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Old 12-05-2017, 07:45 PM
 
678 posts, read 429,193 times
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The Golden Rule ("Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.") is often referenced when morals are discussed but I don't think it's enough. It doesn't work when you get varying beliefs and personality types. An evangelical can bring up the fear of hell and the atheist can bring up that therapy may be needed for neurosis. Both are honestly trying to help each other yet neither is going to get very far, and will just generate angst.

There's also the Platinum Rule "Treat others the way they want to be treated." Sounds nice, yet doesn't work well with narcissists and other personality types, especially the fringe.

So if you want to grow and fine tune your moral compass how do you strike a balance? Do you try to emphasize self-awareness, stepping outside one's comfort zone / vacuum, more education? Does learning more about psychology and sociology help? Do you emphasize the need to have complete personal comfort and a certain amount of selfishness before you can help make a difference? Do you work on humility? Do higher morals lead to greater happiness? Or do you simply not care?

I don't feel there's a single right answer, but curious how others feel.
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Old 12-05-2017, 08:10 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma
2,186 posts, read 1,170,668 times
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The golden rule covers enough when considering lawful interactions. Laws and prisons will detour those who go too far not following the golden rule.
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Old 12-05-2017, 08:16 PM
 
2,826 posts, read 2,366,977 times
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The Platinum Rule I've heard about. The problem is, that you are absolutely right, it sets you up for narcissists and selfish jerks to exploit you. It took all of 5 months to reject that idea.

The ideal is the Golden Rule plus proper boundaries. "Love your neighbor as yourself" wasn't just a retelling of the Golden Rule. If you love yourself, you don't take **** from other people, you are able to tell them, "I don't deserve this kind of treatment," and demand better. And loving your neighbor means you don't trespass on others.
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Old 12-05-2017, 08:20 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,766 posts, read 24,270,853 times
Reputation: 32910
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumbo10 View Post
The Golden Rule ("Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.") is often referenced when morals are discussed but I don't think it's enough. It doesn't work when you get varying beliefs and personality types. An evangelical can bring up the fear of hell and the atheist can bring up that therapy may be needed for neurosis. Both are honestly trying to help each other yet neither is going to get very far, and will just generate angst.

There's also the Platinum Rule "Treat others the way they want to be treated." Sounds nice, yet doesn't work well with narcissists and other personality types, especially the fringe.

So if you want to grow and fine tune your moral compass how do you strike a balance? Do you try to emphasize self-awareness, stepping outside one's comfort zone / vacuum, more education? Does learning more about psychology and sociology help? Do you emphasize the need to have complete personal comfort and a certain amount of selfishness before you can help make a difference? Do you work on humility? Do higher morals lead to greater happiness? Or do you simply not care?

I don't feel there's a single right answer, but curious how others feel.
You're being too picky, IMHO, in re the Golden Rule. It's a simple concept, and I don't think anyone ever thought it was the answer to every situation or odd ball types of people.

My recipe:

1. Stop constantly multi-tasking and be truly mindful (a concept taught in Buddhism) on your interactions with others. Have real conversations with as many different kinds of people as possible, and make it a situation where you learn more than you "teach".

2. Get out of your comfort zone. Way out of your comfort zone. If you live in the Washington, D.C. suburbs, for example, spend some time up at Dupont Circle and don't just think how weird everyone is...interact. Walk around Adams Morgan neighborhood.

3. Better yet, visit a third world country if you can...or as close as you can. Thailand may not be quite third world, but it's definitely not first world. I learned more about life there than I did any other part of my life. Don't just hang out at the American style hotels and restaurants. Talk to everyday people. Take an interest in their lives. Visit small villages, not just big cities. There's a whole world out there that doesn't revolved around you and your country. Learn about other cultures independently; don't rely on a news channel or book.
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Old 12-05-2017, 10:42 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
17,071 posts, read 10,914,157 times
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If you realize that you are talking about what is best for the people involved and not what they want or what seems best at the time the Golden rule works perfectly. It may take some working out as to what actually IS best for the people involved, but it is the consideration to work for.
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Old 12-06-2017, 03:31 AM
 
28,432 posts, read 11,570,234 times
Reputation: 2070
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumbo10 View Post
The Golden Rule ("Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.") is often referenced when morals are discussed but I don't think it's enough. It doesn't work when you get varying beliefs and personality types. An evangelical can bring up the fear of hell and the atheist can bring up that therapy may be needed for neurosis. Both are honestly trying to help each other yet neither is going to get very far, and will just generate angst.

There's also the Platinum Rule "Treat others the way they want to be treated." Sounds nice, yet doesn't work well with narcissists and other personality types, especially the fringe.

So if you want to grow and fine tune your moral compass how do you strike a balance? Do you try to emphasize self-awareness, stepping outside one's comfort zone / vacuum, more education? Does learning more about psychology and sociology help? Do you emphasize the need to have complete personal comfort and a certain amount of selfishness before you can help make a difference? Do you work on humility? Do higher morals lead to greater happiness? Or do you simply not care?

I don't feel there's a single right answer, but curious how others feel.
yup, there is no single answer. real life is tough. many theist's self help stuff is very good, as good as any atheists anyway. I think many fundy theists and anti-religious socialist need to understand that different strokes for different folks. meaning, that because one feels one's way is best doesn't mean it is. If you ever coached, taught, or even have a few kids, you know that.

You also bring up a great point. There are general rules we like to follow that do not account for people's personality. list the personality traits of a fundy. They match perfectly the personality trait of a milli-mental. what formed these brains? abuse? addiction, and mental illness in my opinion.

personality types express the belief. many, and I mean many, can't understand that that or flat refuse to approach the problem with that understanding. It really would put a damper on milli's revenge and fundy's power to shout down people.
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Old 12-06-2017, 03:32 AM
 
7,588 posts, read 4,157,568 times
Reputation: 6946
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumbo10 View Post
The Golden Rule ("Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.") is often referenced when morals are discussed but I don't think it's enough. It doesn't work when you get varying beliefs and personality types. An evangelical can bring up the fear of hell and the atheist can bring up that therapy may be needed for neurosis. Both are honestly trying to help each other yet neither is going to get very far, and will just generate angst.

There's also the Platinum Rule "Treat others the way they want to be treated." Sounds nice, yet doesn't work well with narcissists and other personality types, especially the fringe.

So if you want to grow and fine tune your moral compass how do you strike a balance? Do you try to emphasize self-awareness, stepping outside one's comfort zone / vacuum, more education? Does learning more about psychology and sociology help? Do you emphasize the need to have complete personal comfort and a certain amount of selfishness before you can help make a difference? Do you work on humility? Do higher morals lead to greater happiness? Or do you simply not care?

I don't feel there's a single right answer, but curious how others feel.
The Golden Rule is an adage. It usually has to follow a story or be put into context. Then it can be analyzed for its "truthfulness." We then test it in other situations to see how it can be applied. What I have found is that when people learn new adages, they cherry pick situations where the lesson can be applied.
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Old 12-06-2017, 03:40 AM
 
Location: S. Wales.
50,087 posts, read 20,691,451 times
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It's a starting point. It the basis of what some have argued is a particularly human trait or capacity that other animals don't seem to have and that is to put yourself in the place of others and wonder "How would I like that if it was done to me?" I rather think that it is the sense that enables us to experience the dark thrill of Horror films and Shadenfraude. It all gets very complicated, but it needs to be. Society is complex.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bulmabriefs144 View Post
The Platinum Rule I've heard about. The problem is, that you are absolutely right, it sets you up for narcissists and selfish jerks to exploit you. It took all of 5 months to reject that idea.

The ideal is the Golden Rule plus proper boundaries. "Love your neighbor as yourself" wasn't just a retelling of the Golden Rule. If you love yourself, you don't take **** from other people, you are able to tell them, "I don't deserve this kind of treatment," and demand better. And loving your neighbor means you don't trespass on others.
Yes. That, as you saw, had to be and Amendment to the Rule, otherwise the Golden Rule could become a controller's charter. As I suspect the Gospel version of it is intended to be.

"If as a Christian, you would want that, supposing you were not yet a Christian, Christians would come and convert you, then the Rule is that you should convert others, as that is what is good for them, whether they know it or not". That the way the Gospel version runs, Not the more general "If a person doesn't want me to do this or that to them, I won't do it".
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Old 12-06-2017, 07:41 AM
 
Location: Northeastern US
19,958 posts, read 13,455,445 times
Reputation: 9911
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
3. Better yet, visit a third world country if you can...or as close as you can. Thailand may not be quite third world, but it's definitely not first world. I learned more about life there than I did any other part of my life. Don't just hang out at the American style hotels and restaurants. Talk to everyday people. Take an interest in their lives. Visit small villages, not just big cities. There's a whole world out there that doesn't revolved around you and your country. Learn about other cultures independently; don't rely on a news channel or book.
I can't say enough good things about this advice.

My family vacationed in Vietnam (entirely in the North, including the rural North where we overnighted with a local family). We experienced the kindness and friendliness of people first hand who made us feel welcome and appreciated despite that their term for the "Vietnam war" is "the American war of aggression". We saw their museums in which the focus was on the depredations and suffering of their people under the French, a bit of history we NEVER hear of. We saw war veterans with missing body parts who had every right to be resentful of Americans who were equally nice.

You can't have these experiences and not think differently and more accurately about history. And it has helped me to internalize the fact that my country has its own propaganda, its own agenda, its own secrets and inconvenient truths. It is not "my country, right or wrong".
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Old 12-06-2017, 08:50 AM
 
678 posts, read 429,193 times
Reputation: 316
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
You're being too picky, IMHO, in re the Golden Rule. It's a simple concept, and I don't think anyone ever thought it was the answer to every situation or odd ball types of people.

My recipe:

1. Stop constantly multi-tasking and be truly mindful (a concept taught in Buddhism) on your interactions with others. Have real conversations with as many different kinds of people as possible, and make it a situation where you learn more than you "teach".

2. Get out of your comfort zone. Way out of your comfort zone. If you live in the Washington, D.C. suburbs, for example, spend some time up at Dupont Circle and don't just think how weird everyone is...interact. Walk around Adams Morgan neighborhood.

3. Better yet, visit a third world country if you can...or as close as you can. Thailand may not be quite third world, but it's definitely not first world. I learned more about life there than I did any other part of my life. Don't just hang out at the American style hotels and restaurants. Talk to everyday people. Take an interest in their lives. Visit small villages, not just big cities. There's a whole world out there that doesn't revolved around you and your country. Learn about other cultures independently; don't rely on a news channel or book.
We share some values. Curious if you too grew up in a smallish, homogenous town, pushed your limits instead of staying put like most and feel you have grown because of it.
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