Judge, God surpasses Law. Law: Your Fired (quote, marriage, Christians)
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Ah. I see. Removed by Govt. Re-elected by a Christian -ruled populace who disagree with the government. Sounds unpatriotic and revolutionary to me.
I have this idea that there is a sorta ghost nation that exists within a nation or beyond it (Like the nation of Islam) and it tolerates a government only if it toes the line or doesn't step over it. If it crosses the line drawn by the Christian nation, then...
You're exactly right in your analysis. We see it nearly everyday, living in the South. My Facebook is full of those who wear the banner proudly and make no apologies for supporting the installing of a theocracy in the U.S. government.
Ah. I see. Removed by Govt. Re-elected by a Christian -ruled populace who disagree with the government. Sounds unpatriotic and revolutionary to me.
I have this idea that there is a sorta ghost nation that exists within a nation or beyond it (Like the nation of Islam) and it tolerates a government only if it toes the line or doesn't step over it. If it crosses the line drawn by the Christian nation, then...
Well ... it's a little like how, on paper and in theory, blacks were liberated from slavery and given full citizenship in the mid-1860s, but it took the civil rights movement of the 1960s to get them to a place where they didn't fear for their lives to register to vote (or officials simply declined to accept their registration form) or where dating across racial lines was a hangable offense (again, not on paper, but in practice). There are still hate crimes from that era that remain unsolved to this day.
THAT aspect of the "ghost nation" is largely, though by no means completely, exorcised, but others remain. And I think the primary dynamic that drives all this current nonsense is that WASPs (white, anglo-saxon Protestants) understand that they are on the cusp of being Just Another Minority in our increasingly diverse melting-pot of a country, and they are having a coronary over their lost hegemony / power / dominance. Trying frantically to do anything they can think of to turn back the clock and restore their privilege. And it is not just that they are losing an advantage in numbers, but are losing what they perceive as the culture wars, moving away from rather than toward their fantasized quasi-theocracy.
To the extent they believe their privilege was due to the grace of god, they are taking this as being persecuted for their faith.
I think we can expect a great deal of unrest, to the point of riots, almost no matter who emerges victorious in this Presidential contest. We are entering a difficult time. If Trump wins the election I will probably be unable to go out in public without a paper bag over my head ...
We've all probably seen some of the drama, especially in the southern States, when it comes to same sex marriage issues. Everyone knows, or at least I thought that everyone knows, that once the Supreme Court of the USA rules, it becomes the law everyone has to follow.
Well, I guess the Chief Justice of the Alabama Supreme Court thought differently, and despite a ruling by a federal judge in Mobile making same-sex marriage legal in Alabama last year, and in the face of a United States Supreme Court ruling last year making its legality the law of the land, Moore instructed probate judges throughout Alabama to ignore those higher courts and to refuse to issue licenses to same-sex couples.
Moore was suspended after the Alabama Judicial Inquiry Commission filed ethics charges against him. Moore will now be tried by the Alabama Court of the Judiciary, and could be removed from the bench if found guilty.
What is it going to take to teach fundamentalist Christians that they don't make the law of the land, but the Constitution, SCOTUS rulings and Congress?
It's sad watching so many fundies going through the death throes of what they use to think was their "Gawd given right" to rule as they saw fit. Their thrashing about gets worse and worse the closer to the death of religion ruling the USA comes.
This is the same judge that erected a Ten Commandment monument in the Alabama State Courthouse lobby, and then flouted a removal order. The Court of the Judiciary unanimously removed him from his position as Chief Justice, but that wasn't enough to keep him in check,
On the 6th of this month, he was suspended from the bench pending investigations of multiple ethics violations, including the same-sex marriage issue, defying a Federal court order, misuse of authority and failure to follow clear law.
Gldn, I submit that if marriage is a religious matter, and not a civil or legal one, then no marriage at all (same-sex or opposite) can be considered valid under US law; as has been said many times, the Constitution specifically prohibits the promotion of a 'state religion' or the trappings thereof.
Judge Moore had already been removed from office once for ethic charges, in his refusal to remove the large 10 commandments statue in front of the court house. The good people of Alabama elected him for a second time after he had been removed.
This isn't about religious freedom, in case some try to make it so. This is about the duty of a judge. A judge that opposes same sex marriage still must consider it legally valid if the law considers it so. If I were a judge, and a trial of a kid caught for pot was brought before me, despite my thinking this should not be a crime at all (and certainly not one that carries prison), I'd have no choice but to punish him as the law says.
If Moore wishes to change the law, he should challenge the supreme court, as is his right as an American citizens. As a judge, though, his duty is to uphold the law, regardless of his feelings as a citizen.
We've all probably seen some of the drama, especially in the southern States, when it comes to same sex marriage issues. Everyone knows, or at least I thought that everyone knows, that once the Supreme Court of the USA rules, it becomes the law everyone has to follow.
Well, I guess the Chief Justice of the Alabama Supreme Court thought differently, and despite a ruling by a federal judge in Mobile making same-sex marriage legal in Alabama last year, and in the face of a United States Supreme Court ruling last year making its legality the law of the land, Moore instructed probate judges throughout Alabama to ignore those higher courts and to refuse to issue licenses to same-sex couples.
Moore was suspended after the Alabama Judicial Inquiry Commission filed ethics charges against him. Moore will now be tried by the Alabama Court of the Judiciary, and could be removed from the bench if found guilty.
What is it going to take to teach fundamentalist Christians that they don't make the law of the land, but the Constitution, SCOTUS rulings and Congress?
It's sad watching so many fundies going through the death throes of what they use to think was their "Gawd given right" to rule as they saw fit. Their thrashing about gets worse and worse the closer to the death of religion ruling the USA comes.
Everyone knows, or at least I thought that everyone knows, that once the Supreme Court of the USA rules, it becomes the law everyone has to follow.
Not so much, at least these days. Our immigration laws are federal law. Yet many cities not only ignore them, they actively help individuals violate those laws, and reward them for doing so and our chief law enforcement officer ignores them. Our drug laws are the law of the land, yet entire states flout them. Just why is this issue any different? People, especially in government, are free to pick and chose what laws to enforce or ignore without repercussion.
Not so much, at least these days. Our immigration laws are federal law. Yet many cities not only ignore them, they actively help individuals violate those laws, and reward them for doing so and our chief law enforcement officer ignores them. Our drug laws are the law of the land, yet entire states flout them. Just why is this issue any different? People, especially in government, are free to pick and chose what laws to enforce or ignore without repercussion.
Yes and no.
Assuming for the sake of argument that all laws make perfect sense and are utterly just, there is still the need often to prioritize resources for enforcement. So this is nothing new. For example if there are still laws on the books prohibiting spitting chewing tobacco anyplace other than a spittoon, I am guessing that zero law enforcement resources go to detecting much less than enforcing it because hardly anyone chews tobacco to that degree anymore. There are always laws like that lying about.
If the federal government, as it did in the US during the Nixon administration, decides it wants to declare a "war on drugs" to demonize "hippies and blacks" that the administration could not get away with outright lynching or persecuting, and two generations later it has become obvious that this war is both overdetermined and a failure, then yes, some states are going to use "state's rights" as a basis to decide not to put a lot of resources into it and to experiment in fact with decriminalizing aspects of it. And all the federal government is doing is threading the needle between international treaty obligations relating to the fact that the "war on drugs" has spread somewhat to other nations, the perceptions of voting constituencies, and state's rights plus in the case of pot, medical uses of the drug ... and allowing a limited experiment to be run to flush out practical problems and figure out a way forward.
So in principle a state "flouting" a federal drug law is no different than a local municipality "flouting" a state tobacco-spitting law. Just because a law was passed doesn't make it exactly equivalent to morality and virtue, and the utility of any law has to be evaluated and adjusted from time to time. It is not a question of mindlessly saying, "well, that's settled for all time and eternity and should forever be enforced to the maximum possible extent".
Of course the heads of people who see everything in black and white will tend to explode over all this nuance and decry it as some sort of ******* PC communist threat. But fortunately, cooler heads do prevail.
You're exactly right in your analysis. We see it nearly everyday, living in the South. My Facebook is full of those who wear the banner proudly and make no apologies for supporting the installing of a theocracy in the U.S. government.
Thanks you and Mordant also for your comments.
I am trying to see What's Going On since I don't see it summed up elsewhere, but I am no expert in US affairs and am just a Moderator cut: deleted Limey, really, so I value useful comments and input.
Or, as in Vizio's effort, lack of any.
Last edited by june 7th; 06-02-2016 at 03:14 AM..
Reason: Perhaps not suitable in the R&S forum.....
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