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I would rather lead a fulfilling spiritual life, than a hypocritical religious life.
The church was full of some of the most hateful, bigoted, intolerant people that looking back on, I had ever met, but it was "ok" to be that way, because you gave your tithes and went to church on Sunday.
I think Bill and Ted summed up what people just need to do: Be excellent to each other.
This is correct because it applies to what YOU will or will not do. But when you try to judge OTHERS by what they will or will not do . . . you are adopting the role of God. That is a dangerous place to be. When you change how you treat them because of it . . . you are trying to coerce or enforce your view of God's standards on them. That is counterproductive because what God wants from us has to be VOLUNTARY. Anything you do to interfere with that voluntarism is against God's wishes.
Yet , if you are out of line compared to what standards I try to live by I will limit my fellowship with you. Why should I go to church with intruders of my moral?
Go start a religion where your standards allow it . I will stick to Gods standards.
I am left with no choice but to believe that I am different from the rest of creation .
The simple fact that I am capable of regret tells me this .
This is just one . But it is one that no matter how far away and animalistic my nature becomes I will always be capable of regret.
I'm not sure what you mean. Everyone is capable of regret. Whether particular regrets are justified or useful to have is another question.
I am fortunate to have always been true to the light I had at any given point in life, so I am basically free of regrets, which to me are basically the knowledge of failing to do the Right Thing as I know of it. Disappointments are another matter, particularly for an idealistic sort like myself, but regrets? No.
You seem to be elevating regret to having the ability to bear witness that we are "something more" than a "mere animal". This begs several questions, including that it denies the simple fact that we ARE animals ... with particular capabilities and more self aware and capable of nuanced communication than any others we are currently aware of ... but animals nevertheless.
You aren't entirely wrong here, though, because regret requires an awareness of past and future that most animals are blissfully disconnected from. Many ... eastern mystics for instance ... would say this is a Bad Thing, in fact, they'd say that it is the source of all human suffering. You can't be attached to particular outcomes, or regretful of the past, or fearful of the future, unless your awareness is not focused on the present moment.
The church, when I was in it, did not teach me any of these things. Quite the opposite, really. It posited a perfect world in which there was theological correctness, reward and punishment, moral objectivity and clarity, but failed to deliver on any of those things as it all proved to be entirely subjective and devoid of substantiation. When you completely deconstruct fundamentalist ideology it consists of nothing but unsubstantiated (and largely unsubstantiatable) assertions.
No you will not. You will stick with your personal opinion about what god's standards are ... either genuinely your personal opinion or one borrowed from others. Because god is invisible, and has never spoken for himself ... people wrote down his supposed standards and claimed god inspired them to do it. And then generation after generation of their descendants argued about what those writings actually mean.
As such, anyone claiming to speak for god ... not to put too fine a point on it ... is a liar. Quite often lying to themselves and so can't be honest with others ... but lying nonetheless.
This is correct because it applies to what YOU will or will not do. But when you try to judge OTHERS by what they will or will not do . . . you are adopting the role of God. That is a dangerous place to be. When you change how you treat them because of it . . . you are trying to coerce or enforce your view of God's standards on them. That is counterproductive because what God wants from us has to be VOLUNTARY. Anything you do to interfere with that voluntarism is against God's wishes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by clickstack
Yet , if you are out of line compared to what standards I try to live by I will limit my fellowship with you. Why should I go to church with intruders of my moral?
Go start a religion where your standards allow it . I will stick to Gods standards.
Because Christ said to love one another as He loves us. How is shunning or banning or shaming or otherwise trying to coerce them showing Christ's love for them??? If you have not love . . . nothing you do satisfies God.
I was brought up in a Jewish/Christian household. I was baptized when I was 10 in the Episcopal Church and confirmed at age 13. Most of my adult life, I was never really a church goer. I would go once in while. But, when I was about 26 or so, I started to realize that I didn't exactly believe the Church teachings. I started to see the hypocrisy of what was being taught. I remember once going to my mother's church for Christmas service. I always thought that it was "Good will toward men" but this priest said, "Good will towards the chosen ones." WHAT???!!!!! So only certain people get the good will? That totally turned me off. I'm not saying that is what did it but that was just one element. I was also studying history-and ancient mythology. I started to see the historical aspect of the Bible as well as the mythology of it. There are many stories in the Bible that are taken from ancient mythology of other cultures-Egyptian, Mesopotamia as well as others.
Then in my early 30s, I guess you say that I "converted." Yes, I am a Born Again Pagan. However, I do believe that Jesus did live. I believe he was like the Martin Luther King of his day-a preacher. But he was a man. I also believe that he was married to Mary Magdalene-who was also his partner. I heard somewhere that they had a daughter named Sarah. (Yeah, I know that is blasphemy.) Somewhere along the way, someone decided to discredit Mary and made her a prostitute.
Most of the stories of Jesus can be attributed to Paul who was a storyteller-who embellished his stories like all storytellers do. Then the others (John, George, Ringo...oops, wrong guys. lol) used Paul's stories and basically rewrote them. That is why the Gospels seem to tell a similar story. I also believe that there is a kernel or truth in the Bible. But a lot of it is just stories and myths.
No you will not. You will stick with your personal opinion about what god's standards are ... either genuinely your personal opinion or one borrowed from others. Because god is invisible, and has never spoken for himself ... people wrote down his supposed standards and claimed god inspired them to do it. And then generation after generation of their descendants argued about what those writings actually mean.
As such, anyone claiming to speak for god ... not to put too fine a point on it ... is a liar. Quite often lying to themselves and so can't be honest with others ... but lying nonetheless.
God himself puts his standards in my heart.
And I have chosen to be sensitive to his voice and heed it. This brings me back to saying just because you have no idea what a cellphone is does not make you correct by stateing there is no such thing as a 4g signal simply because you can't see it.
Because Christ said to love one another as He loves us. How is shunning or banning or shaming or otherwise trying to coerce them showing Christ's love for them??? If you have not love . . . nothing you do satisfies God.
That would abligate me to fellowship with Isis, gays , a prostitude , the list goes on .
You need to figure out what the word love means . God loves , yet he will not allow filth into his kingdom and neither will I allow it into mine.
I would rather lead a fulfilling spiritual life, than a hypocritical religious life.
The church was full of some of the most hateful, bigoted, intolerant people that looking back on, I had ever met, but it was "ok" to be that way, because you gave your tithes and went to church on Sunday.
I think Bill and Ted summed up what people just need to do: Be excellent to each other.
Why would you blame God for the misrepresentation humans give of him?
I can't blame him any more for there actions then I can blame him of yours.
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