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Hierarchies are kept up by people and often lead to exploitation because people aren't perfect.
In school there was something where a founding father said of the constitution that if men were angels that we wouldn't need laws, a government, checks and balances and so forth.
Well the problem with many religious hierarchies is that it snuffs out freewill to formulate one's own thoughts or not allowing free action. I think the best safety measure is to just not have a strict hierarchy in religion to ensure equality, freewill, and free thoughts.
I love that last paragraph.
Size matters ...
How many churches would you be ok with in one "group"?
How many churches would you be ok with in one "group"?
To be clear - I am "okay" with the Catholic Church existing and that has a strong hierarchy.
I don't think the "number of churches" matters for a hierarchy as long as it is set up where the meeting houses have a lot of independence and the meeting houses themselves push equality and independence of thinking for their members.
Perhaps a loose association to promote more freedom. No one person dictating what to think and believe exactly at any level. No one group considered above another on authority of how to interact with or interpret God.
Is hierarchy bad for religions?
Hierarchies often trample on freewill by forcing certain 'orthodox' beliefs.
Hierarchies put too much power into too few people, which means it is easier for that power to be corrupted perhaps when a few have control over many.
Look at the KKK, they claimed to be a religious group and they had steep hierarchies within their organization and sought to maintain hierarchies in society through terrorism.
Look at some of the religious strife in Europe centuries ago. Much of it was to create and maintain hierarchies and the result was bloodshed.
If God gives us the magical gift of freewill, it seems like hierarchies would diminish it. People can find God and have a relationship with God outside of a structured religious format.
[SIZE=4]There are approximately Four Thousand Two Hundred (4,200) religions and practicing spiritual entities on the planet Earth. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=4]Understanding World [/SIZE][SIZE=4]Religions[/SIZE][SIZE=4] in 15 Minutes a Day[/SIZE][SIZE=4] gives this general definition: “[/SIZE][SIZE=4]Religion[/SIZE][SIZE=4] is an organized system of [/SIZE][SIZE=4]beliefs[/SIZE][SIZE=4] that answers ultimate questions and commends certain actions or behaviors based on the answers to those questions.†As found in ([/SIZE][SIZE=4]Understanding World [/SIZE][SIZE=4]Religions[/SIZE][SIZE=4] in 15 Minutes a Day, [/SIZE][SIZE=4]by Garry R. Morgan, Bethany House Publishers, Pub. Sept. 1, 2012.), which is, of course, a meaningless definition, (i.e. “... answers ultimate questions … based on the answers to those questions.â€).[/SIZE]
[SIZE=4]For those who are students of history, they know that religion has been an excuse to go to war and for bad behavior. What is a “holy war?,†you ask? That depends upon your religion, and there are lots of them. From one perspective, human beings have always been in religious wars. [/SIZE]
To be clear - I am "okay" with the Catholic Church existing and that has a strong hierarchy.
I don't think the "number of churches" matters for a hierarchy as long as it is set up where the meeting houses have a lot of independence and the meeting houses themselves push equality and independence of thinking for their members.
Perhaps a loose association to promote more freedom. No one person dictating what to think and believe exactly at any level. No one group considered above another on authority of how to interact with or interpret God.
The context of a harsh, judgmental, wrathful, and vengeful God who needs to be appeased to forgive us anything is the main error in religious thinking. A loving Father who wants us to succeed and sent His Son to do what we were failing to do is the context we should be operating under, IMO.
The context of a harsh, judgmental, wrathful, and vengeful God who needs to be appeased to forgive us anything is the main error in religious thinking. A loving Father who wants us to succeed and sent His Son to do what we were failing to do is the context we should be operating under, IMO.
a loving Father does not see us as "failing"
each and every one of us is made in the image of the Creator
what is described above is every bit as harsh, judgmental, and critical as that which it purports to reject.
same toxic bitterness, different wrapper, to relegate and castigate and denigrate humans as incapable, as failures.
sheesh.
post above is perpetuating the very same, to use your words "error in thinking"
calling humankind "failing" and "incapable" is the same as calling them "filthy rags."
view in post above is saying the exact same thing.
Last edited by Tzaphkiel; 06-28-2021 at 08:25 AM..
Here's the thing. "Hierarchy" does not mean automatic sexism or oppression. That's been my point all along.
Now...do people abuse hierarchy or authority positions to oppress? Yup. You betcha. But it does not have to be that way.
If this is your point or THEE point, who wouldn't agree?
Not sure that's been the focus or point for most people discussing this topic in this thread so far however...
Reminds me a bit of the old quote about how power corrupts. There is a bit of that sort of issue when power begins to amass, and sexism, racism, has largely been a function of power, abuse of power, through the ages and still today. With religions, government. You name it...
I would not say that it's usually that way.
Though I could see where government workers would think that. Especially those in the U.S. educational system, which is a poster child for hierarchy messing up a big organization. From the Dept of Ed at the Fed & State levels...to the school boards, and those that run the schools, and down. It has us spending more per student than any other Country...but lagging way behind in student proficiency.
The Military does much better. So does many public & private corporations and businesses.
As per Religion...there has certainly been major issues with the hierarchy.
Hierarchies are kept up by people and often lead to exploitation because people aren't perfect.
In school there was something where a founding father said of the constitution that if men were angels that we wouldn't need laws, a government, checks and balances and so forth.
Well the problem with many religious hierarchies is that it snuffs out freewill to formulate one's own thoughts or not allowing free action. I think the best safety measure is to just not have a strict hierarchy in religion to ensure equality, freewill, and free thoughts.
Might be why I've never been much of a joiner other than when employment was my goal. Otherwise, I'm not big on voluntarily being a part of hierarchies generally speaking.
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Let us take a step back
The context of a harsh, judgmental, wrathful, and vengeful God who needs to be appeased to forgive us anything is the main error in religious thinking. A loving Father who wants us to succeed and sent His Son to do what we were failing to do is the context we should be operating under, IMO.
