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Thank you for your response. I think I have a better insight on how an atheist deals with the God project.
ETA: i finally went back to look at the thread you pointed to that are examples of people’s responses about their belief in God. Sorry, that must have been the wrong thread. That was the Atheist Evangelism thread. More atheists posting why they disbelieve in god, and so must you. LOL.
But it is in order when the religious do this? Lol.
Are you THAT insecure you can only attack atheists? Lol.
Thank you for your response. I think I have a better insight on how an atheist deals with the God project.
ETA: i finally went back to look at the thread you pointed to that are examples of people’s responses about their belief in God. Sorry, that must have been the wrong thread. That was the Atheist Evangelism thread. More atheists posting why they disbelieve in god, and so must you. LOL.
You're welcome, we are all here to compare notes (I hope). I would note, that my response is to describe myself alone, not to presume to describe anyone else's position on the topic, just as I don't assume all believers are homogenous in belief nor practice.
Apologies, if I got the wrong link, it wasn't intentional. Too late to edit it.
My lack of belief in god is quite simple really, lack of evidence any god(s) exists, that can be identified as god(s). [And here we go back to defining/describing what people think constitutes a god in the first place...]
Sadly, BapFun is a believer who is not satisfied with people who believe in God. He is as close-minded as ever even with other believers who do not believe the same things he does about God. He is not just intolerant of atheists. He is intolerant of believers in God as well.
that's grand, you calling someone else "closed-minded" or "intolerant". You, Mr. Agape love who makes a habit of trashing everyone else and telling us we follow barbaric beliefs.
It is often the most ardent christians that become atheists, because they have dug in with all they had, only to dig past all the protections that confirmation bias affords and see the man behind the curtain.
I seriously doubt you want to go head to head with many of the atheists here on the topics of commitment to god, the bible, religious traditions and beliefs, missions, fasting & praying, communing with god and more.
I know you think anyone that has ever TRULY known god could never stop believing. That knowing god is a bell is impossible to be un-rung. Probably most of us thought the same thing. It takes a LOT of humility to admit that your whole life you believed and applied yourself to something that turned out to be untrue, it was one of the least comfortable things I've every gone through. But it happens.
Admitting that I was 1000% convinced of a falsehood was no easy pill to swallow. I wasn't just like you 30 years ago, I was absolutely certain I knew god, and my behavior and commitment were the result of it, you were the opposite, your behavior was socially driven, minus a belief in god.
I don't doubt for a second that you were very committed to what you believed in. Never said anything otherwise.
that's grand, you calling someone else "closed-minded" or "intolerant". You, Mr. Agape love who makes a habit of trashing everyone else and telling us we follow barbaric beliefs.
Mystic can be...unpleasant, but I have found that if you seek out common ground with him that one can have a decent conversation.
In regard to him telling you folks that you follow barbaric beliefs...what exactly is wrong with that. Are people not allowed to come to conclusions about various religions? Do you not have opinions about Hinduism? Buddhism? Mormonism?
Do you expect to come on a discussion forum on the topic of religion and not have people critique your religion?
Mystic can be...unpleasant, but I have found that if you seek out common ground with him that one can have a decent conversation.
In regard to him telling you folks that you follow barbaric beliefs...what exactly is wrong with that. Are people not allowed to come to conclusions about various religions? Do you not have opinions about Hinduism? Buddhism? Mormonism?
Do you expect to come on a discussion forum on the topic of religion and not have people critique your religion?
What planet do you come from?
Possibly the Planet of Midwestern Reserve, where "never is heard a discouraging word".
I was brought up that way. To say something critical, or simply contrary to beliefs, is to attack, so it's seen as rude and mean.
I've spent a lifetime getting over that, with mixed results.
It should not be a surprise though that if you suggest that beliefs one reveres and holds dear and thinks are the salvation of the world, are "barbaric", or even just less than perfect, that hackles will be raised. It is beyond most people to see that observations or ideas that are different from yours, aren't personal attacks, or any sort of threat. And most exhibit the paradox of holding their beliefs with great confidence, yet are somehow at the same time convinced those beliefs will disintegrate at the slightest challenge. Hence the promotion of doubt as one of the greatest of sins, and all the emphasis on not "condoning" or "tolerating", much less actually listening to or understanding other's unapproved points of view. Because their god doesn't stop at punishing you for outright believing unapproved dogma; god might smite you for just not being sufficiently indignantly opposed!
Possibly the Planet of Midwestern Reserve, where "never is heard a discouraging word".
I was brought up that way. To say something critical, or simply contrary to beliefs, is to attack, so it's seen as rude and mean.
I've spent a lifetime getting over that, with mixed results.
It should not be a surprise though that if you suggest that beliefs one reveres and holds dear and thinks are the salvation of the world, are "barbaric", or even just less than perfect, that hackles will be raised. It is beyond most people to see that observations or ideas that are different from yours, aren't personal attacks, or any sort of threat. And most exhibit the paradox of holding their beliefs with great confidence, yet are somehow at the same time convinced those beliefs will disintegrate at the slightest challenge. Hence the promotion of doubt as one of the greatest of sins, and all the emphasis on not "condoning" or "tolerating", much less actually listening to or understanding other's unapproved points of view. Because their god doesn't stop at punishing you for outright believing unapproved dogma; god might smite you for just not being sufficiently indignantly opposed!
Nah...I'm ok with disagreeing. But I get told here a lot that I'm mean for disagreeing. But the same people ignore Mr. Agape when he NONSTOP obsessively repeats the same insults over and over and over again. It just gets old.
Possibly the Planet of Midwestern Reserve, where "never is heard a discouraging word".
I was brought up that way. To say something critical, or simply contrary to beliefs, is to attack, so it's seen as rude and mean.
I've spent a lifetime getting over that, with mixed results.
It should not be a surprise though that if you suggest that beliefs one reveres and holds dear and thinks are the salvation of the world, are "barbaric", or even just less than perfect, that hackles will be raised. It is beyond most people to see that observations or ideas that are different from yours, aren't personal attacks, or any sort of threat. And most exhibit the paradox of holding their beliefs with great confidence, yet are somehow at the same time convinced those beliefs will disintegrate at the slightest challenge. Hence the promotion of doubt as one of the greatest of sins, and all the emphasis on not "condoning" or "tolerating", much less actually listening to or understanding other's unapproved points of view. Because their god doesn't stop at punishing you for outright believing unapproved dogma; god might smite you for just not being sufficiently indignantly opposed!
Good post.
In a sense I would say getting overly upset about comments by non-believers (in whatever religion) actually denotes a lack of confidence in one's religion. When I have heard negative comments about Buddhism, frankly, I didn't get upset. Maybe a bit annoyed. But my conclusion was pretty much that they're ignorant of any knowledge about Buddhism. Even a couple of times in Thailand, when I saw christians (at least they were Americans, and you know how they brag about Americans being christians in overwhelming numbers) actually urinate on a large Buddha statue, I just thought it reflected on their lack of knowledge and respect (which was a presumption on my part, since perhaps they knew a bit about Buddhism...but I doubt it)
What I have never understood is christians who get upset if someone puts down their religion, but it's okay for them to tell you you're going to hell since you don't believe what they believe.
Nah...I'm ok with disagreeing. But I get told here a lot that I'm mean for disagreeing. But the same people ignore Mr. Agape when he NONSTOP obsessively repeats the same insults over and over and over again. It just gets old.
Mystic is a retired professor and can be very didactic and at times (sorry Mystic) pedantic. It is his way. Over the years I've addressed his ideas and he knows where I stand. As such ... yeah I suppose I ignore him in a sense because there's noting new for me to say. He has failed to convince me and never the twain shall meet.
I will say this though: Mystic does not have to save me from hell, or from error, or from doubt. I think he'd characterize my thinking as sub-optimal but not wrong in the sense of "leading to eternal perdition". I'm sure you're aware that Paul characterized Jesus as a "stone of stumbling", a "rock of offense" to those who "stumble at the word, being disobedient". That's a central feature of your belief, that anyone who fails to believe as you do fails not because they have coherent reasons, but simply because they're sinners who want to sin. You can't really get around that, it's right there in your user's manual. Mystic, however I may disagree with him, is not trying to alert me to how wicked I am (and by extension, how virtuous he is). I say this very gently, BF, because I don't think you see yourself or consciously mean it that way at all ... but it is how you come off, and it is a feature of your belief system that brings that about.
Mystic is a retired professor and can be very didactic and at times (sorry Mystic) pedantic. It is his way. Over the years I've addressed his ideas and he knows where I stand. As such ... yeah I suppose I ignore him in a sense because there's noting new for me to say. He has failed to convince me and never the twain shall meet.
I will say this though: Mystic does not have to save me from hell, or from error, or from doubt. I think he'd characterize my thinking as sub-optimal but not wrong in the sense of "leading to eternal perdition". I'm sure you're aware that Paul characterized Jesus as a "stone of stumbling", a "rock of offense" to those who "stumble at the word, being disobedient". That's a central feature of your belief, that anyone who fails to believe as you do fails not because they have coherent reasons, but simply because they're sinners who want to sin. You can't really get around that, it's right there in your user's manual. Mystic, however I may disagree with him, is not trying to alert me to how wicked I am (and by extension, how virtuous he is). I say this very gently, BF, because I don't think you see yourself or consciously mean it that way at all ... but it is how you come off, and it is a feature of your belief system that brings that about.
Well stated.
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