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If God exists then He knows where I am. If He wants me He'll come and get me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iwasmadenew
You'll get your wish.
You know this how? He obviously didn't want my son or he would have come to get him - before it was too late!
What value does this god you believe in have in real terms? As I've alluded to above, he/she/it did nothing for my son, not because I didn't believe in him/it/her - his mother was a born again Christian who loved her Lord (to the extent that she felt guilty at times for desiring me) and she prayed for son, believe me, she prayed for her son. The sad thing is, we could have saved him had she not placed all her faith in God. All she had to do is phone me and tell me he was in trouble - I would have done something.
Next in a series, What motivates the 'New Atheist'?
[All comments were made by the same person] *emphasis mine
“my primary purposes here is to say to some christians -- back off. A few christians, even here, who are on a hunting expedition...they want to bag an atheist and convert them (or from some other religion). I simply will not let that stand.”
“ Most important reason to me is to say to christians -- back off and leave people alone. If we want your preaching, we'll ask for it. Second reason -- you don't own this country and have no special status in it.“
“You are the enemy who tries to shove your religion down the throats of people who don't want it.”
"Right wing christians are out for blood (sometimes literally) for anyone that's not like them."
“you're telling us in all these posts that you feel a bit defeated when you're so outnumbered in a forum. Maybe that's a little how we feel when we're so outnumbered in everyday life.”
“Yes, you deserve the grilling you're getting here form numerous posters BECAUSE you are pushing an agenda onto people.”
"you have a Christianity subforum, but I don't see you restricting your postings to that subforum”
“You are right. Most of us do not want to hear "more from what the christians think”.
“This is not a praise forum. You would be closer to that up in the christianity subforum. This is a forum to discuss all forms of religion and spirituality… Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, Paganism, Satanism, tarot cards, crystals... anything spiritual. It is not owned by christians. It belongs to everyone.”
Iwasmadenew, thank you for providing these quotes. That very last quote I believe was written to me in another thread. It was a attack against Christianity to someone who is not even Christian.
This "You are the enemy" business... I don't care who that is said to that is belligerent. That is not coming from someone who wants to build bridges or reach understanding.
These kinds of quotes are designed to accomplish one thing. To intimidate and silence others. I have noticed this in nearly every thread on this forum.
If this is New Atheism, I do not support it at all.
Actually it is the subject of this thread. Those laws, for example, are still on the books.
And the aim of new atheism -- in my view -- is to put religion in its place. And it has a place. In churches. In homes. In minds. But it has no place in politics. It has no place in schools that serve a multicultural (including a multi-religious) population. Our nation is based on separation of church and state. Separation. It's perfectly all right for religionists to vote their conscience, which is based on their religion, but in my view it is not all right for churches to be lobbying politicians with their fists full of greenbacks.
I will agree with you there has to be a separation of church and state. Use your vote to elect leaders you like and who support your views on those laws.
You said that New Atheism allows for religion in churches and homes. What about on this forum? We're not politicians here (that I am aware of anyways). What about when just average people get together to discuss here? Its ok to attack individuals because they might be spiritual?
I will agree with you there has to be a separation of church and state. Use your vote to elect leaders you like and who support your views on those laws.
You said that New Atheism allows for religion in churches and homes. What about on this forum? We're not politicians here (that I am aware of anyways). What about when just average people get together to discuss here? Its ok to attack individuals because they might be spiritual?
Is it okay to tell non-believers they are going to hell?
I'm not getting too carried away. Because the irreligion (None) campaign isn't abut atheism but about non -(organised) religion. That is, atheists, agnostics, pagans and even the religious who see the value of no one religion have authority ver the others are part of it.
Which is why I say that we are all allies or should be, because we have the same objective - equal rights for those of any religion or none.
But still those who should be in the campaig with us oppose us and even end up supporting those who would take away their right to think Differently - just because they are not atheists.
I am not in this "campaign" of yours. I do not speak for other NeoPagans, I only speak for myself but I would not join a campaign that seeks to silence others for being spiritual. Or allow them only to mention or discuss their spirituality within their church or home. Step outside of that...and they aren't allowed? No I can't get behind that.
Quote:
It was mine - I remember it. I'm British. Mad as a hatter, Lazy and smell of wet overcoats. Oh yes - and terrible dentistry. The UK Isn't where the campaign matters. Life of Brian saw to that. America is the problem and getting worse. If America can become Irreligious. , it will KNOW that it is irreligious. I won't be lip service to religion while it tries to manipulate people on the quiet and maintain its' privileges - it will push religion out of politics, education and the rest of society (not the family - can't help that, it will have to be the 'withering') and the rest of the west will take notice and be aware that it is irreligious. Right now it thinks that everyone else is religious, and just pretend.
A quote by an American atheist "When I joined an atheist group I was astonished to find that other atheists were people I know, but I thought they were religious'.
Uk isn't important; America is where the campaign is won or (perhaps) lost.
Unlike you, I am from America. We will decide for ourselves thank you. You actually would like to remove religion and spirituality from even the family. New Atheism has no real desire to co-exist. This is a "campaign" you want me to join? Fat chance.
Perhaps. But a good mock can often penetrate where reasoned argument won't get through. But a good mock to be effective has to make a valid point, too.
I really don't need to read anymore. When a conversation sinks to that level it has lost all value to me. Snark is what people use when they don't have anything else.
New atheists are just old atheists who are no longer prepared to sit down and shut up whilst wilful ignorance and superstition is allowed free reign to continue to persecute and oppress as it has done for a thousand years and more.
They have become the persecutors. Their way or the highway thats what this New Atheism is about. No spirituality anywhere.
No more to be said. Finished with spending any more time in my life on New Atheist thinking. Saw enough on this forum, learned enough in this thread. Moving on.
They have become the persecutors. Their way or the highway that's what this New Atheism is about. No spirituality anywhere.
I can't speak for "new atheists" but I suspect that many atheists are actually quite spiritual, although the definition of 'spiritual' may vary. I for example, do not see being religious as being spiritual, necessarily. I remember my late uncle who was a missionary minister in Africa whom I would have called 'spiritual'.
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