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how do you know gods doesn't have a beginning or end?
why is that a requirement?
How do I "know"?
No, I don't know.
It's my belief in faith that if there is a God out there then one of his characteristic is that he must not have a beginning or an end - otherwise it's not a God.
If God has a beginning and an end, then you tell me, what was it like BEFORE God?
How God came into being? Does God have a creator?
If yes, then who is the creator of God's creator? This loop will never end till you realize that whatever came first, was always there.
Or your other choice is.
There was nothing there before God. An absolute void!
Then the question is,
Did God decide to create himself when he did not exist?
This is also ridiculous. You cannot decide to create your ownself when you don't exist.
what you said was that you are putting me in the "god is everything" camp.
where did I every say that?
and, what type of god did I ever say exists?
I'm not back peddling anything, Arach. I am putting you in that group, because you constantly lump yourself in with them. Whether you believe exactly as they do is irrelevant as far as I am concerned. You say "we" when talking about Mystic, and you seem to have a serious issue with anyone posting anything you don't like towards Mystic... That is why I lump you with them.
At the risk of a false dichotomy, what is the alternative to a living God - a dead one? I rejected all the attributes assigned to God by religious dogma when I began my search to see what attributes actually make sense. The Omni's are self-contradictory and the other poorly thought out attributes by the primitive minds make no sense. It seems they were designed to define a God that defies everything we know about our Reality, IOW "supernatural," as if that makes God more God-like. The idea of existing without living is beyond silly for a conscious Being.
It goes both ways in my opinion and hence there is a slight ambiguity in my mind before attributing "living" to God.
On one hand - "Living" probably comes from "Life" - and we know that if there is a life then there is death too.
So if we "live" and we have "life" then we also have death.
And on the other hand, it seems like this chain will be broken in the AFTERLIFE because we say that will "live" in heaven or in hell, "Forever" - which means in the cosmic world, there is no death. It's only life and living.
That is no more difficult to answer than how did our Reality begin to exist. The favorite answer among your cohort is - "We Don't Know." We just know it does exist.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
At the risk of a false dichotomy, what is the alternative to a living God - a dead one? I rejected all the attributes assigned to God by religious dogma when I began my search to see what attributes actually make sense. The Omni's are self-contradictory and the other poorly thought out attributes by the primitive minds make no sense. It seems they were designed to define a God that defies everything we know about our Reality, IOW "supernatural," as if that makes God more God-like. The idea of existing without living is beyond silly for a conscious Being.
Mystic, at the risk of focusing on one word (but how risky can that be, right!?)... it seems to be a word that has special meaning and significance for you, perhaps over and above what the rest of us assign it. In post after post across multiple threads, I have noticed you consistently capitalize "Reality"... and I am curious what exactly that word means to you?
It's my belief in faith that if there is a God out there then one of his characteristic is that he must not have a beginning or an end - otherwise it's not a God.
If God has a beginning and an end, then you tell me, what was it like BEFORE God?
How God came into being? Does God have a creator?
If yes, then who is the creator of God's creator? This loop will never end till you realize that whatever came first, was always there.
Or your other choice is.
There was nothing there before God. An absolute void!
Then the question is,
Did God decide to create himself when he did not exist?
This is also ridiculous. You cannot decide to create your ownself when you don't exist.
Another possibility is there is no God.
Another is in the world before God things we cannot know can happen.
The very first living cell did not have to have self awareness and was created by chemistry rather than by God.
These are all questions which it seems MysticPhD thinks we shouldn't bother with and just accept what he tells us.
Is there a God and if so where did he come from and when? 8 don't know is the only answer which doesn't require a person to make unfounded assertions.
It's my belief in faith that if there is a God out there then one of his characteristic is that he must not have a beginning or an end - otherwise it's not a God.
If God has a beginning and an end, then you tell me, what was it like BEFORE God?
How God came into being? Does God have a creator?
If yes, then who is the creator of God's creator? This loop will never end till you realize that whatever came first, was always there.
Or your other choice is.
There was nothing there before God. An absolute void!
Then the question is,
Did God decide to create himself when he did not exist?
This is also ridiculous. You cannot decide to create your ownself when you don't exist.
You are mistakenly defining life to be what we experience instead of the eternal life you also believe God has. It is the eternal life that God has that defines our LIVING God and is our eventual destiny. Your attempt to deny that God lives is a self-defeating argument to your avowed faith. God exists as a living God and we (and all our Reality) are mere "cellular" parts of God. We (and all sentient beings) are supposed to reproduce God's consciousness which is eternal.
We are already assuming for the sake of this discussion that there IS a god - so your statement, even though a valid possibility, is out of scope for this discussion.
Quote:
Another is in the world before God things we cannot know can happen.
The very first living cell did not have to have self awareness and was created by chemistry rather than by God.
This is another problem, both scientifically and logically.
The VERY first chemrical reaction that EVER happened THE VERY FIRST ONE - lets say matter collided with anti matter, why wasn't a banana made out of it?
What you are saying is that the "chemical properties of the matter" were in place BEFORE creation of the first cell. Who wrote the rules of chemistry, who gave the properties to matter so the chemistry rules could begin?
Quote:
Is there a God and if so where did he come from and when? 8 don't know is the only answer which doesn't require a person to make unfounded assertions.
That's the point.
By definition, God was ALWAYS there - He did NOT come from anywhere. It was ALWAYS there.
If God came from anywhere then, by faith, it's not God.
We are already assuming for the sake of this discussion that there IS a god - so your statement, even though a valid possibility, is out of scope for this discussion.
This is another problem, both scientifically and logically.
The VERY first chemrical reaction that EVER happened THE VERY FIRST ONE - lets say matter collided with anti matter, why wasn't a banana made out of it?
What you are saying is that the "chemical properties of the matter" were in place BEFORE creation of the first cell. Who wrote the rules of chemistry, who gave the properties to matter so the chemistry rules could begin?
That's the point.
By definition, God was ALWAYS there - He did NOT come from anywhere. It was ALWAYS there.
If God came from anywhere then, by faith, it's not God.
No the thread seems to be "God exists and everything exists because of him " end of discussion. MysticPhD claims it is a trap discussing problems about a God. Perhaps I misunderstood his OP but to me he is asking us to accept a God and all his claims about what he means by that,
No the thread seems to be "God exists and everything exists because of him " end of discussion. MysticPhD claims it is a trap discussing problems about a God. Perhaps I misunderstood his OP but to me he is asking us to accept a God and all his claims about what he means by that,
I am asking people to stop defining and trying to defend God as the Creator and simply accept God as the existing substrate that establishes our EXISTING Reality - the consciousness of God (unified field) - the source of all Being.
I am asking people to stop defining and trying to defend God as the Creator and simply accept God as the existing substrate that establishes our EXISTING Reality - the consciousness of God (unified field) - the source of all Being.
You say "God" we say "Universe". Tomato/Tomahto. We just don't have a need to call something by a different name than it is already known by.
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