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Still, if she tells me something that doesn't make sense to me, I ask questions to learn more until it does make sense to me. Or I decide not to accept what she is telling me and get a second opinion.
IOWs, there is a big difference between accepting that we all understand the English language, for example, and all of us accepting what we read that is written in English. Right?
We there yet?
I'm still confused by this statement. If my doctor tells me something that doesn't make sense to me, why would I think that asking questions could lead to my understanding? I mean, questions might help me, but they also might mislead me, arming me with a half-knowledge. The medical expert didn't get to the level of authority by reading a wiki page. The idea that the binary options are "ask until it makes sense" or "decide not to accept" seems to exclude "trust that there are things that an expert knows."
When the end result statements don't make sense to you, but you don't replicate the myriad steps the expert took (acquiring the foundational understanding, metaphorically, the alphabet) then you will end up building your final conclusions on stairs of sand.
And whether, in any particular case, you choose to ask questions which might lead to understanding or deny authority instead, seems capricious.
rosends,
I suspect we may be confusing "apples with oranges" here, or maybe it's semantics. Not sure, but let me give this another go and see if we can't better understand one another a little better about this too...Of course we all "accept" all manner of THINGS all the time, like our alphabet, our vocabulary, that you're there somewhere at the receiving end of this comment. However, those are not the sort of things I was referring to when it comes to what we assume vs critical thinking. I was referring to notions, concepts or beliefs of which there is no reason to presume validity. In those sorts of cases, I consider what claims are being made, that we are being asked to assume or accept. Then by way of study, research, learning and questions, I come to conclude what I do. Even in the case of medical diagnosis, I do the same (or who hasn't had the experience of inaccurate or bad medical advice?). I carefully consider my doctor's advice, and I for the most part trust her advice, because she has earned that respect from me. Still, if she tells me something that doesn't make sense to me, I ask questions to learn more until it does make sense to me. Or I decide not to accept what she is telling me and get a second opinion. IOWs, there is a big difference between accepting that we all understand the English language, for example, and all of us accepting what we read that is written in English. Right? We there yet?
regarding bold above,
no one is asking you to accept anything.
no one is asking you to assume anything.
that claim being made (that you are "being asked to assume or accept" anything) is not correct.
so the conclusions that flow from that erroneous claim, are also not valid.
Since this entire thread is being executed using only written Torah with a total absence of Oral Torah (Talmud), would it be fair to say that the entire thread is almost entirely useless and misleading? No Jew would ever accept the benefit of learning Torah without also consulting the Talmud to understand what it really means.
yes it is fair to say that.
it is like someone trying to read a book or an article with 85% of the sentences randomly removed.
And trying to make sense of what it says.
yes it is fair to say that.
it is like someone trying to read a book or an article with 85% of the sentences randomly removed.
And trying to make sense of what it says.
it is not a recipe for understanding.
But the thread has been entertaining nonetheless. I just thought it relevant to point out that LearnMe is not actually learning Torah in this thread. He seems to like the sociology aspect thought, and that’s fine by me.
But the thread has been entertaining nonetheless. I just thought it relevant to point out that LearnMe is not actually learning Torah in this thread. He seems to like the sociology aspect thought, and that’s fine by me.
the thread has been an excellent venue for bringing forth and sharing many elements of yiddishkeit, for readers and viewers now and in the future. many people have written to me with comments of appreciation on what has been shared. it amazes me that posts continue to be read 5, 6, even 10 years later.
gam zu l'tova
That is a phrase that translates to "this too is good." it is a recognition that whatever Hashem sends to us, it contains within it blessings, even if it may not appear that way on the surface. When we declare "gam zu l'tova" it calls forth the blessings. The act of our saying the prayer creates the vessel to receive the blessings that Hashem is always pouring forth for us in abundance.
one of my favorite stories is of Nachum ish Gamzu
it begins this way.....and the link is below for more
"The most interesting thing about him is his strange nickname: He was known as "Nachum ish gam zu," "Nachum the man of 'this too.'"
He was not only a very saintly man but also a great Talmid Chacham (scholar). He used to say that whatever The Almighty chose to do was for good, for the best. So, even when some misfortune would befall him be would invariably say, "This too is for good." Because be was always heard saying, "This too is for good," he came to be known by the nickname "Nachum Gam-Zu" ("This too").
"It happened that the Roman Emperor issued a very severe decree against the Jews and the Sages decided that someone must go and speak with the Emperor to remove the decree. After serious thought they decided that the best person to represent them would be Nachum Gam-Zu, because it was said that miracles were always happening to him. The Sages put together a beautiful collection of jewels and precious stones in a lovely jewel-box and gave the box to Nachum Gam-Zu to take to the Emperor...."
63. To be fruitful and multiply (Gen. 1:28) (CCA43).
NO LINK, I'll be corrected if wrong. The last I knew for U.S. Jews, except for Orthodox, Hasidic Jews, the fertility rate lags a little behind other religious groups. My guess is many if not most Jewish couples aren't fruitfully multiplying as much as the Mitzvah expects.
NO LINK, I'll be corrected if wrong. The last I knew for U.S. Jews, except for Orthodox, Hasidic Jews, the fertility rate lags a little behind other religious groups. My guess is many if not most Jewish couples aren't fruitfully multiplying as much as the Mitzvah expects.
How much do you think the mitzvah expects (just curious)?
You'll know how the ins and outs of how halakha and yebamots deal with fruitful and multiply.
I don't have an opinion on how many children any individual Jewish person needs to check-off that mitzvah.
The standard expectation is, as you state, a girl and a boy. This is a way to ensure that the absolute number of Jews stays the same, assuming both parets are Jewish. Yevamot is the name of the talmudic tractate in which this law is codified (there are other opinions, such as two boys, or two boys and two girls). Yevamot also means "Levirates" as in the levirate marriage in which the brother of a married man who died before having children marries his late-brother's wife so that the children will be "credited" to his dead brother.
Last edited by rosends; 12-29-2020 at 09:38 AM..
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