Bible God's morality changes over time (sunday, behavior, homosexuality, science)
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In the same way, God arranged for other nations to judge Israel for their sin. Yet, God never once said that such things were GOOD or that they were MORAL.
Beside the point.
But I do like it that you are having a go.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio
Yes--God judged him. He WOULD have given them to David....and David would lived happily ever after. But no--David messed it up.
I fail to see your point.
I'm waiting for someone to post a response saying "Davie....you're going to be King...and you'll have a lot of wives, because I consider that a good thing!" But that doesn't exist, does it?
It's obvious, God DID give David the wives and the Kingship. He DID that. It implies that he approved (without the need for an irrelevant specific declaration of approval of multiple wives) or he would have given him the kingship a lot of horses and gold and one superb wife. He didn't- he gave him a lot of wives, without being asked. Nobody forced him to. It follows that God not only had no serious objection, but he thought it was an appropriate thing for him to give.
He would have given David more IF he has wanted them. But he DID give him what he had - the multiple wives, included. God DID that.
He later took them away, not because he did not really approve of multiple wives, but because David sinned over Uriah.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio
And simply stating that God condoned or allowed something is different than God declaring something to be moral or good.
I'd say it amounts tho the same thing. Because it is not even like the slavery that God condoned - he gave the wives when he didn't have to. Moreover Solomon had a lot of wives too, and not a word on complaint from God. You say that he didn't specifically announce
"I think multiple wives are good."
?Neither does he say they are bad, and in view of David having them, if he had disapproved, he should have said so, or just not given them.
If the later view has come to be that one man one wife is correct (and even marrying again, wasn't considered too brilliant), then clearly the morality has changed. Or rather the customs have, so God is reinvented to fit the customs.
Last edited by TRANSPONDER; 06-21-2016 at 02:18 PM..
It's obvious, God DID give David the wives and the Kingship. He DID that.
He would have given David more IF he has wanted them. But he DID give him what he had - the multiple wives, included. God DID that.
He later took them away, not because he did not really approve of multiple wives but because David sinned over Uriah.
Okay, I have to ask ... Was it actually unclear when I explained it, or even just from reading the passage itself, that God DID give David multiple wives?
Okay, I have to ask ... Was it actually unclear when I explained it, or even just from reading the passage itself, that God DID give David multiple wives?
No, it wasn't unclear. Vizio seemed to be trying to say that God would have given David the wives (which even in itself implies that he would have no moral objection) if he hadn't messed up. But that isn't the case - he actually DID give David the wives (unasked, so far as I can tell) while he was still God's poster -boy.
I'd say, as I guessed, Vizio is trying to make the Bible say something that he would prefer it to say, rather than what it does say.
Vizio seemed to be trying to say that God would have given David the wives (which even in itself implies that he would have no moral objection) if he hadn't messed up. But that isn't the case - he actually DID give David the wives (unasled, so far as I can tell) while he was still God's poster -boy.
Yes, but I think he's backing off of that now and is trying multiple different (and rather conflicting) ways of circumventing it...
God gave David multiple wives as a punishment (though it is clear from the passage God intended it as a reward.)
or
It was immoral and not good to have multiple wives, but God gave multiple wives to David anyway (which implies that God did/participated in something immoral, though I'm sure Viz doesn't mean to imply that.)
or
Who cares/what does it matter that God gave David multiple wives?
Since we're talking about God's morality, how moral is it that God had women treated like property and given from one man to another (Saul's wives were given by God to David), and then arranged to have them presumably raped by that man's son as a judgment on their husband?
I suspect you have me confused with some other poster. It happens a lot on here. I do not insult, ridicule, or mock anyone. I DO have disdain for ugly, primitive, evil, barbarous and absurd beliefs ABOUT God and the actions that hurt or harm others derived from them, but not people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift
People seem to conflate the two all the time, it is known as taking criticism personally.
I noticed! It will forever be a problem with fundamentalists, I am afraid.
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Originally Posted by Tzaphkiel
that is the hatred and bigotry that you are very well known for on CD
your posts and language are very transparent and accurately represent your feelings of hatred and bigotry toward those with different views
There is no hatred or bigotry toward ANYONE in my disdain of harmful and evil ideas. Your desire to infer any is not my problem. I love you and all my brothers and sisters no matter what their beliefs, but the evil and harmful beliefs will ALWAYS incur my disdain.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift
You missed the answer: it is not people Mystic castigates, but ideas. Learn the difference.
I suspect it will be a cold day in their mythical hell before that happens, nate.
Yes, but I think he's backing off of that now and is trying multiple different (and rather conflicting) ways of circumventing it...
God gave David multiple wives as a punishment (though it is clear from the passage God intended it as a reward.)
or
It was immoral and not good to have multiple wives, but God gave multiple wives to David anyway (which implies that God did/participated in something immoral, though I'm sure Viz doesn't mean to imply that.)
or
Who cares/what does it matter that God gave David multiple wives?
Yes the idea of a punishment of being deluged with wives doesn't seem to be borne out by the punishment being taking them away. And there isn't much mileage in God grudgingly allowing David to collect a barnful of wives, because he delivered them and then told David what a mark of favour it had been (before he messed up)
And who cares whether God gave them or not? Those who argue that God's morality changed over time, and those who don't care are those who prefer to ignore what's actually in the Bible and believe a sort of Bible they have made up in their heads which reads a lot nicer.
Of course Vizio may have some better explanation. He will need something better, for sure.
can you go 90 days on CD without insulting, ridiculing, belittling, mocking and without using any derisive language? if not....why not?
because that is the face you show the world here on CD
Not really. Though I might think that Mystic's beliefs are nonsensical, I don't recall him ever ridiculing or insulting individuals. It could just be you.
can you go 90 days on CD without insulting, ridiculing, belittling, mocking and without using any derisive language? if not....why not?
because that is the face you show the world here on CD. the hateful bigoted language you use in your posts broadcasts loud and clear what you are adding to the world. are you adding light to the world or verbal feces? if a person can't walk the talk, their message of "love" has no credibility and is empty words. the word "hypocrisy" comes to mind = " the practice of claiming to have moral standards or beliefs to which one's own behavior does not conform; pretense."
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
disdain for ugly, primitive, evil, barbarous and absurd
Last edited by Tzaphkiel; 06-21-2016 at 03:12 PM..
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