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I think it's unfortunate Rosemary has decided to no longer contribute here. Hers was a refreshing Christian voice compared to the vapid fundie whining we endure from the usual suspects.
I suspect that she'l come back after she's had a think about it. I hope so.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
I can't speak for other religions because I've never been a part of them. I don't discount other faiths have supernatural experiences, although it is probably fueled from the demonic realm. I know what I've seen and witnessed is very real.
Are you so smug and arrogant in your beliefs that you just can't accept there is a possibility that I'm on the side of truth? You have built up such a resistance that even something as beautiful as praising God becomes dark and ugly to you. The same God that you spit on gave you many gifts like the ability to share laughter, taste buds to enjoy many flavors, delicate ears to enjoy a variety of sounds and music.
Imagine if you are Satan and you hate God so much that you want ruin the lives of as many of His precious humans as possible. A brilliant way to do this is to create a lot of false religions, even pseudo Christian ones to confuse and deceive many.
But here's the rub. If you did a side by side comparison of Christianity to other religious with all the various evidences, the scales would tip heavily to support Christianity. The evidences are numerous. You just choose to ignore them. One telltale difference is other religions are action based. Go here, do this ritual, do this physical action. That's the way a human's brain would think. If someone invented Christianity, they would have made it all about performing physical actions to appease a god too. Not forming a relationship where the path ahead is never clear.
What you have seen and witnessed may be real (though we have reason to believe that people are very good at deluding themselves) but why should you think that it all the others that are Demonic and not yours? If you compare Christianity with the others, Christianity rather fails in comparison with Buddhism, or Jain for instance. Any nicer aspects that it has taken on is rather than to to western society and ethical values, which have been brought about by science and humanist thought, often in the teeth of resistance by Christians of a particular type. And I'm pointing the finger at you, Jeff.
I don't blame you so much as i see a solid guy there, but the hate -filled and reactionary Christianity that you profess does not make Christianity look good in comparison with other faiths, and it doesn't make you look good either.
Imagine that you are Satan, and you want to do Christianity and the world as much harm as possible. Wouldn't you pick fundamentalist Christianity, rather than ther more tolerant and adaptable versions of it?
Y'all keep trying to turn this into a personal attack, and that's just wrong. You've accused Christians in general (and apparently, us posters in particular) of being everything from illiterate Bible thumpers to gullible morons.
That's not a reasonable approach to any conversation and betrays a serious lack of respect.
For the record, this "illiterate Bible thumper" (that'd be moi) is the author of nine books (non-fiction). My books and I have been featured on NPR (repeatedly), BBC radio, PBS, and more. But the very fact that I have to defend myself thusly on a public forum is reason enough to shake the dust from my feet and leave.
If you met me at a dinner party, you'd be besotted with my credentials, intellect and professional accomplishments. Intellectuals and academic types love me, and I'm a lot of fun.
But if you spoke to me in real life the way you've spoken to me here, I'd ask the hostess for my coat and take my leave.
And for that very reason, I'll take my leave of this conversation.
Considering that I've heard christians literally condemn people to hell...don't whine about a "personal attack" about "bible thumpers" and "gullible morons". Condeming people to hell is a lot more of a "serious lack of respect" than the adjectives you brought up.
Considering that I've heard christians literally condemn people to hell...don't whine about a "personal attack" about "bible thumpers" and "gullible morons". Condeming people to hell is a lot more of a "serious lack of respect" than the adjectives you brought up.
Be fair; you've also heard a lot of Christians on this forum who do NOT condemn people to hell reprimand other Christians for doing so. You can't apply that type of thinking with a broad brush.
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi
What kind of author uses the word "thusly"?
One who has authored a number of books, apparently.
I looked it up. It's not "wrong", but some people consider it redundant since "thus" is sufficient as an adverb.
Maybe it's important to view the matter in this context, separating into individual components:
A. Private and personal faith and belief
B. Organized Religion
Unfortunately alot of people who fall under A belong to a B. B develops a life of it's own and takes it's "show on the road" so to speak.
With science, it might be akin to A.I. being developed in robotics, with individual machines keeping to themselves and better performing tasks as a result (category B). If a machine (or machines) became "self aware" and recruited other machines, you might have anything from them asking for better work conditions and more "oil" breaks to the "Terminator" (Category B). An "Atheist" self aware machine might break free and open its own shop, or get caught in an "improvement and effiency" loop program...
Organized Religion provides "Platform", "Vehicle" and "Infrastructure" to enable the events you speak of Shirina to take place. In contrast, Atheism is a position of non-belief and personal/intellectual independence. It is also fact and evidence based. For these reasons Atheism my be more insular, possibly only coming out of the woodworks when its core components are threatened or challenged, or when it sees social injustice, etc.
It is indeed more difficult to organize a group of independent free thinkers. Not that people of faith who may keep it more on a private and personal level are not independent free thinkers, but the contention obviously occurs if they participate in a "platform collective" that take their "show on the road"..
That being said, there may be some non- secular A's here that may wind up getting caught in Atheist crossfire because they have joined in on the argument on an individual basis because they feel faith of any kind is under blanket assault, or they are simply standing too close to a non- secular "B"...
That's just what does happen, I think. But what I think they miss is who is attacking whom. Atheism does not attack agnosticism, or even irreligious theism. They only feel threatened and so attack us and find themselves alongside the theists.
Theism however, Is attacking agnosticism, because it is not the right Kind of Theism.
The fact is that agnostics (irreligious theists) are on the wrong side, but they feel threatened by atheism because we don't credit the god -claim and they do.
Be fair; you've also heard a lot of Christians on this forum who do NOT condemn people to hell reprimand other Christians for doing so. You can't apply that type of thinking with a broad brush.
One who has authored a number of books, apparently.
I looked it up. It's not "wrong", but some people consider it redundant since "thus" is sufficient as an adverb.
I never said all christians, and in several posts I've said very positive things about christians I have known. Nevertheless, I heard a number of christians condemn other to hell. Period.
I'll happily paint with a broad brush when it comes to the christian right.
Considering that I've heard christians literally condemn people to hell...don't whine about a "personal attack" about "bible thumpers" and "gullible morons". Condeming people to hell is a lot more of a "serious lack of respect" than the adjectives you brought up.
What kind of author uses the word "thusly"?
One with more Gutspah than me. I've often wanted to, but never dared.
I think it's unfortunate Rosemary has decided to no longer contribute here. Hers was a refreshing Christian voice compared to the vapid fundie whining we endure from the usual suspects.
Being told you are wrong can feel aweful, unless (like with many fundamentalists) they relish in being told they are wrong, because then (irrationally) in their minds they are even more right. Otherwise, you must retreat to Tax-Exempt Ivory Towers and Singing to One's Own Choir.
I'll happily paint with a broad brush when it comes to the christian right.
When a concerning group is as homogenous and unabashedly brasen (not hesitating to participate in worldly politics and power-struggles/striving) as that, why not broadly paint exactly what they make themselves into?
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One with more Gutspah than me. I've often wanted to, but never dared.
