
Of course! When have I suggested otherwise? Or are you posing a strawman argument to suggest that Christian men in general are incapable of doing so?
So are you saying that you agree that men who need to be the "chief", 'head of the household" "in charge" and "calling the shots" in a relationship are emotionally/socially immature and selfish?
I've also said nothing at all about Christian men in general.
Please don't say it's "Vizio's marriage model". It's God's model. It's spelled out in scripture. If you don't like it......oh well.
I can say "the marriage model Vizio promotes" instead, although it is your marriage model if you are choosing to take it as your own--regardless of why you choose that as your marriage model.
Yes, this marriage is not built on God being head of household as husband and wife want to do their own separate thing, if this is happening with the church divisiveness, it can't be to peachy keen at home either, sad thing and like I said mostly for the child.
Yes, this marriage is not built on God being head of household as husband and wife want to do their own separate thing, if this is happening with the church divisiveness, it can't be to peachy keen at home either, sad thing and like I said mostly for the child.
Too bad. If they were both atheists, they wouldn't even have this stupid problem.
You should ask God why he chose to create Adam first. But instead, you're blaming him for the sin of man for mistreating women.
I'm blaming God for not having the foresight to know that not creating Adam and Eve simultaneously would help fuel the idea that men are superior. Yeah, humanity might have messed it up, but that mess-up was a result of unclear scripture; it lacked any explanation of why Eve was created dead last aside from being a companion and helper to Adam. That essentially tossed women out of participating in life from the getgo.
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Originally Posted by Vizio
She was a helpmate and companion. Not a possession. I'm sorry if men have treated women otherwise. The Bible doesn't tell us to do so.
Perhaps not, but that is how it has been interpreted for thousands of years. Women are to be there for the husband. She should have no ambition for herself or for her own life. Her duty is to nurture and take care of hubby.
The problem is this stereotypical belief that women are all about nurturing, gentleness, emotion, maternal instincts, passivity, and servitude.
LOL! So how do you explain a person like me? I'm certainly not Suzy Homemaker, I don't appear to have any maternal instincts, I'm far more cerebral than I am emotional, I grew up rough so I am rough - at least around the edges. I'm more interested in the latest Chinese anti-ship missile than I am in shoes. I'd rather see action movies than tear-jerkers (I loathe chick-flicks ... boring!) and in so many ways I swear I have male DNA. If I ever got caught up in the traditional Christian family model, I'd probably slit my wrists.
Point being is that there cannot be a singular model for marriage - yet again, we argue the belief in absolutes. There can be no absolutely correct way to make a marriage succeed.
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Originally Posted by Vizio
Yet...it's still the fault of the person misinterpreting...not the author. You're blaming God for the failings of man. That's not really fair. Or honest.
That's ridiculous. Of course the author is culpable. Perhaps not 100% responsible, but he shares in the blame. I know you don't want God to be responsible for anything at all ... but we all know he is. At least if you're like we atheists and have the ability to pan the camera back and see the big picture.
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Originally Posted by Vizio
No. He isn't. The man is not Lord over a woman. He does not control every aspect of her life and give her orders on how to live in every area. The Bible doesn't suggest that he can do that.
Okay ... what does the Bible tell us to do if there is a deadlock? Let's say the husband wants to spend the family's tax returns (deposited into a joint account) on a gambling extravaganza in Las Vegas while the wife wants to spend the money on more practicle yet still fun things - perhaps a new home theater system. (All of this assumes that all other needs have been provided and this money truly is "extra" and can be spent this way).
Who gets to ultimately decide?
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Originally Posted by Vizio
As I've said...you have really misrepresented it.
It's not me who has misinterpreted it. Lots and lots and lots of conservative Christian men have misinterpreted it. I'm just going by what they say and do.
Believe me, I get where you're coming from in that you believe the Bible doesn't say that the husband is some autocratic dictator - and I'm glad that is your position. I'm just saying that there are a lot of guys out there who believe that the Bible DOES tell them to rule over their women - and I question why God would "divinely inspire" a Bible knowing the domestic hell many women would have to face because of vague or easily misinterpreted Bible verses.
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