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Old 09-18-2019, 09:03 AM
 
18,846 posts, read 6,874,876 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fishbrains View Post
No. People have the freedoms we enjoy because of Enlightenment values. Those values were not particularly religious, and could be viewed as the origins of publicly acceptable atheism.

It is not intellectually honest to arbitrarily claim all beneficial things as being the result of Christianity. .
I didn't suggest that all beneficial things are a direct result. I said that, for the most part, the reason that our nation is as good as it is is largely due to Christianity. I can surmise that because historically, the nations that have tried to outlaw religion tend to not do well. I can also say that because it's true that Christianity has had many very beneficial effects on society, including charitable works, and human rights.
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Old 09-18-2019, 09:21 AM
 
Location: Willamette Valley, Oregon
6,830 posts, read 3,191,441 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocean777 View Post
Well God & God's Angels have taken me many times to watch people being herded into Hell, Then Judged, Then Thrown Into The Fiery Lake ' where they burn in agony & scream for mercy. It is absolutely horrible. People have to pay for their sins. God said it is their humbling. It's going to happen so get ready

God also throws me into the Fiery Lake if I dare start talking while we are watching the Judgements etc. I've been thrown into the fiery lake many times & it is very real. Watch out

How do possibly survive the Fiery Lake? Must be a pretty wimpy fire. Do you get scorched or anything?
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Old 09-18-2019, 09:33 AM
 
Location: Willamette Valley, Oregon
6,830 posts, read 3,191,441 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_n_Tenn View Post
Look forward and see religion as it was intended or as it has become... might alter one's thinking.

What is perfect religion? We have been given a template and I can't imagine anyone opposed to perfect religion. Does religion require worship? However every religion man has created, no matter the good intentions, fall short of perfection.

Can you answer your own question? What is perfect religion? What is the template? I would hope that tolerance would be a major part of a perfect religion. As it is, religion tends to be my way or the highway.
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Old 09-18-2019, 09:57 AM
 
Location: USA
17,156 posts, read 11,320,701 times
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Default Is it possible to have a future with zero religion?

I'd say if you want a future without religion, you'd need to offer a worthy alternative that fills the needs that religion does (or attempts to or claims to). Something that inspires people, helps them feel connected to whatever God they believe in or at least something "bigger/better" than themselves, and allows them to be part of a caring community where they can help others and also be helped when needed, among other things. What might that be?
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Old 09-18-2019, 10:12 AM
 
Location: TEXAS
3,797 posts, read 1,346,447 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocean777 View Post
.....I've been thrown into the fiery lake many times & it is very real. Watch out
What did it feel like, and what thoughts were you having while in it?
How were you allowed to exit it - did you do something or ask or what?
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Old 09-18-2019, 10:53 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,260 posts, read 23,884,216 times
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Originally Posted by BaptistFundie View Post
Of course they have. We actually allow women to DRIVE in the US.

Seriously though, just take a hard look at the world. In America, people have the freedoms they have due to Christian values.
Since you're always referring to the bible, could you point chapter and verse where it talked about women driving? Or the number of decades of struggle it took for women to be able to vote? Or why we have never had a female president? Or why we have so few women senators and congresswomen...or judges. Or women have to settle -- in most professions -- for lower pay than men? The bible preaches that women are secondary, and you christians have only begrudgingly superficially ceded that teaching in some areas.
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Old 09-18-2019, 10:55 AM
 
18,846 posts, read 6,874,876 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
Since you're always referring to the bible, could you point chapter and verse where it talked about women driving? Or the number of decades of struggle it took for women to be able to vote? Or why we have never had a female president? Or why we have so few women senators and congresswomen...or judges. Or women have to settle -- in most professions -- for lower pay than men? The bible preaches that women are secondary, and you christians have only begrudgingly superficially ceded that teaching in some areas.
None of those issues are limited by the Bible. On the other hand, we see that in Christ, there is neither Jew nor Greek, male or female. Contrast that with other religions that tell women they are second-class citizens. The Bible does not say women are second class.
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Old 09-18-2019, 11:00 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,260 posts, read 23,884,216 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaptistFundie View Post
None of those issues are limited by the Bible. On the other hand, we see that in Christ, there is neither Jew nor Greek, male or female. Contrast that with other religions that tell women they are second-class citizens. The Bible does not say women are second class.
“Your desire will be for your man, and he’ll dominate you” (Genesis 3:16).
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Old 09-18-2019, 11:07 AM
 
18,846 posts, read 6,874,876 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
“Your desire will be for your man, and he’ll dominate you” (Genesis 3:16).
ok? Many scholars translate that as "your desire will be for the man's position, but he will rule over you". The ESV says "your desire shall be contrary to your husband's and he shall rule over you".

yes, God established the man as the head of the family. God did not suggest that the man will abuse or mistreat her. Ephesians 5 says we should love our wives so much we should be willing to die for them. My pastor tells me to view my wife as a gift from God. My wife is no less a human being than I am. She is a child of God, and she is a gift from God that I love and respect.
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Old 09-18-2019, 11:10 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,260 posts, read 23,884,216 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaptistFundie View Post
ok? Many scholars translate that as "your desire will be for the man's position, but he will rule over you". The ESV says "your desire shall be contrary to your husband's and he shall rule over you".

yes, God established the man as the head of the family. God did not suggest that the man will abuse or mistreat her. Ephesians 5 says we should love our wives so much we should be willing to die for them. My pastor tells me to view my wife as a gift from God. My wife is no less a human being than I am. She is a child of God, and she is a gift from God that I love and respect.
This discussion has not been about physical or sexual abuse. Quit grasping at straws.
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