Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Maybe you could rebut the actual arguments made, rather than the strawman arguments which are easy, in this very thread. Otherwise, it's lazy of you.
Nice job of reading. Actually I did address that directly in my first paragraph, thanks. But I also took exception to the OP's own straw man argument that, somehow, government agencies are doing a bang-up job of helping the poor, obviating the web of services provided by churches. You know, that's why my second paragraph in my response actually began with the word, "Second."
I don't think anyone has said that they don't do some good work. Most here are saying that there are also none religious organisations that do just as much good work...but don't get a tax break for it like the church does. I'm also saying that there is invariably an agenda to the actions of the church.. i.e 'come and join us'.
I work with a number of non-profits, several of which own their own buildings, chiefly because it makes greater financial sense for them. They do not pay a dime in taxes. One is a homeless shelter. Another is a musical organization. Another is about rehabilitating wildlife. Why should they have to pay property taxes?
Let's do this. So we don't just make this another tedious attack on religious faith through the tax codes, let's substitute a different organization on the original post: The symphony orchestra, the local amateur theater company, the American Red Cross, or whatever other non-profit is out there. Because unless you're going to take on every non-profit in the country, then you certainly can't target your local church.
Second, if you don't think churches don't perform a great deal of good, then you're delusional. The very large majority of churches have active outreach programs to help the poor and the disenfranchised. Heck, my mid-sized Episcopal church does the following:
• Along with a couple of other nearby churches, offers meals for the homeless.
• Offers a shelter for homeless families.
• Has a GED program.
• Operates a month-long summer day camp in an impoverished rural county.
• A summer camp for those with developmental challenges.
• Food drives.
• Clothing drives.
• A nutritional clinic in Haiti.
• A ministry that rehabilitates appliances for the poor.
• Habitat for Humanity homes.
• Support for families facing emergencies at the nearby children's hospital.
• A women's shelter.
• Charitable stipends to about a dozen area charities.
And those are just the things I can think of right off the bat. Maybe you should bother checking into what churches do before actually condemning them. It's lazy of you.
Good for them. They should be able to do all of that and pay property taxes, too. Just like the rest of us.
And again, My wifes company came to this community brought 8,000 jobs just in the main plant, that doesn't count outside suppliers, and at least 1,000 families from other states. Why does your church deserve to pay no taxes when businesses and families do?
It is not hostility to ask for churches to be treated the same as everyone else.
I'd be willing to guess that the budget at your partner's job is a whole lot larger than the one at my church.
Good for them. They should be able to do all of that and pay property taxes, too. Just like the rest of us.
You're not a very informed person. Non-profits, regardless of their nature, do not pay property taxes as long as they meet specific governmental guidelines. The reason for this is simple. They leverage resources to achieve good in the community in ways that government simply could not. If you insisted on non-profits paying property taxes, you could look forward to a huge number of non-profits closing up shop, including those that aren't even remotely religious.
I suppose what's driving this is the notion that churches actually make money. Oh, I'm sure there are a few megachurches out there that manage through smoke and mirrors to line the pastor's pocket. But the vast majority of churches are shoestring operations, bringing in barely enough to fund its activities, pay the light bill, and pay the clergy a salary. Even then, the salary of your average clergy isn't anywhere close to what he or she would make as a manager in the private sector. I've sat on the vestry of my own church and know what the finances are like.
Your Church does not pay property taxes. I personally pay property taxes, county taxes, city taxes, federal and state taxes, and business taxes.
I also spend money in my community. I help people with personal issues.
I volunteer, and donate time. What makes you so special? Nothing. What you seek is privilege.
My taxes have increased every year. After all, I need roads, bridges, police, firefighters, teachers, libraries, water...... I am not hostile toward taxes. Public servants need to be paid a fair wage, and that takes money.
I do not understand why your Church is hostile toward paying your fair share of property taxes.
Ya know...that's great. Good for you.
I can tell you with absolute certainty that this town would be worse off without a church here. The people in this town do appreciate it being here. Like it or not, the people of the town, even those that don't come to church, appreciate it being here. For that reason, government has determined that churches and other non-profits are allowed to not pay taxes.
If we started paying large amounts of taxes it would kill us.
I work with a number of non-profits, several of which own their own buildings, chiefly because it makes greater financial sense for them. They do not pay a dime in taxes. One is a homeless shelter. Another is a musical organization. Another is about rehabilitating wildlife. Why should they have to pay property taxes?
And those nonprofits have to SHOW that they are actually doing what they say they are. They can't just say "I'm nonprofit and do good stuff". If they can not SHOW that they are benefiting the community they lose their nonprofit status. Churches don't have to prove anything to keep their nonprofit status. They can do nothing but have church services on Sunday for an hour and still keep their tax free status.
IMO everyone should have to pay property taxes and be taxed like any other person/business. You are taxed on all income THEN you get to deduct actual charitable giving and expenses on your taxes. That would also help with the issue of "charities" that only use 10% of less of all donations on actual charitable causes.
You're not a very informed person. Non-profits, regardless of their nature, do not pay property taxes as long as they meet specific governmental guidelines. The reason for this is simple. They leverage resources to achieve good in the community in ways that government simply could not.
I suppose what's driving this is the notion that churches actually make money. Oh, I'm sure there are a few megachurches out there that manage through smoke and mirrors to line the pastor's pocket. But the vast majority of churches are shoestring operations, bringing in barely enough to fund its activities, pay the light bill, and pay the clergy a salary. Even then, the salary of your average clergy isn't anywhere close to what he or she would make as a manager in the private sector. I've sat on the vestry of my own church and know what the finances are like.
I am informed. I simply want to change it. I want you to pay property taxes. Just like I pay. What you want is privilege. I want that changed.
I do not care how you leverage resources. We all have to do the same and pay taxes, too. If your church can do all those things you should stop step up and pay your property tax share. Just leverage those resources and budget for them, just like I do.
I can tell you with absolute certainty that this town would be worse off without a church here. The people in this town do appreciate it being here. Like it or not, the people of the town, even those that don't come to church, appreciate it being here. For that reason, government has determined that churches and other non-profits are allowed to not pay taxes.
If we started paying large amounts of taxes it would kill us.
And? I know people that have had to sell their homes and move because they couldn't afford the property taxes of an area. Why should your church be given special treatment over them? Why should your church get special treatment over a business that would fold if they couldn't pay their taxes?
I can tell you with absolute certainty that this town would be worse off without a church here. The people in this town do appreciate it being here. Like it or not, the people of the town, even those that don't come to church, appreciate it being here. For that reason, government has determined that churches and other non-profits are allowed to not pay taxes.
If we started paying large amounts of taxes it would kill us.
I pay a very large amount of taxes. It has not killed me. I am still standing. I can tell you with absolute certainty I would be thrilled to have the extra income.
It seems Churches only want government when it suits them. I want to level that playing field.
If your church is that important to your town, it should step up to pay property taxes. You want privilege. I want to change it.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
