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If showering in a locker room bothers someone, they can simply shower in a private stall, or at home. No one is forced to shower in public.
Your point is moot. If you do not wish to use the stall next to mine then don't.
I use the bathroom for one reason, and it never includes the person using the stall next to mine.
The same silly excuse was used keeping female sports reporters out of the locker room. There might be naked men. If naked men saw a woman in the locker room they might get an erection, or the woman might see their little winkies. Yawn...
Excellent. Now I suggest you look at the porn/strip club angle which you did a very good job of ignoring. You're upset about the possibility of a teeny, tiny percentage of American students possibly getting a peek at a trans student's genitals....meanwhile MILLIONS of straight, non-trans teenagers are looking at porn and visiting strip clubs.
Looking at pictures, or being in an environment controlled by on premises security is quite different than "real life" situations. It really isn't conflatable (is that a word?, well, you know what I mean).
Never mind teenagers looking at porn...there are lots of teenagers that ARE the porn. The 18 and 19 year olds are some of the most popular. And you only have to be 18 to legally consume pornography...in the U.S. anyway.
I was never forced to shower with others. Neither were my kids.
Using a rare exception to the norm as an argument is not valid.
The fact is...in most all Jr. + Sr. High Schools, the only available facilities in a male locker room to take a shower after getting sweaty and filthy during sports practice and competition is a "communal" shower room that is used by everyone simultaneously, and there is no privacy what-so-ever. Many side-by-side actually inches from each other.
It is also typical for all to shower at the school...not put on their clothes while dirty and sweaty, and wait to get home.
That is how it REALLY is...rare exceptions notwithstanding.
Plus...if these "transgendered equal rights" laws take full national effect relative to all situations (and it looks like that is the way it is going), you could have guys going into female locker rooms anywhere...YMCAs, gyms & fitness centers, etc...and changing and grooming right there. And you couldn't stop them because all they would have to do is say, "I feel like a female today".
Using a rare exception to the norm as an argument is not valid.
The fact is...in most all Jr. + Sr. High Schools, the only available facilities in a male locker room to take a shower after getting sweaty and filthy during sports practice and competition is a "communal" shower room that is used by everyone simultaneously, and there is no privacy what-so-ever. Many side-by-side actually inches from each other.
It is also typical for all to shower at the school...not put on their clothes while dirty and sweaty, and wait to get home.
That is how it REALLY is...rare exceptions notwithstanding.
Plus...if these "transgendered equal rights" laws take full national effect relative to all situations (and it looks like that is the way it is going), you could have guys going into female locker rooms anywhere...YMCAs, gyms & fitness centers, etc...and changing and grooming right there. And you couldn't stop them because all they would have to do is say, "I feel like a female today".
If my children were told they must shower with others, I would have simply called the school and advised them that it was not happening. There was no forcing them.
As for myself, there was no forcing me to do anything. Ever.
I do not shower in public at my gym either. If there were a transgendered person in there with me changing I would not be alarmed. I have seen plenty of naked bodies in my life. There is nothing about the human body that alarms me.
Your beliefs about transgendered people is ignorant and ridiculous.
If my children were told they must shower with others, I would have simply called the school and advised them that it was not happening. There was no forcing them.
As for myself, there was no forcing me to do anything. Ever.
I do not shower in public at my gym either. If there were a transgendered person in there with me changing I would not be alarmed. I have seen plenty of naked bodies in my life. There is nothing about the human body that alarms me.
Your beliefs about transgendered people is ignorant and ridiculous.
You bring up your rare exception situation again. I spoke to the norm as to how schools are typically set up. Address that.
And how adults handle situations in locker rooms is not my focus either. You may as well make the argument, "I ride my bicycle in the park all by myself and it doesn't alarm me, so it's obviously a no risk situation for my 12 year old". The same difference with a 12 yr old transgendered girl going into the male locker room, compared to an adult female doing it.
My main worry about the potential risks is not so much with problems that would/could occur with actual transgendered, as they are rare exceptions and would most never have bad intentions.
I see these laws opening up opportunities for bad people to invade places they would never otherwise be able to enter, just by saying, "I feel like a female today". Now some dude with bad motives has access. Not a good thing...not good at all.
Someone who owns a strip club and worries about the little children is an oxymoron. You make money using women's bodies for profit.
If you could profit from the transgendered community you would do just that. Your argument is specious, and hardly compelling.
The women use their own bodies and mind. Just like one does in any other line of work to earn money.
Every business owner, if they have others working there, uses the "body" & "mind" of others "for profit".
Also...they are all adults...there of their own free will. MOF I only have enough work available such that there are many times more that are seeking to work than I have work for. It is a cooperative agreement between the women and the business. All the performers are there fully of their own accord.
None have ever been harmed. Unlike all the people that get sick and die from eating too much fat and sugar laden foods.
Conflating children being molested by a pervert using a "transgendered" excuse to gain access to a restroom or locker room, to the adult women working for me of their own volition, earning a living...is no different than when some compare homosexuals to pedophiles and those into incest & beastiality.
Again...your argument is bogus.
Using a rare exception to the norm as an argument is not valid.
The fact is...in most all Jr. + Sr. High Schools, the only available facilities in a male locker room to take a shower after getting sweaty and filthy during sports practice and competition is a "communal" shower room that is used by everyone simultaneously, and there is no privacy what-so-ever. Many side-by-side actually inches from each other.
It is also typical for all to shower at the school...not put on their clothes while dirty and sweaty, and wait to get home.
That is how it REALLY is...rare exceptions notwithstanding.
Plus...if these "transgendered equal rights" laws take full national effect relative to all situations (and it looks like that is the way it is going), you could have guys going into female locker rooms anywhere...YMCAs, gyms & fitness centers, etc...and changing and grooming right there. And you couldn't stop them because all they would have to do is say, "I feel like a female today".
I don't think it is a rare exception. I was never once forced to shower in all of my junior high and high school years, except before swimming, but we showered with our suits on.
I don't think it is a rare exception. I was never once forced to shower in all of my junior high and high school years, except before swimming, but we showered with our suits on.
The risks to a guy who feels like a girl in the female locker room are not the same as the girl that feels like a guy in the male locker room. It was the female (that feels male) child in the mens locker room...showering with men in a "gang" shower that I noted.
For some reason the females not showering together, or at all...which would be a rare exception for the men...keeps being put forth as an argument.
The fact is, the situation in the female facilities would not at all be typical for the men.
Ask how many scholastic male locker rooms had "private" shower stalls instead of a "communal" shower. Also ask how many used those showers after practice or competition.
But I guess it is the only argument available (that it could actually not occur that a little trans girl could be showering next to adult men) so that is why it is offered, rather than address the scenario I put forth.
Also...it isn't just bathing. Everyone changes from the athletic uniform and gear...to street clothing.
A staple of mens athletic wear is a supporter (jock strap)...so the men will typically strip completely.
I personally think it is outside of any semblance of good sense to think it would be cool for a 13 year old girl (that self-identifies as male) to be in a locker room with adult men as old as 19.
I am actually schocked that anyone would think it is okay. And I don't shock very easy.
MOF...I am typing this from the Cantina at the VA Hospital. You see a lot of shocking stuff here...very sad.
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