What was God's original plan for mankind? (salvation, Buddhism, Buddha)
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God does Not make plans as we do, rather God has a purpose.
God's purpose started right after sin entered Eden as per Genesis 3:15.
Right away God purposed a coming 'seed ' (Messiah) to redeem fallen mankind.
Jesus proved to be that promised seed or Messiah to undo all the damage Satan and Adam caused us.
Just because we have not yet seen the fulfillment of Jeremiah 33:6; Revelation 22:2 does Not mean it will Not happen.
The Corona virus is showing us we are close in the time foretold at Luke 21:11 ( pestilences )
This is leading up to the time of 1st Thess. 5:2-3 when the powers that be will be saying, " Peace and Security...." which will prove to be the precursor to the coming great tribulation of Rev. 7:14,9 before Jesus, as Prince of Peace, will be the one who will usher in global Peace on Earth among persons of goodwill.
And why did he allow sin to enter Eden in the first place?
If we are Gods 'children'...parents are supposed to protect their children from the wolves...NOT allow the wolf to come right in and start talking to them!! Parents are responsible for their childrens safety, (in this case, physically and spiritually).
Its funny, after Adam and Eve 'took the bite of the apple', they were kicked out of Eden and were not permitted to re-enter, (its said an angel with a flaming sword guarded the entrance)...well, where was this guard when the snake entered Eden?!! (keep in mind, Satan had FALLEN by this time, he was kicked out of heaven, so how in the world did he even gain access to Eden?)
*This implies that Satan serves a purpose and has a function, (meaning he did NOT 'rebel').
And why did he allow sin to enter Eden in the first place?
If we are Gods 'children'...parents are supposed to protect* their children from the wolves...NOT allow the wolf to come right in and start talking to them!! Parents are responsible *for their children's safety,
(in this case, physically and spiritually).
Its funny, after Adam and Eve 'took the bite of the apple', they were kicked out of Eden and were not permitted to re-enter, (its said an angel with a flaming sword guarded the entrance)... well, where was this guard when the snake entered Eden?!!*
(keep in mind, Satan had FALLEN by this time, he was kicked out of heaven, so how in the world did he even gain access to Eden?)*
*This implies that Satan serves a purpose and has a function, (meaning he did NOT 'rebel').
This is a classic observation.
Except you went a step further, bravo* - satan had a purpose. My word for satan and Judas would be they had a part to play, they had a role, actors on a stage.
Now, since I have no answer to these important and astute questions --My answer would be:
This story is not true or inaccurate or a metaphor for the ego entering or just plain made up by Man's mind to put
the blame on God, yet again ....instead of taking responsibility for his own mistakes, blunders --(I personally never call sin).
And why did he allow sin to enter Eden in the first place?
Because he wanted to. My guess is that it demonstrates his goodness that he is willing to redeem his people even though they rebel and sin against him. In the long run he is glorified.
Quote:
If we are Gods 'children'...parents are supposed to protect their children from the wolves...NOT allow the wolf to come right in and start talking to them!! Parents are responsible for their childrens safety, (in this case, physically and spiritually).
I never once met a single person with no kids that wasn't a parenting and marriage expert. Likewise, it's amazing how many people seem to be able to tell exactly what God should do and how he should do it.
Quote:
Its funny, after Adam and Eve 'took the bite of the apple', they were kicked out of Eden and were not permitted to re-enter, (its said an angel with a flaming sword guarded the entrance)...well, where was this guard when the snake entered Eden?!! (keep in mind, Satan had FALLEN by this time, he was kicked out of heaven, so how in the world did he even gain access to Eden?)
*This implies that Satan serves a purpose and has a function, (meaning he did NOT 'rebel').
I don't follow. God kicked him out of Heaven, but then yes, he did allow him into the garden. And yes, he did lead Adam astray.
Because he wanted to. My guess is that it demonstrates his goodness that he is willing to redeem his people even though they rebel and sin against him. In the long run he is glorified.
I never once met a single person with no kids that wasn't a parenting and marriage expert. Likewise, it's amazing how many people seem to be able to tell exactly what God should do and how he should do it.
I don't follow. God kicked him out of Heaven, but then yes, he did allow him into the garden. And yes, he did lead Adam astray.
If Eden was hard to get into...how did Satan enter, in order to tempt Adam and Eve?
And before you reply by saying that God allowed Satan to enter Eden...remember that God had just kicked him out of Heaven, for his rebellion, where he took a 1/3 of the angels with him...
Do you really believe, after doing what Satan did in heaven, God would allow him to enter Eden, (where his 2 most beloved creations were residing)?!!! Cmon, that is not realistic.
Adam and Eve could still have made their own decisions, had satan not been present in Eden, so free will would not be impacted.
Where did you get the idea that God is omnipotent because He isn't.
For example: God can Not lie, so there are things that God can Not do - Titus 1:2: Hebrews 6:8
God did Not fail, rather Adam and Satan failed.
God is No BULLY so if He would have destroyed Adam and Eve right away we would Not be here.
Actually Adam and Eve destroyed themselves by choosing to Break God's Law.
God was straightforward at Genesis 2:17 if you break the Law you will die.
There was No footnote, No fine print to slip anybody up.
Both Jesus and the man Job under adverse conditions proved Satan a liar, and so can we.
Satan challenges all of us ' touch our flesh....' (loose physical health ) and we would Not serve God - Job 2:4-5.
Jesus as Messiah will achieve God's intentions such as found at Jeremiah 33:6; Revelation 22:2.
The reason we are all invited to pray the invitation of Rev. 22:20 for Jesus to come is to undo all the damage Adam caused.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew 4:4
Where did you get the idea that God is omnipotent because He isn't.
Ummm, that would be the BIBLE.
Rev.19
[6] And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew 4:4
For example: God can Not lie, so there are things that God can Not do - Titus 1:2: Hebrews 6:8
God can't lie, but apparently the Bible can lie. Which is kinda the same thing.
Originally Posted by thrillobyte My thought is God was bored one eternity and decided to make man so He could watch a 1 billion year-long comedy. ..............
Basically, that was my 'experience' ...in other words, I'm not smart enough to have figured this out like you did.
I was shown this..like a download into my brain.
However, what I was shown - not a comedy at all... An EPIC play that goes on and on.
A Cosmic Play with actors on a stage playing multiple parts over and over.
With tragedy and triumph, Love and lose - Wars won and brutal - pain and healing....oh my. A sit-com? ...Oh no. Boring for eternity, my friend!
Pls, pls, dear God, No ...you really didn't say that....
Only if the Bible is God's word. If the Bible is NOT God's word, than it is simply the word of man (ancient men - written by roughly 35 different HUMAN authors) and we have every right to expect the Bible to be just as contradictory and confused as the humans who wrote it were contradictory and confused.
Because he wanted to. My guess is that it demonstrates his goodness that he is willing to redeem his people even though they rebel and sin against him. In the long run he is glorified.
So ... it's the classic case of "breaking your leg to sell you a crutch" kind of thing. Arsonists like doing the same thing: they'll start a fire and then a little later they'll run into the house and save the endangered baby. Wow. He's a hero!
It's amazing to me the mental gymnastics that are done in order to defend the indefensible, to rationalize an action that is clearly wrong or immoral - even to the point of painting God as some kind of Mafia soldier who demands protection money to prevent the Mafia soldier himself from breaking your leg and tossing your store. In the end, the Mafia soldier is glorified.
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Originally Posted by BaptistFundie
I never once met a single person with no kids that wasn't a parenting and marriage expert.
That's because no one is a marriage or parenting expert - kids or not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BaptistFundie
Likewise, it's amazing how many people seem to be able to tell exactly what God should do and how he should do it.
I agree ... so Christians should stop trying to tell us what God wants, what he's doing, why he's doing it, and making more speculation than at a "guess the number of M&Ms in this jar" contest. My guess is as good as yours, after all. But that's the beauty of dealing with a god - you can pretty much make up anything and claim it's true or probably true and no one has to prove anything at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BaptistFundie
God kicked him out of Heaven, but then yes, he did allow him into the garden. And yes, he did lead Adam astray.
Yes, God kicked Satan out of Heaven because Satan and his little cadre of angels rebelled.
They, uh, rebelled ... somehow ... despite Heaven being perfect.
I mean ... what did Satan think he was going to get out of it? An even more perfect perfect Heaven? Especially since God ruling over Heaven was part of the perfection therefore Satan wanting to take God's place as ruler of Heaven is ... well ... stupid. Because it was already perfect with God in charge ergo there would be no reason for Satan to rebel and no reason for Satan to want to take over Heaven.
That's the problem with dealing with absolute superlatives. You always end up with everyone trying to square the circle. It makes 0% sense.
Also, there is ZERO evidence that the serpent in the garden was Satan. None at all. Everyone just assumes that the serpent was Satan yet there is a lot of evidence in folklore leading up to Hebrew mythology that shows why the serpent is just a serpent. Of course, that leaves the question of why this particular snake could talk while none of the others could.
But silly me -- to expect the Bible to make sense. Oops, my bad!
Anyway:
No, Eve led Adam astray. Because women are spiritually weak, easily corrupted, and have the power of sexual seduction (sex is at the heart of most things having to do with Christianity). At least that's how men thought of women in that horribly misogynistic, ultra-patriarchal society. The Bible is replete with instances of an innocent, righteous, godly man being brought down by a woman - usually foreign - because, well, women don't have any dangling bits.
There are two strange little oddities about the Adam and Eve myth that I always found interesting.
First, Eve was the first person to eat the forbidden fruit (which was most likely a pomegranate not an apple) and yet God didn't fly off the handle and egregiously and hyperbolically overreact until Adam ate it. Second, if you really pay attention reading that story, you'll notice that God gave Adam the warning about eating from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil and *THEN* created Eve - which means Eve had no idea whatsoever that she wasn't supposed to eat the fruit from that tree.
But that makes sense, you might say. That's why God waited until Adam ate the fruit before bouncing off the walls with psychopathic rage - Eve couldn't be blamed because she didn't know!
Okay, good guess. But no.
For one thing, the Bible makes it abundantly clear that what a woman does or thinks is less valuable in God's eyes than anything you'd find at the very bottom of a garbage dump. You see this all the time. For instance, the 10th commandment says "thou shalt not covet they neighbor's wife." But it makes no mention AT ALL of coveting your neighbor's husband - no, it just moves on to other pieces of property like oxen, camels, and other animals that share the same name as a person's backside. It goes on to say "... or anything that belongs to your neighbor." Aha! So it becomes clearer. The wife **belongs** to the husband, but since the husband doesn't belong to the wife, it doesn't matter what the little missus does. She's just a woman, after all. Trust me, there are so many examples of these "little" oversights that make it very plain that women just don't matter.
Another problem - the creation of Eve was an afterthought. Granted, it's difficult to judge time in a book that didn't seem to care about it, but there are some clues. For instance, one of the things Adam had to do before Eve was created was to name all the animals. Well ... assuming Adam did not eat, sleep, go to the bathroom, or take any breaks, it would have taken Adam roughly 3 months to name all of them. And that's him rattling off one name after the other without pausing to think of any of the names. However, if this is actually the beginning of creation, it means NO animal has gone extinct yet - which means the 99% of all creatures that have gone extinct by our time would still exist in Adam's time. So, if naming 1% of the animals takes 3 months, naming the other 99% would take ... a little under 25 years.
So, that means Eve wasn't created for another 25 YEARS after Adam. But, we can assume realitically that Adam didn't sit there for 25 years naming animals without even eating a fig or drinking some of that crystal clear Eden water, right? So it's more likely Eve wasn't created until 40 or 50 years after the creation of Adam. Well, that has to be one of the biggest and longest afterthoughts in cosmic history.
Maybe God noticed those fully-formed dangly bits hanging between Adam's naked legs and said to himself, "Well, hmm... I made that thing to fit into *something* but I can't for the life of me remember what ..." Then half a century later, God snaps his fingers and exclaims, "Now I remember! A woman! That, uh, one-eyed snake is supposed to fit into the woman's, uh ... grass!" At which point the whole rib nonsense happens.
But it just goes to show you how meaningless women were in the Bible. So meaningless, in fact, that God couldn't have cared less if Eve ate the forbidden fruit. She could've eaten that tree bare and God would've done nothing. It only mattered when Adam sunk his teeth into that delicious pomegranate - at which point God went absolutely postal (as if he didn't see this all coming in the first place).
So yeah, it was all Eve's fault. I'm sure the story was written that way so we could blame sin and evil on women - because for thousands of years afterwards, women were considered 2nd class citizens in nearly every culture and religion around the world - and even today women are still fighting for full equality. All thanks to religion. Women? We should all thank religion for 3,000 years of prejudice, sexism, and misogyny. Ready, girls? On the count of three ...
Or, maybe we can put off thanking religion for another 50 years and call it ... an afterthought.
Last edited by Shirina; 03-19-2020 at 03:51 PM..
Reason: My post was an afterthought so I have to wait 50+ years to post it - after I name the animals.
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