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Some people will bake a cake and no matter how bad it tastes, they will insist it's a good cake, mostly because they baked it. Others are half-baked and so are their cakes. Still others prefer pies, but ultimately we all know there are those who belong in the kitchen and those who don't...
Are we here to determine what flavor cake we like as deciding if its a cake?
Nope. It is simple and basic. You have said that All is intelligent. I have said (in addition to blocking off various evasions), that this implies that it it has to have that attribute before I'll consider the label 'God'. The burden of proof is on you. Wriggling and evasion will be noted.
It is self-substantiating...objectively and unequivocally.
"ALL" encompasses everything (animate & inanimate) and everyone, replete with the attributes/traits...as ONE.
You cannot BE something (and "ALL" is everything in totality, as a single Entity), and not possess any and all traits & attributes thereof.
When you understand that...you will then "know". Until then.....
You and Arq seem interminably confused about the use of brute fact premises in logic. When there is no way to establish them unambiguously, you evaluate the internal consistency of syllogisms with them as uncontested brute fact. Your composition fallacy depends on the brute fact that our Reality is comprised of separate things. My view asserts the brute fact that our Reality is One. That is why we must always end up at "We Do Not Know" recognizing that our version is our preferred belief about the brute fact premises we use, NOT incontrovertible fact.
Lol, 'interminably confused'.
Let me explain once again, as you and the ilk seem unable to understand the explanation.
Yes, our ultimate reality is one, but you are not claiming we do not know, you are claiming our ultimate reality has a belly button because we have a belly button, sorry, you are claiming it is conscious because we are conscious, or that consciousness is a property of our ultimate reality.
Yet you are unable to explain how something can be conscious without a brain.
It is self-substantiating...objectively and unequivocally.
"ALL" encompasses everything (animate & inanimate) and everyone, replete with the attributes/traits...as ONE.
You cannot BE something (and "ALL" is everything in totality, as a single Entity), and not possess any and all traits & attributes thereof.
When you understand that...you will then "know". Until then.....
You are always entertaining when you preach Faith claims.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Diogenes
Lol, 'interminably confused'.
Let me explain once again, as you and the ilk seem unable to understand the explanation.
Yes, our ultimate reality is one, but you are not claiming we do not know, you are claiming our ultimate reality has a belly button because we have a belly button, sorry, you are claiming it is conscious because we are conscious, or that consciousness is a property of our ultimate reality.
Yet you are unable to explain how something can be conscious without a brain.
Mystic specialises in forcing on us views or understandings that it would suit his deprecating bashing of atheists if we had them, but which we do not have.
As you say, we can imagine a common reality of all and also the various bits of it that we know about. None of which matters a damn' because Mystic's Belief is based on one claim - is it intelligent?
It is clear in Mystic's Doctrine that it is. it communes with us. But he avoids any call to validate the claim.
Goldie slipped a few posts ago and said it was. But is now avoiding the burden of proof.
Arach of all people avoids the Intelligence problem by calling it 'Life', but that causes its' own problems.
Whatever, the basic is the same - prove that the universe is Intelligent - or 'alive'. Instead we get wriggling, wordsalads and abuse.
Mystic is welcome to his two disciples.
Last edited by TRANSPONDER; 10-21-2020 at 04:29 AM..
You are always entertaining when you preach Faith claims.
Mystic specialises in forcing on us views or understandings that it would suit his deprecating bashing of atheists if we had them, but which we do not have.
As you say, we can imagine a common reality of all and also the various bits of it that we know about. None of which matters a damn' because Mystic's Belief is based on one claim - is it intelligent?
It is clear in Mystic's Doctrine that it is. it communes with us. But he avoids any call to validate the claim.
Goldie slipped a few posts ago and said it was. But is now avoiding the burden of proof.
Arach of all people avoids the Intelligence problem by calling it 'Life', but that causes its' own problems.
Whatever, the basic is the same - prove that the universe is Intelligent - or 'alive'. Instead we get wriggling, wordsalads and abuse.
Mystic is welcome to his two disciples.
anytime you wanna look at what problems "arachs' life" cause we can talk about it. oh wait ... we tried that and when you got spanked you ran away crying foul and what a sucky atheist I am.
good plan you got there.
oh by the way, what is your claim that describe what we see better than "life"? that doesn't have problems?
oh right, my bad again, you don't make a claim you just bash all other claims that slow down your rampage on believers.
keep hidding trans.
PS I love how you claim we are the abusers ... that is so funny. What actually happened is that you don't scare us and we gave you exactly what you gave us ... and you ran away.
You are always entertaining when you preach Faith claims.
nipped for space ...
lets look at hi, as you put it ... "faith claims."
1) It is self-substantiating...
2) "ALL" encompasses everything (animate & inanimate) and everyone,
replete with the attributes/traits...as ONE.
3) You cannot BE something (and "ALL" is everything in totality, as a single Entity), and not possess any and all traits & attributes thereof.
4) When you understand that...you will then "know". Until then.....
actually we could discuss number 3. But the rest are not "faith" as much as "just intuitive" and basically just common sense.
talk about faith. There is no bigger faith claim than "I don't believe you." and offering nothing to counter his claim but denial and personal insults. and the ever popular "We are only talking about a deity".
Why do you religious sort think that "I don't believe that "is good enough?
Let me explain once again, as you and the ilk seem unable to understand the explanation.
Yes, our ultimate reality is one, but you are not claiming we do not know, you are claiming our ultimate reality has a belly button because we have a belly button, sorry, you are claiming it is conscious because we are conscious, or that consciousness is a property of our ultimate reality.
Yet you are unable to explain how something can be conscious without a brain.
You seem inexplicably unable to alter your perspective from a Reality comprised of separate things to a Reality that is one single uncompartmented whole! For example, at the very least, our single entity Reality has over 7 billion brains (individual cells). What about that do you NOT comprehend??? I have little confidence that this will penetrate your cemented intellect.
the standard model is based on the everything working together more like a system and individual parts.
Correction: "the standard model is based on everything working together more like a system THAN individual parts."
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