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Certainly, spirituality is not the same as religion. Christianity, for example, accepts the reality that many people may engage in ostensible Christian worship without actually knowing Christ. Religion may have an entirely earthly - primarily social and economic - appeal.
But there is no reason to suppose that there is any inherent disconnect between religion and spirituality. Because I have come to regard Christianity as True, I don't find it spirituality confining in the slightest. It allows for the full spectrum of worship, communion, prayer, mystical experience, Spirit indwelling and expression- what else can any ostensibly spiritual path offer?
The question for me isn't whether a religion is "spiritual" or makes me feel that way. The question is whether it's True. If have a conviction that it's True, then the spirituality will inevitably follow.
I find that "I'm spiritual, but not religious" seldom means much more than "I want to feel like I'm connected to the Great Unknown and to live according to my own notions of morality." Which is fine if someone has thoroughly investigated the major religions and concluded they aren't True, but this free-floating spirituality is, in its own way, really just another religion.
I like that last line because that's ultimately the logical conclusion, at least it would seem.
And once again, I'm seeing a lot of True Believers bashing each other so much they forget to have a swipe at atheism. And yet I've seen a lot of them Seeing that 'spirituality' in the sense of quality of life (in a broad sense) is no more in the purview or gift of a particular religion than any other and it's there for anyone. Including atheists. And it is, I would suggest, about Living, not about Believing.
You're right. It's not an either or. However, an awfully lot of people see everything as binary choices. including religion.
In terms of why the need to categorize? Categorizing things -- classifying things -- is a somewhat natural human trait. It's what humans do. It has its good points, but it also limits exploring. Hence a parent saying, "I don't want my child to think".
It is not what humans do, it's what a certain members of the populace need in order to keep strife in division among mankind. Categorizing is handy tool for those with caste like mentality, "See, it's not me saying this...".
It is not what humans do, it's what a certain members of the populace need in order to keep strife in division among mankind. Categorizing is handy tool for those with caste like mentality, "See, it's not me saying this...".
You see, you go too far. I didn't say anything about what the positives or negatives are. I did mention that there were negatives and there were positives. But you want jump right in and argue about it.
You don't behave in a mosque the same way to behave in a Baptist church, or a Thai temple. You need to respect the different cultures of people, even the various cultures we have right here in this country. There are different attitudes about touching and greeting, about tone of voice, about firmness and directness, and so forth. It is not a one size fits all. It has nothing to do with a "caste like mentality", unless YOU think different cultures are not of equal value.
You see, you go too far. I didn't say anything about what the positives or negatives are. I did mention that there were negatives and there were positives. But you want jump right in and argue about it.
You don't behave in a mosque the same way to behave in a Baptist church, or a Thai temple. You need to respect the different cultures of people, even the various cultures we have right here in this country. There are different attitudes about touching and greeting, about tone of voice, about firmness and directness, and so forth. It is not a one size fits all. It has nothing to do with a "caste like mentality", unless YOU think different cultures are not of equal value.
You enjoy categorizing because you feel you are in the safe zone...enjoy, carry on...
Mind body spirit. people religion spirituality. religion can be thought of as muscle memory for some. A set of rituals that we deploy just to remind ourselves to try and live a little more for others than ourselves. A set of rituals to help us connect to the system around us.
in that context, I guess its fine.
I find people that say "I am spiritual and not religious" realize that religion can have really stupid rules and any one religion alone is not the only path to the, "oneness", if you will.
I dont think religion is what makes live a little more for others. It is more for ourselves, morals, consequences. Also divides us. Spirituality without religion forces mindfulness, reminds us of interconnectedness, and acting with thought. Ultimately we seek the same thing, the Oneness, but the paths are different, the effect on our mind is different.
But to each his own. Whatever wirks. What we choose is not always a choice.
You enjoy categorizing because you feel you are in the safe zone...enjoy, carry on...
Hes trying to needle you, Phet. There was only explanation (and pretty even -handed, I thought) in your post, and here you are Gabby, tossing out a throwaway accusation that is nothing to do with his post with an implicit 'I've done with the conversation' which is what Shakespeare called 'Jade's trick' and we Darwinist hellpawn call 'a flounce'.
I dont think religion is what makes live a little more for others. It is more for ourselves, morals, consequences. Also divides us. Spirituality without religion forces mindfulness, reminds us of interconnectedness, and acting with thought. Ultimately we seek the same thing, the Oneness, but the paths are different, the effect on our mind is different.
But to each his own. Whatever wirks. What we choose is not always a choice.
those can be and often are also found in religion.
regarding "divides us" that is exactly what is being done with categorization of "spirituality without religion".
that is not interconnectedness, it is separation, it is division.
it is focusing on differences and what separates, rather than as you say "seeking the same thing the Oneness" or other commonallities such as honoring the sacred, being in relationship with the divine, self development, self improvement, service to others. there are different flavors, different genres, but does one view it as music in harmony for different tastes through different songs; or does one insist that jazz "affects the mind and how we treat others" differently than opera or chamber music.
music is music. same with ways of honoring the sacred.
Last edited by Tzaphkiel; 07-29-2020 at 06:58 AM..
I dont think religion is what makes live a little more for others. It is more for ourselves, morals, consequences. Also divides us. Spirituality without religion forces mindfulness, reminds us of interconnectedness, and acting with thought. Ultimately we seek the same thing, the Oneness, but the paths are different, the effect on our mind is different.
But to each his own. Whatever wirks. What we choose is not always a choice.
Again (or so I recall) we seem to be more on the same page than I had thought. Of course we may disagree on a lot but may agree much more on 'living essentials' if I may use the term.
Hes trying to needle you, Phet. There was only explanation (and pretty even -handed, I thought) in your post, and here you are Gabby, tossing out a throwaway accusation that is nothing to do with his post with an implicit 'I've done with the conversation' which is what Shakespeare called 'Jade's trick' and we Darwinist hellpawn call 'a flounce'.
Yes. It's all a game. It has nothing to do with anything related to R/S and/or origins. Why would anyone question origins when Darwin has already provided the real truth.
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Hes trying to needle you, Phet. There was only explanation (and pretty even -handed, I thought) in your post, and here you are Gabby, tossing out a throwaway accusation that is nothing to do with his post with an implicit 'I've done with the conversation' which is what Shakespeare called 'Jade's trick' and we Darwinist hellpawn call 'a flounce'.
