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Christians have been told all their lives that Isaiah 53 perfectly describes Jesus. They've been told so many times that Isaiah 53 proves Jesus was God because he was prophesied in Isaiah 53 that they cannot think about Isaiah 53 without thinking about Jesus.
But Isaiah is not about Jesus at all. It only APPEARS to be because it's propaganda devised by the early church leaders to brainwash you into believing that.
On first glance, Isaiah 53 seems to be perfectly describing the story of Jesus' crucifixion and character because that's how the story of Jesus has evolved over the 100 years the gospels were being written and re-written. But notice the "he" in Isaiah 53 never uses the name, "Jesus". It never uses the term, "Messiah".
In actuality the "he" is perfectly identified in Isaiah 52 and other books of the Old Testament.
It is Israel.
There is so much proof Isaiah 42-53 is NOT about Jesus that I cannot possibly post it all in this post No 1. I will add all the proof to this thread as the conversation goes along.
I don't see what the problem is.
You don't see Jesus as Savior anyway - so why would you see Him here?
You are right that Isaiah is referring to what is occurring in His day. However, there are similarities here and there to what Jesus went through during his stay on the earth. Isaiah likely wasn't aware of Jesus, but God was.
I will go with Israel being the suffering servant because of the fact that they are, I also see Jesus as a suffering servant as Israel.....I see Jesus coming as the suffering servant that not all people accepted, and then the entire nation became the suffering servant.
Last edited by Hannibal Flavius; 09-05-2018 at 12:39 PM..
You've got to be kidding. Thrill has posted so much evidence about the errors and fallibility of the Bible in totality, that you'd have to be purposely avoiding Thrill's posts to have missed it all.
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Originally Posted by BaptistFundie
where?
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Originally Posted by TroutDude
The trick is opening your eyes. Then the bigger one is opening your mind.
Rotsa ruck.
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Originally Posted by Pleroo
I know, I know. You don’t accept anything anyone says that does not conform to your beliefs in an inerrant infallible Bible.
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Originally Posted by BaptistFundie
as if you DO accept antying that goes against your preconceived ideas.
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Originally Posted by Pleroo
You do know I was a card-carrying fundamentalist-type Christian for the majority of my life. So, yeah, I did finally have to accept things that went against that indoctrination. It’s not easy, BF, but a little courage and desire for truth goes a long way.
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Originally Posted by BaptistFundie
And now you're just as fundamentalist, but you have a different set of beliefs. Ones that won't be changed by reading an internet message board.
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Originally Posted by Pleroo
I know what it does NOT make sense to believe (among other things, that a God who is love would require a brutal blood sacrifice in order to forgive or would torment people for eternity for any reason, including their unbelief in such heinous doctrines). Beyond that, it’s all fair game.
Explain how that is fundamentalism, please.
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Originally Posted by BaptistFundie
You have your beliefs that you are quite convinced of. No Scripture, no evidence will convince you otherwise. You know what you know, and nothing will change your mind. That is very typical of a fundamentalist.
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Originally Posted by Pleroo
If anyone can explain to me how it makes sense that a God who is love would torment people for eternity with no hope of reprieve, I would believe it was possible. I would not love or worship such a being but I would accept it was possible.
So, go ahead. Explain that belief in a rational way.
Good exchange, Pleroo! I am afraid you will be waiting a very long time before anyone succeeds in answering your question!
If you are Jewish and accept the predominant position -you definitely believe Jesus is not the messiah
But I have not seen anybody else to step up to take the job
As to inspired works of course it is -portions that is - so is Quran & sutras of Buddhism
They all are
They can't step up because they can't fulfill any of the Messianic prophecies.
Good exchange, Pleroo! I am afraid you will be waiting a very long time before anyone succeeds in answering your question!
And you're as fundy as anyone else. You have your beliefs, and you don't base these beliefs on any actual evidence other than what you know to be "true". So really, you ought to call yourself "FundyPhD".
OK. Whatever. You're as way out there as anyone on this forum. I'm just done with your silly, stupid, off-base, nonsensical posts. I'm done.
Is that because you can't hold with sound doctrine? I quote Jesus and you contradict Jesus? I quote Paul and you contradict Paul? I don't blame you for not wanting to talk to me, I will put scripture after scripture up that contradicts everything you believe.....
We could put the actual covenant up just to see how it doesn't involve you in the least.
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