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The specific part of the speech by UK PM David Cameron
20-07-2015
This part start at 1:01:08
"This is an significant shift in the government approach and important.
In the past governments has been quick to dismiss the religious aspect of Islamic extremism. That is totally understandable - it cannot be said clearly enough the extremist ideology is not true Islam.
I have said that myself many many times and it right to do so and I'll say it again today.
But here is the important point; Simply denying any connection between the religion of Islam and the extremists doesn't work because these extremists are self-identifying as Muslims.
The fact from Woolwich to Tunisia, from Ottawa to Bali, these murderous extremists all spout the same twisted narrative on the claim it is based on a particular faith.
Now it is an exercise of futility to deny that, and more than that, it can be dangerous. To deny it has anything to do with Islam mean you disempower the critical reforming voices;
-the voices that are challenging the fusing of religions and poverty,
-the voices that are challenging the scriptural basis which the extremists are claiming to be acting -
-the voices that are crucial in providing an alternative world view that can stop a teenager's slide along the spectrum of extremism."
1:02:28
Agree?
Even if David Cameron is getting nearer to the root cause of Islamic evils and violence, i.e. recognizing Islam itself is part of the problem, from what I read so far, I don't see them getting the proximate root causes.
Unless we deal with the precise and proximate root cause of Islamic evils and violence, holy violence and evils could only get worse. At present ISIS is beginning to use WMDs, i.e. poison gas and one can guess it can only get worse into the future.
There was another post that pointed out that Putin, ex Stalinist turned defender of the faith is also part of the problem. I see religion as the problem and Cameron with his liking for faith schools (if only because he doesn't have to pay for them) is also part of the problem.
It seems to me that we need a secular worldview with secular politicians and wondering just what it is we had been fighting about.
The specific part of the speech by UK PM David Cameron
20-07-2015
This part start at 1:01:08
"This is an significant shift in the government approach and important.
In the past governments has been quick to dismiss the religious aspect of Islamic extremism. That is totally understandable - it cannot be said clearly enough the extremist ideology is not true Islam.
I have said that myself many many times and it right to do so and I'll say it again today.
But here is the important point; Simply denying any connection between the religion of Islam and the extremists doesn't work because these extremists are self-identifying as Muslims.
The fact from Woolwich to Tunisia, from Ottawa to Bali, these murderous extremists all spout the same twisted narrative on the claim it is based on a particular faith.
Now it is an exercise of futility to deny that, and more than that, it can be dangerous. To deny it has anything to do with Islam mean you disempower the critical reforming voices;
-the voices that are challenging the fusing of religions and poverty,
-the voices that are challenging the scriptural basis which the extremists are claiming to be acting -
-the voices that are crucial in providing an alternative world view that can stop a teenager's slide along the spectrum of extremism."
1:02:28
Agree?
Even if David Cameron is getting nearer to the root cause of Islamic evils and violence, i.e. recognizing Islam itself is part of the problem, from what I read so far, I don't see them getting the proximate root causes.
Unless we deal with the precise and proximate root cause of Islamic evils and violence, holy violence and evils could only get worse. At present ISIS is beginning to use WMDs, i.e. poison gas and one can guess it can only get worse into the future.
Religion is the problem. PERIOD! The sooner people can be convinced to stop living in a world of make believe, the sooner we can all begin to work together to solve the problems of THIS world.
I would encourage watching the film Bajrangi Bhaijaan. While not excusing Islam of its violence, it gives very good insight as to some of the causes to violence:
Largely impoverished culture living on the outskirts.
Intense blame of others for the problems of their religion (this is not their fault, but rather a side-effect of not being able to question their own scripture. If their own scripture cannot be questioned, they have done nothing wrong if others hate and persecute them)
Not being able to vent or question their scripture (When you cannot vent about what happens to you, anger only festers)
Self-imposed isolation (Like the Jews, being a separate people means they never feel at home anywhere. But The situation is worse because Islam is encouraged to proselytize, giving them a reputation as invaders)
In short, they have a religion that does not allow them to blend or compromise their faith, to the point where everyone is an enemy. This includes people who share similar beliefs, such as Jews and Christians. They have relative poverty and backwards culture when compared with the rest of the world, and a feeling that nobody wants them. And a culture that basically urges them to fight back against this.
Ideally, if they could see other people as brothers/sisters, this would be a lot easier. But it hasn't happened yet. The film created such an ideal scenario (where a young Muslim girl is adopted by a Hindu family, until they discover she is from Pakistan, and the guy out of love and duty tries to return her home), one that I'd love to see happen.
Religion is the problem. PERIOD! The sooner people can be convinced to stop living in a world of make believe, the sooner we can all begin to work together to solve the problems of THIS world.
It is OK as according to ... scripture the nations will soon turn on all religions to destroy them. End of one problem.
Religion is the problem. PERIOD! The sooner people can be convinced to stop living in a world of make believe, the sooner we can all begin to work together to solve the problems of THIS world.
I agree. However it cannot be that soon because religion-in-general is a critical necessity for the majority to deal with an inherent UNAVOIDABLE existential dilemma embedded in the human DNA/RNA. Religion unfortunately is the most effective balm to relieve the associated psychological angst.
Whilst religion has a critical pro, its con is - even the so-called mild religion, e.g. Buddhism has its own share of scandals, scams and monks cheating its followers.
Since the existential dilemma is a sort of fixed and almost permanent, the only way to wean off religions is humanity need to find net-positive alternatives and substitutes to deal with the existential dilemma.
Whilst awaiting for replacements the focus should be dealing with worst of the lot, i.e. Islam-in-part where SOME of its believers are committing the worst evils at present.
In the past all world leaders will declare Islam has nothing to do with Islamic-related terrorism.
So this move by Cameron in recognizing Islam as part of the problem is a good start.
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