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Did you read what led up to that? Did you read before that how the Pharaoh ordered the mass killing of 'every boy that was born' to the Hebrews? Is it o.k. for you that the Pharaoh was killing "innocent" people? That the Pharaoh told the midwives to "kill the boys, but let the girls live"?
Pharaoh's heart wasn't "hardened" until just before Moses approached him. But he was already an oppressive, cruel, slave-driver. It was not only Pharaoh who despised the Israelites; most of the Egyptians themselves hated them.
There are several other passages in the OT about "witches" (a.k.a. sorcerers, mediums, etc.) and none of those passages say anything about literally not allowing a witch to live.
And the killing of the first born of the Israelites was not in the well being for the Israelite society, the families and not the first born.
Who says it wasn't recorded? Lots of records were destroyed because the historical record wouldn't have caused them to be seen in a favorable light. Not saying it happened, but considering the circumstances in the bible (and from other records at the time) it's certainly a possibility.
1. In your first paragraph, you sound like the kid on the playground: "Well Johnny did it first!"
2. In your second paragraph, how many times in this discussion and others have you claimed that god killing the first born of Egypt was not murder because it wasn't illegal? But guess what...in Egypt it was legal for the Israelites to be kept at slaves. So do you believe legality makes things right...or not. Which is it?
3. If someone were to that they were going to fervently pray to god that he kill your children...and god did...would you really say, "No problem!"? Or would you more likely say something like, "Well that's a hateful thing to say?"
4. Are you telling me that with all his power and intelligence, that god couldn't dream up a more non-cruel way to solve the slavery problem of the Israelites? Why does god so often resort to cruelty in the OT?
5. When I read your posts defending anything that god does, I really begin to wonder if christians have any consistent principles at all. Just sayin'.
Aah but! Why didn't God prevent that killing? Where was he? And then, do two wrongs make a right? As in a revenge massacre? Not exactly a good example of moral standards don't you think?
Oh yes, and don't forget, God hardened the pharaohs heart.
That would be Jainism.
Good catch!
Unlike the rest of you, I have unlimited editing time.
But the coolest thing about that story is how God killed all the livestock in Egypt in the 5th plague and then killed the firstborn of the livestock (that were already dead from the 5th plague) in the 10th plague. That's some impressive work right there.
What's even cooler is how you can read about the 5th plague which talks about killing the livestock and not understand that there are other animals besides livestock.
It's pretty easy to figure out that the 10th plague includes all other animals that were not considered to be "livestock" (such as dogs).
What's even cooler is how you can read about the 5th plague which talks about killing the livestock and not understand that there are other animals besides livestock.
It's pretty easy to figure out that the 10th plague includes all other animals that were not considered to be "livestock" (such as dogs).
And there are people walking around freely on this planet who believe the above really happened.
And those people have children and vote.
Which is why much of the world is still very wary about America.
Aah but! Why didn't God prevent that killing? Where was he?
God predicted that this (that is, the oppression/slavery of the Israelites and the Exodous) was going to happen (to Abram, a.k.a. Abraham) over 400 years before it happened.
Why didn't He prevent all that killing? Well, that's what happens when you have free will. Some will kill, while others simply want to live with everyone in peace. The Pharaoh didn't want the Israelites to live in peace. If God prevented this, it wouldn't have achieved his goal the way He wanted it achieved.
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And then, do two wrongs make a right? As in a revenge massacre? Not exactly a good example of moral standards don't you think?
Since it was God who did this then, yes. I believe what He did was moral.
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Oh yes, and don't forget, God hardened the pharaohs heart.
Yes, he did. God only hardened Pharaoh's heart as for letting the Israelites leave. His heart was already hardened in regard to his abusive treatment of the Israelites.
1. In your first paragraph, you sound like the kid on the playground: "Well Johnny did it first!"
I'm just paraphrasing what's in the bible, phet. Don't shoot the messenger.
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2. In your second paragraph, how many times in this discussion and others have you claimed that god killing the first born of Egypt was not murder because it wasn't illegal? But guess what...in Egypt it was legal for the Israelites to be kept at slaves. So do you believe legality makes things right...or not. Which is it?
My second paragraph has nothing to do with what I've bolded.
Legality doesn't necessarily make things "right". Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't.
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3. If someone were to that they were going to fervently pray to god that he kill your children...and god did...would you really say, "No problem!"? Or would you more likely say something like, "Well that's a hateful thing to say?"
God doesn't answer prayers like that.
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4. Are you telling me that with all his power and intelligence, that god couldn't dream up a more non-cruel way to solve the slavery problem of the Israelites? Why does god so often resort to cruelty in the OT?
Perhaps God could have done things a different way. But without God's infinite knowledge and wisdom, there's no way I'm even going to venture into the possibilities of He "could have" or "should have" done/not done.
5. When I read your posts defending anything that god does, I really begin to wonder if christians have any consistent principles at all. Just sayin'.[/quote]
Of course we do.
I'm just paraphrasing what's in the bible, phet. Don't shoot the messenger.
My second paragraph has nothing to do with what I've bolded.
Legality doesn't necessarily make things "right". Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't.
God doesn't answer prayers like that.
Perhaps God could have done things a different way. But without God's infinite knowledge and wisdom, there's no way I'm even going to venture into the possibilities of He "could have" or "should have" done/not done.
5. When I read your posts defending anything that god does, I really begin to wonder if christians have any consistent principles at all. Just sayin'.
Of course we do.
I have known more than one person who made excuses for god just like you do, who later cursed god for what he did to them or their children or other loved ones. Perhaps your time is coming.
Last edited by mensaguy; 01-23-2021 at 02:21 AM..
Reason: Removed extra quote tag
I have known more than one person who made excuses for god just like you do, who later cursed god for what he did to them or their children or other loved ones. Perhaps your time is coming.
Or perhaps it's already happened. Some people find God in their darkest moments.
I have known more than one person who made excuses for god just like you do, who later cursed god for what he did to them or their children or other loved ones. Perhaps your time is coming.
The bold is an awful thing to say and quite out of character for you, phet, at least in my previous opinion of you.
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