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Old 09-11-2018, 03:20 AM
 
Location: PRC
6,956 posts, read 6,880,495 times
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As far as I can see, these are the requirements, but I am sure there are many academic papers on this type of thing.

1) Some group activities and support involving others who have the same beliefs. Physical community.
2) A set of morals, rules or laws to live by.
3) Some belief in a supreme being who has control over the uncontrollable/illogical world we live in. We need to make sense of it all.
4) Some belief, hope or promise for existence after physical death.
5) A belief in being 'chosen' or in some way 'special' over others not of this belief.

A belief in almost anything aliens, Father Christmas, Spongebob, etc can do these things so why have we chosen our particular flavor of belief? What does ours give us that others do not? Or..is it just that someone or some group you respect and admire introduced you or had the same belief?
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Old 09-11-2018, 04:36 AM
bUU
 
Location: Florida
12,074 posts, read 10,709,672 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocpaul20 View Post
1) Some group activities and support involving others who have the same beliefs. Physical community.
2) A set of morals, rules or laws to live by.
3) Some belief in a supreme being who has control over the uncontrollable/illogical world we live in. We need to make sense of it all.
4) Some belief, hope or promise for existence after physical death.
5) A belief in being 'chosen' or in some way 'special' over others not of this belief.
It's a good list, but there are belief systems that belie most of those items.

For example, in #3, the word "being" precludes myriad belief systems that don't personify divinity, and the concept of "control" denies even the Clock-maker analogy that some folks' belief system relies on. #5 isn't a requirement but rather solely a common characteristic among some of the older belief systems.

I think #2 is safe, and #4 is broad enough that it won't violate too many belief systems. For #1, I'm not sure if it is a requirement of belief systems or rather just a requirement for something to be acknowledged as such.
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Old 09-11-2018, 04:47 AM
 
Location: Willamette Valley, Oregon
6,830 posts, read 3,222,483 times
Reputation: 11577
Quote:
Originally Posted by ocpaul20 View Post
As far as I can see, these are the requirements, but I am sure there are many academic papers on this type of thing.

1) Some group activities and support involving others who have the same beliefs. Physical community.
2) A set of morals, rules or laws to live by.
3) Some belief in a supreme being who has control over the uncontrollable/illogical world we live in. We need to make sense of it all.
4) Some belief, hope or promise for existence after physical death.
5) A belief in being 'chosen' or in some way 'special' over others not of this belief.

A belief in almost anything aliens, Father Christmas, Spongebob, etc can do these things so why have we chosen our particular flavor of belief? What does ours give us that others do not? Or..is it just that someone or some group you respect and admire introduced you or had the same belief?

1. I have a few good friends, but we don't do any "group activities".
2. I have strong moral/ethical standards that guide me everyday.
3. I have no belief in a supreme being. I have control over myself. Sometimes things don't make sense. I'm fine with that.
4. I have no belief in an after life. When your dead, your dead, end of game, thanks for playing.
5. I'm unique, but I'm not chosen or special. What, am I 4 years old?
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Old 09-11-2018, 07:02 AM
 
Location: S. Wales.
50,088 posts, read 20,738,332 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocpaul20 View Post
As far as I can see, these are the requirements, but I am sure there are many academic papers on this type of thing.

1) Some group activities and support involving others who have the same beliefs. Physical community.
2) A set of morals, rules or laws to live by.
3) Some belief in a supreme being who has control over the uncontrollable/illogical world we live in. We need to make sense of it all.
4) Some belief, hope or promise for existence after physical death.
5) A belief in being 'chosen' or in some way 'special' over others not of this belief.

A belief in almost anything aliens, Father Christmas, Spongebob, etc can do these things so why have we chosen our particular flavor of belief? What does ours give us that others do not? Or..is it just that someone or some group you respect and admire introduced you or had the same belief?
I'm glad to see that you exclude atheism as a 'belief system', never mind a "religion" as we have no belief in a Supreme being, supposedly able to think, plan and execute (in the Old days, it was mainly execute ) though we would sign up to points 1 and 2 and none of the others.

Btw, shouldn't there be some kind of Book of Dogma in there? I can't think of a religion that doesn't have one, apart from those where they couldn't write.

"A belief in almost anything aliens, Father Christmas, Spongebob," Yes indeed. This is why Scientology, Raelians and indeed Buddhism are all religions, as they have Quasi -gods as the focus of Dogmatic belief - some kind of conscious and hands -on entity (e.g Karma, Thetans or space -aliens) that has to be propitiated in order to gain benefits or at least avoid trouble, both in this life and a possible next one.
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Old 09-11-2018, 09:03 AM
 
Location: Southwestern, USA, now.
21,020 posts, read 19,393,070 times
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Requirements? Didn't quite get that?
I believe in what I have experienced/ have been shown.
I see it or I test what I've read, then, I believe it...until shown otherwise....
usually
a blossoming of the original belief.

Not that I have to personally test that we are 99.99999% empty space...it's
already been tested many times.
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Old 09-11-2018, 09:03 AM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
17,071 posts, read 10,926,004 times
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Interesting:
1. I do enjoy fellowship with people who share many of the same values, but we disagree on many elements and I don't consider it worth arguing about.

2. Just one principle: community, what it takes to have a just and committed community that is open.

I guess I can tick off those two as "close enough."

3. I believe that there is a spirit (whatever that may be) that impels humans toward that community. You may call it "instinct" if you wish.

That probably won't qualify

4. I'm not hung up on life after death, but it would be cool. "Gravy" so to speak.

Fail

5. "Chosen?" Well, lucky enough to find a sort of purpose in communicating what I believe to be important. Not all that good at it, but "chosen?"

Fail

Well, shoot. Either I'm not happy with my belief system or there is something wrong with your expectations.
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Old 09-11-2018, 04:54 PM
 
Location: PRC
6,956 posts, read 6,880,495 times
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I think basically I am asking what we want from our belief system to make us feel comfortable in it.

...And then whether what we have fullfills those 'wants' or whether we are still looking for more. A kind-of critical examination of what we believe, although I am not sure that those who believe Faith is a big part of their beliefs will want to examine theirs that closely.

This kind of truthful critical examination could be rather uncomfortable for some perhaps?

My list above probably wont suit many people except for possibly the more orthodox religions, because thats all I know about or have experience in, in earlier times.
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Old 09-11-2018, 06:40 PM
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
31,373 posts, read 20,195,004 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocpaul20 View Post
As far as I can see, these are the requirements, but I am sure there are many academic papers on this type of thing.

1) Some group activities and support involving others who have the same beliefs. Physical community.
2) A set of morals, rules or laws to live by.
3) Some belief in a supreme being who has control over the uncontrollable/illogical world we live in. We need to make sense of it all.
4) Some belief, hope or promise for existence after physical death.
5) A belief in being 'chosen' or in some way 'special' over others not of this belief.

A belief in almost anything aliens, Father Christmas, Spongebob, etc can do these things so why have we chosen our particular flavor of belief? What does ours give us that others do not? Or..is it just that someone or some group you respect and admire introduced you or had the same belief?

1) Nope.
2) Not inscribed anywhere. "Honour life" might be it.
3) Nope.
4) Hope. I reckon that's shared even among most atheists.
5) Nope.
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Old 09-11-2018, 06:41 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
17,071 posts, read 10,926,004 times
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Well, hey, it's a good start. Doesn't look like it's catching on, though. "comfortable" might be the operative term.
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Old 09-11-2018, 06:44 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
17,071 posts, read 10,926,004 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TroutDude View Post
1) Nope.
2) Not inscribed anywhere. "Honour life" might be it.
3) Nope.
4) Hope. I reckon that's shared even among most atheists.
5) Nope.
Good, but I wonder if it could not be expanded; say for #1 "No, but I do feel a connection to nature and the life around me" if you see what I mean?
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