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I think people have a choice to believe in any thing they want.
Nick:
True enough. However, there are times when choosing (consiously or sub-consiously) to believe "whatever you want" cound be detrimental to one's well being.
Regardless of how many times I hear R. Kelly sing I believe I can fly and watch Space Jam, Strolling off the Empire State Building because I choose not to believe in the law of gravity would lead my beliefs to conflict with reality. in the gamble between your beliefs and reality....bet on reality
Most certainly. I think the problem is that many people read the Bible within a vacuum also thinking the contents being read occurred within a vacuum.
I like the fact you mentioned 'political' because frankly, that is what it was. We often think of the various theological squabbles and wars that shaped the forming of the New Testament canon and forget that the same thing happened (in a sense) amongst the ancient Israelites. There was constant war between the nationalists (Yahweists) and those who sought to seduce the nation with foreign influence by way of foreign gods like Baal and Molech, for example. Those who won out wrote the story and the story was very simple. When we served Yahweh, we prospered and defeated our enemies. When we forsook him for other gods, we suffered and were humiliated and if we suffered and were humiliated, it must have been something we did wrong. There were poltical (read: monetary) gains to be made when you focused the people's attention on ONE god. One temple, one priesthood, one treasury to loot.
The ancient Israelites were indistinguishable from the other semitic nomadic, illiterate tribes that populated Palestine. They had the usual assortment of gods and goddesses that they worshiped, one of which was a sky god called Yaweah. Then they were conquered by the Assyrians in the 8th century BCE. In 597 BCE, Nebuchadnezzar conquered them and took some of the leaders to Babylon where they saw civilization for the first time. Along came Cyrus the Persian who conquered Babylon and rest of the mid east by 525 BCE. To bolster his hold on Palestine, the bible was written and restrictive laws created based on Persian ideas of how a subjected people should behave with the priests all powerful (except to Cyrus and his offspring). A bunch of the semitic slaves living in Babylon were sent to Palestine armed with this book and ruled by their priests who were beholden to the Persians to maintain their power. This is how the jewish people were created. The Persians held control over Palestine until Alexander the Great (Macedonian) conquered the Persian empire. Just about all of the biblical stories and theology were from the Persian ideas (Zoroastrianism especially). There never really was an independent jewish state until the modern Israel as there weren't really jews until they were created in Babylon and sent back (or for the first time for a lot of them) to Judea to hold the land for Cyrus.
That's the real history of Palestine and the creation of the Torah in the 6th century BCE. Once you learn the real history, the confusion that is the bible starts to make some sense. You can start to see why the one and only god had so many other gods to defeat. Satan and angels were a Zoroastrian creation and the whole theology was taken from it wholesale. (Never could understand how Satan and the angels who all had magical god powers just like the Greek or Egyptian pantheon had -but they were not gods. hmmmm)
The ancient Israelites were indistinguishable from the other semitic nomadic, illiterate tribes that populated Palestine. They had the usual assortment of gods and goddesses that they worshiped, one of which was a sky god called Yaweah. Then they were conquered by the Assyrians in the 8th century BCE. In 597 BCE, Nebuchadnezzar conquered them and took some of the leaders to Babylon where they saw civilization for the first time. Along came Cyrus the Persian who conquered Babylon and rest of the mid east by 525 BCE. To bolster his hold on Palestine, the bible was written and restrictive laws created based on Persian ideas of how a subjected people should behave with the priests all powerful (except to Cyrus and his offspring). A bunch of the semitic slaves living in Babylon were sent to Palestine armed with this book and ruled by their priests who were beholden to the Persians to maintain their power. This is how the jewish people were created. The Persians held control over Palestine until Alexander the Great (Macedonian) conquered the Persian empire. Just about all of the biblical stories and theology were from the Persian ideas (Zoroastrianism especially). There never really was an independent jewish state until the modern Israel as there weren't really jews until they were created in Babylon and sent back (or for the first time for a lot of them) to Judea to hold the land for Cyrus.
That's the real history of Palestine and the creation of the Torah in the 6th century BCE. Once you learn the real history, the confusion that is the bible starts to make some sense. You can start to see why the one and only god had so many other gods to defeat. Satan and angels were a Zoroastrian creation and the whole theology was taken from it wholesale. (Never could understand how Satan and the angels who all had magical god powers just like the Greek or Egyptian pantheon had -but they were not gods. hmmmm)
Very well written. Thank you. The part in bold is something most people are not interested in.
To place things in perspective a little more, if you read the Old Testament with a critical/objective eye, you will notice something. In the early part of Israelite history, they held to the idea that other gods existed, BUT only their god, Yahweh, was their worship reserved for, well at least that is what their holymen dictated. This is bound up in the commandment that ordered them to worship NO other god but Yahweh. Some have labeled this as henotheism, which holds to the belief that other gods exist, but only one is worthy of worship.
Further up in their history, like, around the time of the monarchy, we find a new wrinkle in the old belief. Yahweh was now not just another god amongst many. He was now the greatest of the gods (well in "kiss ass" fashion). We find ego-boosting prayers offered up to him being the greatest of the gods and how there is none greater than he amongst the gods in the heavens (one wonders if there are no other gods, why is Yahweh compared to other gods in the heavens?)
Then comes the time of the Babylonian captivity. It was the belief in the ancient world that a nation was only as strong as its god(s) and that gods went before their individual peoples in battle against other peoples and their gods. You won a war, this meant your god(s) was superior. You lost, your god was garbage. As a symbol of this, temple burning was popular to prove the total defeat of the gods of conquered nations. So where did this leave the Jews? Here they are by the "Rivers of Babylon" being jeered by the Babylonians, conquered, defeated, humiliated and placed in exile from their beloved land. Up pops a prophet in the exile to set the Babylonians straight and encourage his depressed people. I can hear him now, speaking out in reaction.
"Hey Babylonians! Let me tell you pagans something. We are not in your control because your gods were greater than ours. We're here because...um...because of our sins. Yeah, that's it! We did not follow his laws and that pissed him off so he allowed us to be humiliated to learn us a lesson. And come to think of it, he is a bigger god than all of your gods."
*Feeling like he's on a roll*
"Come to think of it, he is the creator of the entire universe and he sits upon the circle of the earth. And you know something, your gods don't even exist! They are actually the works of men's hands, nothing but silver, gold and wood. Our God is the ONLY God and the ONLY savior and besides him there is no other. He predicts the future and it comes to pass, so get your facts straight your heathen pigs! We're here on loan, not because you defeated us or our God!"
Thus we have the birth of modern Judaism and monotheism was thus born amongst the Jews. Took a few thousand years, but they arrived at that point.
To place things in perspective a little more, if you read the Old Testament with a critical/objective eye, you will notice something. In the early part of Israelite history, they held to the idea that other gods existed, BUT only their god, Yahweh, was their worship reserved for, well at least that is what their holymen dictated. This is bound up in the commandment that ordered them to worship NO other god but Yahweh. Some have labeled this as henotheism, which holds to the belief that other gods exist, but only one is worthy of worship.
Further up in their history, like, around the time of the monarchy, we find a new wrinkle in the old belief. Yahweh was now not just another god amongst many. He was now the greatest of the gods (well in "kiss ass" fashion). We find ego-boosting prayers offered up to him being the greatest of the gods and how there is none greater than he amongst the gods in the heavens (one wonders if there are no other gods, why is Yahweh compared to other gods in the heavens?)
Then comes the time of the Babylonian captivity. It was the belief in the ancient world that a nation was only as strong as its god(s) and that gods went before their individual peoples in battle against other peoples and their gods. You won a war, this meant your god(s) was superior. You lost, your god was garbage. As a symbol of this, temple burning was popular to prove the total defeat of the gods of conquered nations. So where did this leave the Jews? Here they are by the "Rivers of Babylon" being jeered by the Babylonians, conquered, defeated, humiliated and placed in exile from their beloved land. Up pops a prophet in the exile to set the Babylonians straight and encourage his depressed people. I can hear him now, speaking out in reaction.
"Hey Babylonians! Let me tell you pagans something. We are not in your control because your gods were greater than ours. We're here because...um...because of our sins. Yeah, that's it! We did not follow his laws and that pissed him off so he allowed us to be humiliated to learn us a lesson. And come to think of it, he is a bigger god than all of your gods."
*Feeling like he's on a roll*
"Come to think of it, he is the creator of the entire universe and he sits upon the circle of the earth. And you know something, your gods don't even exist! They are actually the works of men's hands, nothing but silver, gold and wood. Our God is the ONLY God and the ONLY savior and besides him there is no other. He predicts the future and it comes to pass, so get your facts straight your heathen pigs! We're here on loan, not because you defeated us or our God!"
Thus we have the birth of modern Judaism and monotheism was thus born amongst the Jews. Took a few thousand years, but they arrived at that point.
NOTE: This thread is linked to the other one over in the "Christianity" forum.
I figured you'd provide the answer
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