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Specially blessed? Maybe. I'm pretty sure I would consider it a blessing to have a personal relationship with the creator of the universe. Superior? I would think, rather, grateful. But, I don't know for sure, of course.
That's sad about both your sister-in-law's and your aunt's mental illnesses. It doesn't have anything to do with the subject at hand, though, which is you broad-brushing all of Christianity based on your beef with fundamentalist, evangelical Christianity.
Do you personally believe that Jesus died, that his corpse came back to life on the third day, and that he physically flew up into the sky and disappeared into the clouds? This story is either completely true, or believing that it actually occurred represents a psychotic break with reality. There's no real middle ground. Now, let's re-enforce the question of which side one falls on with the fact that that the flying reanimated corpse group also have regular conversations with invisible friends. Are non believers entirely out of line for making an issue of these apparent symptoms of psychosis? Or are the non believers out of line, simply as a fact of currently holding a minority opinion? The world is rife with many varied and often conflicting religious beliefs. Could the entire world be wrong? Or are the non believers on to something which represent aspects of a valid objection?
Last edited by Tired of the Nonsense; 07-27-2015 at 04:12 PM..
Do you personally believe that Jesus died, that his corpse came back to life on the third day, and that he physically flew up into the sky and disappeared into the clouds?
No.
Quote:
This story is either completely true, or believing that it actually occurred represents a psychotic break with reality. There's no real middle ground.
A psychotic break? Are you a psychiatrist? Here's the deifnition I found of a psychotic break:
Psychosis is a symptom or feature of mental illness typically characterized by radical changes in personality, impaired functioning, and a distorted or nonexistent sense of objective reality.
Are you under the impression that Christians (or people of any religious persuasion), overall, have impaired functioning simply because they believe in God?
Quote:
Now, let's re-enforce the question of which side one falls on with the fact that that the flying reanimated corpse group also have regular conversations with invisible friends.
I talk to invisible friends, too, pretty regularly. Sometimes it's a loved one who has passed. Sometimes it's just, "to whom it may concern". I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility that there actually might be someone listening, though I'm on the fence about it. Does that negatively impact you in any way?
Quote:
Are non believers entirely out of line for making an issue of these apparent symptoms of psychosis? Or are the non believers out of line, simply as a fact of currently holding a minority opinion? The world is rife with many varied and often conflicting religious beliefs. Could the entire world be wrong? Or are the non believers on to something?
Are non-believers, in general, under the impression that those who believe in a God (in general) are showing symptoms of psychosis? I mean, go ahead and make an issue of it if you all want, but maybe you could answer the question I posed to Freak: How does someone believing in God negatively affect you (other than those who try to impose those beliefs on you)?
Nope. They are simply lined up in another one, and have their own beliefs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zthatzmanz28
Just as the extremists saying they represent Islam, the extremists claiming to represent Christianity go proselytizing for a GREATER REWARD from God in the here-after
This is true of the religion of Israel as well. Seems like there are those who look down their noses and think themselves rather special in relation to other practitioners of same named religious belief systems.
They think they are representing what they believe is the 'true' nature of what the religion is, and this has a ripple effect on those who are far less fanatical about their beliefs.
the whole trip is boring to watch. Because it is same old same old with the poor ghetto dwellers on the receiving end of any hostility caused by this dogmatism.
Boring isn;t the word (that is the word for the continual bickering between theists and atheists) - the better word is 'sad'. Soulfully so...
Last edited by Rotagivan; 07-27-2015 at 04:19 PM..
Personally, I think when someone has had a direct experience of the Divine...
(sometimes that happens in NDEs)....they are calmer and more mellow...
because they 'see'...everything is fine...all in it's good time..
everyone has their own path.
I must admit I feel bad when I see a friend repeatedly make poor choices and
and be so unhappy for decades...I say a little about diff choices and then shut-up.
Not my job...they know the shpeel...if they want to go into the 'God direction'
they know they have that option.
Or when your entire congregation votes as a block because your priest or pastor has said that is how God wants you to vote. Or when you make an effort to vote your church members onto a school board for the purpose of replacing accepted consensus science with religiously contrived pseudo-science. Or when you declare that it a violation of your religious freedom when someone else chooses a lifestyle that you do not approve of. Or when you have a big smug knowing smile on your faces.
I thought we were talking about religion not liberals? sorry my bad. So you are right, all groups that think for its members is a problem. That's why I like agnostic when push comes to shove. It's the only group that admits what they don't know and understands what they do.
A psychotic break? Are you a psychiatrist? Here's the deifnition I found of a psychotic break:
Psychosis is a symptom or feature of mental illness typically characterized by radical changes in personality, impaired functioning, and a distorted or nonexistent sense of objective reality.
Psychosis
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Psychosis refers to an abnormal condition of the mind described as involving a "loss of contact with reality". People with psychosis are described as psychotic. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychosis
Dictionary.com is much more graphic.
psychotic
[sahy-kot-ik]
adjective
1. Psychiatry. characterized by or afflicted with psychosis.
Synonyms: (in nontechnical usage) insane, psychopathic, lunatic, mentally ill; mad, disturbed, deranged, demented, non compos mentis.
2.Psychiatry. of or relating to psychosis: psychotic symptoms;
psychotic delusion.
3.(loosely) mentally unstable:
The man who threw a stone through the convenience store window must be psychotic.
Synonyms: loony, crazy, nutty, nuts, bonkers; kooky, cuckoo, daft, batty, screwy, potty. Psychotic | Define Psychotic at Dictionary.com
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pleroo
Are you under the impression that Christians (or people of any religious persuasion), overall, have impaired functioning simply because they believe in God?
Think of all the people living in the middle ages who were terrified to go out at night because they believed that devils and demons roamed the nighttime darkness. During the various plagues I think it is fair to say that those who did not die were completely insane by our standards. Think of the thousands of women and little girls that were tortured to death during the European witch trials during the 15th to 18th centuries. Between 50,000 and 100,000 women were killed. Whole areas were nearly denuded of women. This was a result of taking religious psychosis to it's logical conclusion.
Certainly plenty of modern religious people are reasonably stable and quite high functioning. But the seeds of madness are unavoidably planted within in the disconnect from reality. All that needs occur is for that disconnect to be followed to it's conclusion. Fundamentalists are well along that path. Consider how far along the path the Westboro Baptist Church group is. Then consider the Heaven's Gate group. They took Christian teachings to a whole new level of psychosis. How far down the path of psychotic delusion a believer chooses to wander depends on how thoroughly indoctrinated they allow themselves to become, and how obsessed they become with their belief. I suspect you have many examples you can think of.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pleroo
I talk to invisible friends, too, pretty regularly. Sometimes it's a loved one who has passed. Sometimes it's just, "to whom it may concern". I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility that there actually might be someone listening, though I'm on the fence about it.
That you retain some skepticism is hopeful. It's when you start hearing them answer back that you really need to worry.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pleroo
Are non-believers, in general, under the impression that those who believe in a God (in general) are showing symptoms of psychosis? I mean, go ahead and make an issue of it if you all want, but maybe you could answer the question I posed to Freak: How does someone believing in God negatively affect you (other than those who try to impose those beliefs on you).
I can't speak for all non believers. But I suspect that yes, in varying degrees many secretly do, even though they don't like to admit it.
The best way to answer your question is to pose a question. Do you suppose that it would affect you in ways great and small if you lived in a society where 75-80% of the population believed, to one degree or another, in the existence of the Easter Bunny? At what point would you begin to become fed up with that sort of unreasoning nonsense? Especially when people with beliefs in opposing Easter Bunnies began to fly planes into buildings and commit other psychotic acts of terror? Would you start to think that it was time for the insanity to be exposed and put to rest once and for all?
Psychosis refers to an abnormal condition of the mind described as involving a "loss of contact with reality". People with psychosis are described as psychotic. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychosis
Dictionary.com is much more graphic.
psychotic
[sahy-kot-ik]
adjective
1. Psychiatry. characterized by or afflicted with psychosis.
Synonyms: (in nontechnical usage) insane, psychopathic, lunatic, mentally ill; mad, disturbed, deranged, demented, non compos mentis.
2.Psychiatry. of or relating to psychosis: psychotic symptoms;
psychotic delusion.
3.(loosely) mentally unstable:
The man who threw a stone through the convenience store window must be psychotic.
Synonyms: loony, crazy, nutty, nuts, bonkers; kooky, cuckoo, daft, batty, screwy, potty. Psychotic | Define Psychotic at Dictionary.com
Think of all the people living in the middle ages who were terrified to go out at night because they believed that devils and demons roamed the nighttime darkness. During the various plagues I think it is fair to say that those who did not die were completely insane by our standards. Think of the thousands of women and little girls that were tortured to death during the European witch trials during the 15th to 18th centuries. Between 50,000 and 100,000 women were killed. Whole areas were nearly denuded of women. This was a result of taking religious psychosis to it's logical conclusion.
Certainly plenty of modern religious people are reasonably stable and quite high functioning. But the seeds of madness are unavoidably planted within in the disconnect from reality. All that needs occur is for that disconnect to be followed to it's conclusion. Fundamentalists are well along that path. Consider how far along the path the Westboro Baptist Church group is. Then consider the Heaven's Gate group. They took Christian teachings to a whole new level of psychosis. How far down the path of psychotic delusion a believer chooses to wander depends on how thoroughly indoctrinated they allow themselves to become, and how obsessed they become with their belief. I suspect you have many examples you can think of.
That you retain some skepticism is hopeful. It's when you start hearing them answer back that you really need to worry.
I can't speak for all non believers. But I suspect that yes, in varying degrees many secretly do, even though they don't like to admit it.
The best way to answer your question is to pose a question. Do you suppose that it would affect you in ways great and small if you lived in a society where 75-80% of the population believed, to one degree or another, in the existence of the Easter Bunny? At what point would you begin to become fed up with that sort of unreasoning nonsense? Especially when people with beliefs in opposing Easter Bunnies began to fly planes into buildings and commit other psychotic acts of terror? Would you start to think that it was time for the insanity to be exposed and put to rest once and for all?
the problem is that "no-nothing" (stating we probably are not part of an higher order) counters observations. so holding to that belief is just as silly as Omni dude. Just as "delusional", because it is not real.
now being anti-big-religion is one thing. Holding to a belief system that counters observation and claiming it is more logical is another. Its Omni-dude against spaghetti monster. They are not real.
I looked deeply at religion in the past. It is not so black and white as many seem to think here.
I think there is a definite envy for anyone that isn't desperately searching for answers about faith, those that have settled and are at peace with their beliefs. This seems to torment some to no end. If someone is trying to convert you and you don't want to be converted, avoid them and this applies to all facets of your life not just religion.
There is this strange paranoia toward Christians these days and it isn't a disease so you won't catch it so relax, be happy! Weird to have a fear and paranoia and beyond my understanding.
Specially blessed? Maybe. I'm pretty sure I would consider it a blessing to have a personal relationship with the creator of the universe. Superior? I would think, rather, grateful. But, I don't know for sure, of course.
That's sad about both your sister-in-law's and your aunt's mental illnesses. It doesn't have anything to do with the subject at hand, though, which is you broad-brushing all of Christianity based on your beef with fundamentalist, evangelical Christianity.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tired of the Nonsense
Do you personally believe that Jesus died, that his corpse came back to life on the third day, and that he physically flew up into the sky and disappeared into the clouds? This story is either completely true, or believing that it actually occurred represents a psychotic break with reality. There's no real middle ground. Now, let's re-enforce the question of which side one falls on with the fact that that the flying reanimated corpse group also have regular conversations with invisible friends. Are non believers entirely out of line for making an issue of these apparent symptoms of psychosis? Or are the non believers out of line, simply as a fact of currently holding a minority opinion? The world is rife with many varied and often conflicting religious beliefs. Could the entire world be wrong? Or are the non believers on to something which represent aspects of a valid objection?
All amateur would-be psychiatrists and armchair psychologists in this forum need to put a sock in it. Having irrational beliefs is NOT an indication of psychosis or mental illness.
the problem is that "no-nothing" (stating we probably are not part of an higher order) counters observations. so holding to that belief is just as silly as Omni dude. Just as "delusional", because it is not real.
now being anti-big-religion is one thing. Holding to a belief system that counters observation and claiming it is more logical is another. Its Omni-dude against spaghetti monster. They are not real.
Yes
Also obsessing about the one religion and its past misconducts is counter-productive and tends to speak volumes about the one doing so.
Witches are not getting burned alive by monsters calling themselves Christians, in today's world and there are adequate laws in place to punish monsters (whatever they call themselves) and that is as far as civilization allows us to act.
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