Fundy county clerk ordered to issue marriage licenses (experiences, Muslims, quote)
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If you attack the Bible and Christian beliefs, yea I kinda see that as being anti-Christian. The really disturbing thing is that most people here had no problem at all with this woman being tossed in jail because of her faith. That tells me that the same indifference would exist if all Bible believing Christians were thrown in prison.
Location: In a little house on the prairie - literally
10,202 posts, read 7,901,088 times
Reputation: 4561
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
And yet in the real world, thousands of people are still coming to Christ. You are the one living in a fantasy world.
No as I've posted many times before from factual places including the Southern Baptist conference, that church attendance is declining, church membership is declining, church weddings are declining, and Church baptism are declining.
You've argued on those threads also so I know you know about them.
The only one living in a fantasy world with imaginary friends is the one that you keep holding dear as a hobby.
It won't end there because this is about forcing everyone in society including Kim Davis to deny their faith and support homosexuality.
More of your false persecution narrative. It is "about" nothing of the sort. It is "about" enforcing secular law and not giving people special privilege, or exemption from the law, because of what religion they claim.
It really is that simple. You just contrive to act like you do not get it.
Again: Her job description before the SSM ruling was to check that applicants meet the legal criteria to receive a licence. Her job description after the SSM ruling is to check that applicants meet the legal criteria to receive a licence.
If she can not, or will not, do that job she should lose it. If she is in contempt of court, she should be jailed.
Simple as. Get. Over. It.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
Saying she should just shut up and get another job glosses over the fact that religious freedom has been violated.
No. It has not. YOUR misrepresentation of what "Freedom of Religion" means may be violated. But we do not judge it by your falsehoods. We judge it by what it _actually_ means.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
The bottom line is you are demanding that I accept the secular beliefs that SSM is equal to heterosexual marriage and I reject that belief.
Again more of your persecution narrative, pretending it is all about you when it is not. All we want people to accept is that secular law is secular law, and you do not get special privileges, or special exemptions, in that law by citing your religion.
What you actually think of SSM, or what you accept, is irrelevant to that. You can accept or reject what you like so long as you conform to secular law. So can Kim Davis.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
Almost a 1,000 replies and the vast majority being anti-Christian. Really sad.
Still with the persecution narrative. There are hardly any anti-christian views on this thread at all. What there is is people commenting on the bad actions of people who incidentally are also christian. ENTIRELY different. But your on going persecution narrative requires you to pretend that any disagreement with you, is actually an affront to your religion. Get over yourself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
The really disturbing thing is that most people here had no problem at all with this woman being tossed in jail because of her faith.
I would be up in arms and rushing to the front lines ahead of you if any such thing ever happened.
The reality is that no such thing has happened here. The woman was jailed for breaking the law and being in contempt of court. It is you making it about her faith and her hobby.
No, it was an incorrect interpretation, or rather an addition to the law. There's nothing in the 14th amendment that specifically says gay marriages must be recognized. Plus their interpretation completely stomped on state rights like Kentucky which currently has a law that doesn't support gay marriage. If we treat the Supreme Court's ruling as the gospel truth then you lose any right to object to ANY kind of marriage union.
The only thing you are showing here is that your own biased perspective so obviously, Christians are ALWAYS going to appear in the wrong. Saying it is a waste of time to fight this law is only your biased opinion. And tsunami of support? Sorry but people don't immediately change their morals overnight. At least half the country does not accept SSM, and may people don't accept it in countries where it's been legal for years.
My morality is based on the Word of God which has outlasted generations of men, some very intelligent men who thought their law of the day was true the moral standard. If you look to the government to set the moral standard then you are embracing a society of conflict and unecessary complications. I said it before, this won't end with gay marriage. Gay people got everything they claimed to want with the June ruling, but that's not good enough. It won't end there because this is about forcing everyone in society including Kim Davis to deny their faith and support homosexuality.
Loosen those tighty-whiteys.\\
Just like the civil rights movement did not force y'all to accept EQUALITY based on race (it is still a choice) the SSM will not force y'all to accept SEXUAL EQUALITY either.
You will still be free to believe and privately practice discrimination. What you will no longer be able to do is PUBLICLY HUMILIATE or SHAME others based on SEXUAL ORIENTATION and blatantly practice BIGOTRY in public circles or when doing business.
And who threw a fit because they couldn't get a marriage license at one specific office? Heaven forbid they have to drive a few miles down the road somewhere else. Who threw a fit because they couldn't get a wedding cake from one particular baker?
The government entities tasked with enforcing the law are the ones who "threw a fit" in these cases. That's their job, you know. What's your point?
Because freedom of religion is the law too. Once you start forcing people to make restrictions on their beliefs or punishing them then it all comes crashing down.
Killing witches and disobedient children, keeping slaves, practicing polygamy and all sort of "traditional" religious practices are all illegal and yet religion still thrives. They'll survive having to treat certain minorities equally just as well. Heck, the religions are still free to discriminate against them as much as they want. The members of those regions just have to take a break from the discrimination while they're working at their day jobs.
No, it was an incorrect interpretation, or rather an addition to the law. There's nothing in the 14th amendment that specifically says gay marriages must be recognized.
Just like there's nothing in the 14th amendment that specifically says that states can't force their citizens to convert to a certain religion. Religion isn't mentioned in there at all. But the courts have ruled that a reasonable interpretation of that amendment would mean such an action is illegal. Same with their ruling on the illegality of restricting SSM. Can't have one without the other - if you're going to pretend that religious freedom without government interference at any level is part of the law you're relying on "judicial activism" just as much as anyone else.
Quote:
If we treat the Supreme Court's ruling as the gospel truth then you lose any right to object to ANY kind of marriage union.
I'd be curious which part of the ruling you're talking about which specifically allows ANY type of marriage. For someone who seems to want others to stick to the strict literal wording of a law, you seem to be making quite a few jumps to things which aren't in the text. You need to make up your mind on which approach is correct and get back to us.
Quote:
The only thing you are showing here is that your own biased perspective so obviously, Christians are ALWAYS going to appear in the wrong.
Perhaps you should think a bit more on why you would say this. Perhaps deep down you realize your crusade against certain minorities is morally wrong and glimmers of understanding such as this occasionally
surface.
No as I've posted many times before from factual places including the Southern Baptist conference, that church attendance is declining, church membership is declining, church weddings are declining, and Church baptism are declining.
You've argued on those threads also so I know you know about them.
The only one living in a fantasy world with imaginary friends is the one that you keep holding dear as a hobby.
1. God is not imaginary despite your bold talk.
2. Christianity is not a hobby.
3. Just because people have dropped out of church doesn't mean they are converting to atheism.
4. I've pointed out earlier that Pew Research has some skeletons in the closet and other polls report different findings. In fact, these scholars don't agree with these surveys that say Christianity is in rapid decline:
Quote:
While mainline Protestant denominations have declined 49 percent from 1960 to 2000, evangelicals and other religious groups have grown at a faster rate, according to Johnson. Religious "switching," or people moving from one tradition to another is not being considered by many researchers and reporters.
The Baylor Religion Survey explores the nuances and complexities of how people self-identify with faith and asks follow-up questions of people who indicated "no religion." Many of these same people identified with specific congregations.
"When they do list a church, it's often high-octane religion such as non-denominational evangelical congregations," said Johnson.
A recent Pew Survey, pointed to the decline of the Christian population in the U.S. The drop in the number of Christians was most evident among young adults.
The data, which examined religious affiliation from 2007 to 2014 showed that the shrinking population of Christians in the U.S. was due to the decline of Catholics and mainline Protestants. The number of people identifying as Evangelicals saw a very small decrease during those years dropping from 26.3 percent to 25.4 percent.
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