What is the concept of heaven to you? (agnostics, suicide, Christianity)

[Hayle White]

Originally Posted by Avondalist

In the movie Defending Your Life, Albert Brooks dies and goes to a celestial waiting room where he must argue for his admittance to heaven or else be reincarnated.

Anyways one of the nice things about being in this waiting room is that you can eat whatever you want without gaining weight. That would be good enough for me.

Carbs! It's the carbohydrates you crave; otherwise, you could have heaven on earth today eating raw vegetables until your heart's content.

Another question: Who will prepare your casseroles and Alfredo's heaven?

[cb2008]

Originally Posted by MysticPhD

t. I do not know how the Oneness can possibly be comprised of the multitude of individual selves, but it does.
.

There is no multitude. Individual selves are body and mind, that project the world, the inevitable result of karma, and all perishable. When the mind-caused ego/individuality dissolves to nothingness, the Atma, the Self within, resolves into Brhman, the Oneness, fullness, perfection, peace. There is no other heaven, no hell, other than what is within.

[perennial millennial]

It is beyond human comprehension

[cb2008]

Originally Posted by ocpaul20

And...how do you explain all this to "a bear with very little brain" (To quote Winnie the Pooh) ?

There are folk on here who I believe pride themselves as being educated to a high level and like to show that in their arguments. Those posts, which are wonderful and I am sure have meaningful (to some) explanations and which really should exist in the graduate text books of those studying the subject matter.

However, there are far more people with lesser education and understanding who also want to receive the knowledge of the way the Universe works and how it is. If these 'truths' cannot be explained in words of one or two syllables then these poor folk (including me) will not be able to understand and so be excluded from the knowledge available. That excludes many people, which is perpetuating the environment of the priests of old times who just wanted power and status.

Great educators are able to explain things in simple terms. No?

The knowledge is available to all. We are all equally and perfectly equipped to realize it, experience it, understand it.
“Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.”
There is no further truth than that.

[Avondalist]

Originally Posted by Hayle White

Carbs! It's the carbohydrates you crave; otherwise, you could have heaven on earth today eating raw vegetables until your heart's content.

Another question: Who will prepare your casseroles and Alfredo's heaven?

Well of course in heaven you wouldn't have to eat your vegetables.

[MysticPhD]

Originally Posted by cb2008

You believe in Dualism. Dualism has no Oneness, you are always separate, the worshipper and the worshipped, the This and the That, the subject and the object.
Oneness is only one, Subject. The object, and the world, resolve into the One Subject.
There is nothing wrong with either path, path of knowledge, or Advaita, and the path of worship or Bhakti. They all lead to Divinity. And one can be both or either at one time or another.
It is all good. No need to diminish the Rishis. They knew.

I do not diminish what the Rishis did especially when they did it. Accurate knowledge of Reality was scarce to nonexistent. They were correct and not correct about the same thing. Recognizing that the mind we use is distinct from the Oneness we are part of is correct. They misunderstood why it is distinct. Existence at our macro level is unavoidably distinct from existence at the level of quanta.

The Rishis had no way to intuit that what we experience as our mind actually is just a delayed playback of a low-energy "recording" of our actual Self as it manifests at the higher-energy level of quanta. The existence of broadcast delay on some radio talk shows provides a useful analog that the Rishis did not have.

[cb2008]

Originally Posted by MysticPhD

I do not diminish what the Rishis did especially when they did it. Accurate knowledge of Reality was scarce to nonexistent. They were correct and not correct about the same thing. Recognizing that the mind we use is distinct from the Oneness we are part of is correct. They misunderstood why it is distinct. Existence at our macro level is unavoidably distinct from existence at the level of quanta.

The Rishis had no way to intuit that what we experience as our mind actually is just a delayed playback of a low-energy "recording" of our actual Self as it manifests at the higher-energy level of quanta. The existence of broadcast delay on some radio talk shows provides a useful analog that the Rishis did not have.

Then you should read the writings of the rishis more deeply with understanding. I find not a single thing that does not add up and what they have recorded are only being discovered by science. About brain activity in deep meditation for instance, the flow of breath and its connection to thoughts, the direct relation of thought activity to anxiety and also to the thinking process. You are missing out because of your inadequate study of the texts, and also the negative attitude you bring to it.
Your Dualism does not sit well with what Advaita is, it is not for everyone.

[Miss Hepburn]

Ecstasy.

[MysticPhD]

Originally Posted by cb2008

Then you should read the writings of the rishis more deeply with understanding. I find not a single thing that does not add up and what they have recorded are only being discovered by science. About brain activity in deep meditation for instance, the flow of breath and its connection to thoughts, the direct relation of thought activity to anxiety and also to the thinking process. You are missing out because of your inadequate study of the texts, and also the negative attitude you bring to it.
Your Dualism does not sit well with what Advaita is, it is not for everyone.

You and the Rshis have the same problem as our neuroscientists but for different reasons. The Rishis did not have sufficient accurate knowledge of our brain and its functions from their spiritual perspective. Neuroscientists have too much misleading information about it from their physical perspective. You all dismiss our individual selves as an illusion. That ability to dismiss and essentially deny your own reality is puzzling to me, not to mention the irrationality of reincarnation without resident memories.

[cb2008]

Originally Posted by MysticPhD

You and the Rshis have the same problem as our neuroscientists but for different reasons. The Rishis did not have sufficient accurate knowledge of our brain and its functions from their spiritual perspective. Neuroscientists have too much misleading information about it from their physical perspective. You all dismiss our individual selves as an illusion. That ability to dismiss and essentially deny your own reality is puzzling to me, not to mention the irrationality of reincarnation without resident memories.

There are two levels of being that we all exist in simultaneously. One is cosmic and the other is the world as we experience and transact with. We experience a sunset, as it sinks into the sea. We experience the blue of the sky. But we know both are illusions. The sun does not move and the the sky is not blue. A stick immersed in water does not bend. But we live with both these levels of awareness and we manage fine.
Similarly it is possible to know Brhman is the truth, and our essence, the soul, the Atman, is the same as Brhman, the Oneness and there is nothing else other than Brhman. But we also inhabit a body and mind and there is a world out there we deal with. So to whom do we pray to if our essence is Brhman? Until we come to that total realization and achieve mukti, moksha, we pray to Ishvara, God, Allah, to the Holy Spirit, the Keeper and Ruler of the Cosmic Laws.

Peace Mystic