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It doesn't matter what his username is. His interpretation of Christianity is very similar to secular humanism. Many Christians have taken the same path -- progressive Christianity and secular humanism are closely related. The only minor difference is that progressive Christians are not exactly atheists.
If you think the central message of Christianity is compassion for fellow humans, then you are not really a mystic. Compassion may be an important ingredient, but it is not nearly as important as the supernatural aspect.
Progressive Christianity minimizes the supernatural aspect of religion. All that matters is being nice to people. And you can be nice to people in a superficial, hypocritical way.
If mysticism and supernaturalism comes FIRST, before compassion, then I guess the compassion could be genuine.
Compassion for everyone, without discrimination, is world-renouncing. You cannot care about this world if you love everyone equally. Christianity is world-renouncing mysticism, and so is Buddhism.
You can't apply Jesus teaching to real life. Progressives criticize traditional Christians for being greedy capitalists. The assumption is they should be compassionate socialists.
there is no supernatural. Only natural. naturally, we just don't know it all yet. life is natural and we are part of a larger system of life. That doesn't imply god.
wrong, how we treat people comes first. We are all hypocrites to a degree. We have to be.
"all love" is not the way it works. There has to be "not-love" to have love. For now, that empirical.
for now, I am leaving politics out. one thing I am against is self sacrifice to the point of self destruction. That is a cop out as far as I am concerned. Pass blame/responsibility onto a book or "the rich", same thing to me. whimpy.
I in the meantime, since this damn' Keyboard wil not now type "l" as wel as no type "t" I shall have to ry to cure i by throwing i on the floor and jumping on it.
You'd skip a letter or two as well if you got as much use as your keyboard.
But, damn Trawk...you can buy a new keyboard for less than the price of a couple pints of ale. Just spring for a new one.
Unless its a notebook or laptop...then that could be more of an issue.
Anything that holds up or messes up your posts in support of the illogical and unreasonable concept you embrace (that I can then rip into) is a detriment to this board. Square that away Bro!
Thanks for posting that. One of his points to the seeming decrease in human compassion was how our perceptions of other people have changed. It's no longer OK to mass murder the "others". Somethings that used to be acceptable are a big deal today when someone does it. The practice of entertaining oneself by burning a cat alive sticks out to me. Get caught doing that today and you'll get in trouble.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin
I very much disagree with Pinker. We have less violent conflict among individuals, but we have powerful weapons keeping us all under control.
I'm a little on the fence with Pinker's arguments. I can see good arguments both ways, but for the moment I am still leaning toward Pinker's side, and I think that L8 gives one small example of what is on my mind, although I'm thinking more in terms of humanitarian treatment of human beings.
I do agree with you, however, about the Neolithic transformation. With the invention of private property and patriarchal inheritance, I think that humanity, overall, took a turn for the worse, relative to the Paleolithic. The Middle Ages seem especially atrocious to me. But with the rise of fairly modern civilization, I still suspect that people, on average, have begun to internalize more and more the abstract concept of "live and let live" which implies an increasing tolerance for diverse views (despite some dramatic exceptions, where certain societies and segments of society are actually becoming increasingly intolerant and violent).
Although you could hardly tell it from today's media coverage of the political landscape, and despite the fact that we still have a lot of maturing to do, Western civilization, overall, is still an amazing testament to the human capacity for intercultural tolerance. Radically different worldviews live not only in the same general geographic region, but in the same apartment buildings and shop in the same stores. Yes, there is violence, but if the media reported acts of kindness and tolerance with the same relative frequency that it reports acts of hatred and violence, the daily newspaper would barely fit into your house. Individually, and as a society, we simply don't pay much attention to the daily good things that happen. And I really don't think that most of the good acts occur just due to fear of weaponry. I think most of it has become just momentum of habit for most people. It's just what we do. I personally hate the political shift that occurred in the last American election (and similar shifts in Europe), but I feel no serious compulsion to do violence toward anyone. Obviously some people do turn violent, but I think that, deep down, most people feel the counterproductive nature of violence, as a mater of principle.
Aristotle famously argued that, to improve your moral feelings, you need to force yourself to act morally (or be force to act morally). If you do good acts for a period of time, then good acts become a sort of habit, and eventually you just are morally good. I suspect that something roughly along these lines has happened to humanity, on average, as civilization has grown.
Go get him Mystic, mate. You couldn't take me - maybe you can take Him.
"Take" you? I'm not sure what you mean. Mystic confronts you with an internally consistent perception about how things work that matches observation....AND it dismisses all the harmful perceptions and practices that you SO object to in the "religious"....except for one observation that you dismiss as subjctive and all you have is, "you can't prove it."
there is no supernatural. Only natural. naturally, we just don't know it all yet. life is natural and we are part of a larger system of life. That doesn't imply god.
wrong, how we treat people comes first. We are all hypocrites to a degree. We have to be.
"all love" is not the way it works. There has to be "not-love" to have love. For now, that empirical.
for now, I am leaving politics out. one thing I am against is self sacrifice to the point of self destruction. That is a cop out as far as I am concerned. Pass blame/responsibility onto a book or "the rich", same thing to me. whimpy.
That doesn't just "imply god" AA...it IS GOD. And it is self-substantiating.
I'm tellin' ya...***PANTHEISM***...that's the way to go.
You get GOD, objectively, unequivocally, and irrefutably...but no hocus-pocus flim-flam stuff. And no tithing! HaHaHa!
It's the best of all the concepts. And ALL THAT EXISTS certainly merits the title "GOD"...and the due reverence.
You'd skip a letter or two as well if you got as much use as your keyboard.
But, damn Trawk...you can buy a new keyboard for less than the price of a couple pints of ale. Just spring for a new one.
Unless its a notebook or laptop...then that could be more of an issue.
Anything that holds up or messes up your posts in support of the illogical and unreasonable concept you embrace (that I can then rip into) is a detriment to this board. Square that away Bro!
We it's not the dosh, Gldbrick, it's the depressing sight of a dozen buggered keyboards stacked in the corner. However, I do it have it on my to do list..
pint of milk,
coffee (make sure it's fairtrade)
deny God
new keyboard
World domination by next week.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GldnRule
That doesn't just "imply god" AA...it IS GOD. And it is self-substantiating.
I'm tellin' ya...***PANTHEISM***...that's the way to go.
You get GOD, objectively, unequivocally, and irrefutably...but no hocus-pocus flim-flam stuff. And no tithing! HaHaHa!
It's the best of all the concepts. And ALL THAT EXISTS certainly merits the title "GOD"...and the due reverence.
You almost gottiim...bit more line...sprinkle a couple more dried worms...get the fishnet ready....
"Take" you? I'm not sure what you mean. Mystic confronts you with an internally consistent perception about how things work that matches observation....AND it dismisses all the harmful perceptions and practices that you SO object to in the "religious"....except for one observation that you dismiss as subjctive and all you have is, "you can't prove it."
ok
It's not unity then.
The whole point of One is that nothing is dismissed. It all fits in a way that is harmonious and at peace.
There are no discordant elements.
And mystics views and posts are rife with discord because there are so many things that he is not at peace with.
"Take" you? I'm not sure what you mean. Mystic confronts you with an internally consistent perception about how things work that matches observation....AND it dismisses all the harmful perceptions and practices that you SO object to in the "religious"....except for one observation that you dismiss as subjctive and all you have is, "you can't prove it."
ok
That's all I really need, but if you missed the most entertaining display of wriggle and stamp, go back and have a re-read.
I'm a little on the fence with Pinker's arguments. I can see good arguments both ways, but for the moment I am still leaning toward Pinker's side, and I think that L8 gives one small example of what is on my mind, although I'm thinking more in terms of humanitarian treatment of human beings.
I do agree with you, however, about the Neolithic transformation. With the invention of private property and patriarchal inheritance, I think that humanity, overall, took a turn for the worse, relative to the Paleolithic. The Middle Ages seem especially atrocious to me. But with the rise of fairly modern civilization, I still suspect that people, on average, have begun to internalize more and more the abstract concept of "live and let live" which implies an increasing tolerance for diverse views (despite some dramatic exceptions, where certain societies and segments of society are actually becoming increasingly intolerant and violent).
Although you could hardly tell it from today's media coverage of the political landscape, and despite the fact that we still have a lot of maturing to do, Western civilization, overall, is still an amazing testament to the human capacity for intercultural tolerance. Radically different worldviews live not only in the same general geographic region, but in the same apartment buildings and shop in the same stores. Yes, there is violence, but if the media reported acts of kindness and tolerance with the same relative frequency that it reports acts of hatred and violence, the daily newspaper would barely fit into your house. Individually, and as a society, we simply don't pay much attention to the daily good things that happen. And I really don't think that most of the good acts occur just due to fear of weaponry. I think most of it has become just momentum of habit for most people. It's just what we do. I personally hate the political shift that occurred in the last American election (and similar shifts in Europe), but I feel no serious compulsion to do violence toward anyone. Obviously some people do turn violent, but I think that, deep down, most people feel the counterproductive nature of violence, as a matter of principle.
Aristotle famously argued that, to improve your moral feelings, you need to force yourself to act morally (or be force to act morally). If you do good acts for a period of time, then good acts become a sort of habit, and eventually you just are morally good. I suspect that something roughly along these lines has happened to humanity, on average, as civilization has grown.
That's good, but don't forget that while the Middle aged had destructive wars that could go on for years and kill thousands, while 3rd millennium Sumer and China probably only had city skirmishes that involved a couple of hundred spearmen, the rulers of the middle ages didn't take an entire poisoned court to the grave with them.
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