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have made a statement that indicates that you hate homosexuality. That is a 'personal hatred or resentment'. Nor do you seem to view gay people as 'equal human beings', or you wouldn't be shouting so loudly against marriage equality.
You want sin?
With that logic, you must personally hate Christians, huh? No, the truth is you NEED me to hate gays so you can villianize my position. I can certainly treat people with kindness and respect while at the same time being opposed to their lifestyle. I view them as equal human beings in the sense that we are all alike as people, we share the same emotions, ambitions and struggles in life. Sexual orientation is not an identity.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FredNotBob
Murder is a sin. Yet Christian fanatics bomb abortion clinics, murdering those within.
Theft is a sin. Of the estimated two million* people in the US prison system, seventy-four percent claim to be Christian.
And a true born again Christian would have a desire to love people, not murder or hurt them. Try again.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FredNotBob
Contrary to what you may think, you're not being 'persecuted'. You're being pitied, because you seem so scared that your life is going to come crashing down if a gay or lesbian couple are allowed to make the awesome, complex, and terrifying commitment to 'that one wonderful person'.
Persecution is a strong word, and I don't think I've ever taken the stance here that I am presently persecuted although being mocked and insulted by your side could probably fall into realm. that What I DO see is diminishing of freedom of religion and growing hostility exclusively against Christians. Just like the Bible predicted.
With that logic, you must personally hate Christians, huh? No, the truth is you NEED me to hate gays so you can villianize my position. I can certainly treat people with kindness and respect while at the same time being opposed to their lifestyle. I view them as equal human beings in the sense that we are all alike as people, we share the same emotions, ambitions and struggles in life. Sexual orientation is not an identity.
And a true born again Christian would have a desire to love people, not murder or hurt them. Try again.
Persecution is a strong word, and I don't think I've ever taken the stance here that I am presently persecuted although being mocked and insulted by your side could probably fall into realm. that What I DO see is diminishing of freedom of religion and growing hostility exclusively against Christians. Just like the Bible predicted.
Not really, I can villianize your position without ever mentioning gays...
With that logic, you must personally hate Christians, huh? No, the truth is you NEED me to hate gays so you can villianize my position. I can certainly treat people with kindness and respect while at the same time being opposed to their lifestyle. I view them as equal human beings in the sense that we are all alike as people, we share the same emotions, ambitions and struggles in life. Sexual orientation is not an identity.
And a true born again Christian would have a desire to love people, not murder or hurt them. Try again.
Persecution is a strong word, and I don't think I've ever taken the stance here that I am presently persecuted although being mocked and insulted by your side could probably fall into realm. that What I DO see is diminishing of freedom of religion and growing hostility exclusively against Christians. Just like the Bible predicted.
Jeff
You are mocked when you make silly claims such as the gays real agenda is to make Christianity illegal. You are mocked when you blame all the homosexuals because of what someone on this forum has posted and you misinterpreted but you fail to even acknowledge that Preachers are telling their flocks that gays should be jailed or stoned. If you didn't constantly come up with all kinds of reasons to deny gays full citizenship people might take you more seriously. I am sorry that it is going to cost you 3 cents more this year in taxes to pay for the new forms. Your fear that the government is going to force your church to perform same sex marriage is unfounded. Members of your church might but not the government. Some of us might even mock you for your demands that religious business owners get special rights.
If you simply stated that due to your religious beliefs you do not agree with it you should not be mocked, however you have used all kinds of arguments to try to justify using your beliefs to deny others civil rights. You may believe that you do not hate gays but from your words you either hate or fear them but probably do not even realize that you do. You need a break from posting about SSM. I am advising you not because I wish to shut you down but because I think you need a time out to actually reflect upon the fact that this ruling does not change homosexuals in any way other than they can make commitment that they were denied before, no new gays, no beginning of them having sex, heck not even the beginning of some of them getting married. All that changes is all of them now have the same rights as each other and as you have.
Your charge that I hate gay people is completely false. I hold no personal hatred or resentment towards a gay person. I view them as equal human beings, created by God as individuals with unique personalities and talents. I don't define a person by their sexual orientation. What I do hate is sin, and homosexuality is a sin. To deny this would be calling God a liar in his Holy Word.
Jesus showed love and acceptance to the downtrodden in his day, but He never said go and keep on sinning, my friend!
I have read this entire thread and I still don't see an answer to this question. What do you - Jeff- have to say about CHRISTIAN pastors who state - loudly and publicly - that gays should be stoned, shot, rounded up and put into camps or on desert islands and left to die? What do you say about that? Answer the question.
With that logic, you must personally hate Christians, huh? No, the truth is you NEED me to hate gays so you can villianize my position. I can certainly treat people with kindness and respect while at the same time being opposed to their lifestyle. I view them as equal human beings in the sense that we are all alike as people, we share the same emotions, ambitions and struggles in life. Sexual orientation is not an identity.
And once again, you are rationalizing discrimination. 'I view them as equal human beings, as long as they don't have the same rights that I do'.
You NEED to hate gays because without that hatred, the Bible verses you quote have no justification. If you acknowledge that we are all people and we share 'the same emotions, ambitions and struggles in life' then you must, by definition, also acknowledge that gay and lesbian couples have the right to marry and be happy.
Otherwise, sir, you are a hypocrite and a liar.
And for the record, I don't hate Christians. I hate the way certain Christian sects shove their religion into our faces and expect us to roll over and accept it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
And a true born again Christian would have a desire to love people, not murder or hurt them. Try again.
All right. How about a 'No true Scotsman' fallacy?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
Persecution is a strong word, and I don't think I've ever taken the stance here that I am presently persecuted although being mocked and insulted by your side could probably fall into realm. that What I DO see is diminishing of freedom of religion and growing hostility exclusively against Christians. Just like the Bible predicted.
Yes, it's a strong word. It applies. When a Christian church is told 'you can't put that sign up unless other religions get to put theirs up, too', what's the first thing they do?
They cry 'persecution'.
When a non-Christian is elected to public office, the first thing the Religious Right do is yell 'unfair' and demand they be removed.
And I've also noticed a great deal of hostility by 'your side' (your words, by the way -- very adversarial, don't you think?) against non-Christians.
You don't get to martyr yourself this time, Jeff. It's time to face the 'ugly truth': Christianity is not the 'king of the hill' any more, and it doesn't get to tell us how to live our lives.
I have read this entire thread and I still don't see an answer to this question. What do you - Jeff- have to say about CHRISTIAN pastors who state - loudly and publicly - that gays should be stoned, shot, rounded up and put into camps or on desert islands and left to die? What do you say about that? Answer the question.
Muslems do all that, not Christians yet Moderator cut: ... love Muslems and hate Christians.
Last edited by mensaguy; 07-02-2015 at 08:51 AM..
Reason: This is not the Politics forum.
Muslems do all that, not Christians yet Moderator cut: ... love Muslems and hate Christians.
The word hate is overused by many Christians.....No they don't hate Christians...Speaking for myself I do not respect what some Christians believe, say or do, but I don't hate them....The same applies to Muslims.
Last edited by mensaguy; 07-02-2015 at 08:52 AM..
Reason: Quoted post has been edited
No surprise, typical attack the source, not the content tactic.
That is rich coming from you after you suggested you would not take seriously ANY study that shows people are accepting homosexuality, for the sole reason ONE such study may have been faked. You do not only attack the source over the content, you are PRE attacking the source of all other such reports. So yea, you are the last person on this forum with a pedestal to admonish others about attacking the source. All that on top of your lie that the media ignored it while you yourself were quoting media articles about it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
What I do hate is sin, and homosexuality is a sin. To deny this would be calling God a liar in his Holy Word.
And what "sin" is is the rules of your particular club or hobby. It is not law. It is not morality. It is related to you and your PRIVATE religion only. So if homosexuality is a sin then you yourself should clearly not engage in any. But other people who are not you do not have to conform to this, put up with your militant attitude against them, or enshrine your personal archaic moral world view in law or PUBLIC institutions like Marriage.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
No, the truth is you NEED me to hate gays so you can villianize my position.
No such requirement exists as your position does this for itself. For example when you claim to be talking about homosexuals in general but you are discovered to be quoting twisted and warped facts related solely to a very specific subgroup of SSM. The propaganda, warping of statistics and facts, misquotations and outright fabrications are more than enough to belie the villainy of your position.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
Sexual orientation is not an identity.
Who are you to dictate where or from what people derive their personal identify from, exactly?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
What I DO see is diminishing of freedom of religion and growing hostility exclusively against Christians. Just like the Bible predicted.
Hardly a prediction of any merit. If anyone goes around espousing not only unsubstantiated nonsense, but using that unsubstantiated nonsense to stick their nose into other peoples business or curtail their secular public rights.... then it is hardly a miracle prediction to suggest people are going to become increasingly hostile towards such a group. Perhaps someone particularly prone to magical thinking is more prone to being impressed by such a "prediction" however, I would not know.
Not really, I can villianize your position without ever mentioning gays...
He 'villanizes' his own position all on his own.
He doesn't hate gays, he just hates that they are gay and wants them to pray to Jesus so they will magically become straight. Or he wants them live alone their whole lives, hiding that they are gay, or lying and pretending to be straight, and never ever be in a relationship with the person they love and want to spend their lives with.
He thinks that's just a 'disagreement' and it's gays who are intolerant because he just 'disagrees' with homosexuality. Is that about it?
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