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this is true, but we have people making laws based on things they don't understand or made up. Like unarmed means inocent or god says so. We have to engineer a society of humans. So we do need to keep questioning.
I always look at where a line of logic starts. Those two or three base concepts that people use to form a line of logic. If those pieces are not true, it doesn't matter what follows. Where I draw the line is when we begin stack up a personal emotional need against another personal emotional need and start claiming we have the real truth. for example: like an ex-fundy great dane style dog, calling out he has the best poop around. I'll give him one thing, it is pile of poop.
Come on Stymie....you are more thoughtful than that and know the atheist position better than that.
If both presidential candidates were praising the good work of searching for the Loch Ness monster...you'd wonder what world you woke up to where people actually believe such a thing. You'd research and explore the evidence for it perhaps, but upon finding none (or none of the convincing kind), you'd have to at least speak up and present your view of it. Especially if the vast majority of people self-identified as Nessieists, built (tax exempt) temples to honor Nessie, knocked on your door weekly to inform you that Nessie loves you and wants to save you, and effectively infiltrated so many facets of society that you can't expect to be President unless you (at least pretend to) profess your love for Nessie....right?
this is true, but we have people making laws based on things they don't understand or made up. Like unarmed means inocent or god says so. We have to engineer a society of humans. So we do need to keep questioning.
I always look at where a line of logic starts. Those two or three base concepts that people use to form a line of logic. If those pieces are not true, it doesn't matter what follows. Where I draw the line is when we begin stack up a personal emotional need against another personal emotional need and start claiming we have the real truth. for example: like an ex-fundy great dane style dog, calling out he has the best poop around. I'll give him one thing, it is pile of poop.
A mind can suspend belief/disbelief when it comes to 'human legality' in this country. Extremists on both sides, believers/non believers, completely remove logic on this particular front. The 'fundie' as these threads define, see an attack at every turn. The 'scientific' atheist sees an affront an imposition at every turn.
Both are fundamentally wrong, misguided, and basing 'their' logic on emotion. Or as Aristotle would say... Pathos. He used that one for a reason.
Come on Stymie....you are more thoughtful than that and know the atheist position better than that.
If both presidential candidates were praising the good work of searching for the Loch Ness monster...you'd wonder what world you woke up to where people actually believe such a thing. You'd research and explore the evidence for it perhaps, but upon finding none (or none of the convincing kind), you'd have to at least speak up and present your view of it. Especially if the vast majority of people self-identified as Nessieists, built (tax exempt) temples to honor Nessie, knocked on your door weekly to inform you that Nessie loves you and wants to save you, and effectively infiltrated so many facets of society that you can't expect to be President unless you (at least pretend to) profess your love for Nessie....right?
Good analogy and not far off the point. I declared myself atheist at 12. Over the next 30 years, life and people and nature proved there is something more. I can't define, but Jesus seems to be a pretty cool cat. I think many of us he'd not condemn in any way, but talk to us instead.
I am the farthest from a literalist as one will find. But I will state categorically: Jesus' teachings to me are more profound than the Buddhas. Right/wrong? Not my place.
My basic premise is this: why are many atheists so combative? I was, at 15. But we grow.
Why are some theists so combative? That one is easy... 'My way or the highway'
I don't particularly care for with of those sides.
How often does Santa show up on your doorstep handing out pamphlets about Christmas?
How often does the First Church of the Bunny send forth street preachers telling you that you will suffer forever in a sea of rotten eggs if you don't believe in the Easter Bunny? How often does society call you evil and foolish for not leaving coins under your children's pillows?
How much will society sanction you for not believing in these things?
So that's really it? You just want to complain about people that talk about God?
How about the "benevolent government" thing? Do you rant and rail about the government not living up to what is promised?
You, et al, need to face ***THE REALITY OF THE WORLD*** about "God Belief...and why that reasonably puts the onus on the Atheists to "represent" and "prove their claim".
By the way, even though I don't think your argument is logically accurate, I will say that I also don't think it is completely without merit.
You're right in saying that a God or spirit that is eternal, undefinable and beyond comprehension has been a staple concept for people of different cultures for millennia. Immanuel Kant believed that the reality of God was a priori knowledge - that God was not subject to the rules of external evidence.
When I read some of your statements in support of pantheism, that seems to be what you're trying to say as well.
How often does Santa show up on your doorstep handing out pamphlets about Christmas? How often does the First Church of the Bunny send forth street preachers telling you that you will suffer forever in a sea of rotten eggs if you don't believe in the Easter Bunny? How often does society call you evil and foolish for not leaving coins under your children's pillows?
How much will society sanction you for not believing in these things?
How often does one of your ilk promulgate bs without knowing it. Specifically healthcare. Oh please challenge me here...
Without getting into personal stuff, many atheists find affront at every turn. Many Christians do as well. But... Those that do, aren't looking inward as to why, they are projecting their personal crap on everything else.
....many atheists find affront at every turn. Many Christians do as well. But... Those that do, aren't looking inward as to why, they are projecting their personal crap on everything else.
I definitively know I'm an ego centric b....d. Life, and listening, has taught me most of my external complaints are based on internal dissent. The closer I move to that internal voice, the less dissent I have. Because I'm human, and very fallible, I call it God.
I still say to each their own. Since I no longer need to prove or disprove belief systems, instead just accepting, I'm more at peace with myself.
The bigger the boast the emptier the reality proves to be. And there is a logical reason for this. The bigger boasts derives from a greater lack of understanding what constitutes an argument which is objective.
typical childish confusion of internal state with objective reality
Solipsism notwithstanding, all we have are internal states supplemented with consensus. That is hardly compelling evidence of objectivity.
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