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Old 07-11-2022, 03:47 PM
 
Location: NJ
2,676 posts, read 1,265,121 times
Reputation: 1290

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Quote:
Originally Posted by EscAlaMike View Post
Surely you understand that there is a great difference between promoting Truth vs. promoting falsehood.
Surely you understand that I don't subscribe to your notion of "Truth" so to my mind you would be subjecting me to falsehood.
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Old 07-11-2022, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Alabama
13,624 posts, read 7,936,616 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rosends View Post
Surely you understand that I don't subscribe to your notion of "Truth" so to my mind you would be subjecting me to falsehood.
♫ It's more than a notion ♫♫


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Old 07-11-2022, 03:51 PM
 
9,345 posts, read 4,325,044 times
Reputation: 3023
Quote:
Originally Posted by EscAlaMike View Post
Surely you understand that there is a great difference between promoting Truth vs. promoting falsehood.
And of course your belief is the Truth and all other beliefs are the falsehoods?
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Old 07-11-2022, 03:55 PM
 
Location: Alabama
13,624 posts, read 7,936,616 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badlander View Post
And of course your belief is the Truth and all other beliefs are the falsehoods?
A thing being True or false is not contingent on yours or my belief in it.

Truth and True Religion exists, and it is our responsibility to seek it out.
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Old 07-11-2022, 03:55 PM
 
Location: NJ
2,676 posts, read 1,265,121 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badlander View Post
And of course your belief is the Truth and all other beliefs are the falsehoods?
That seems to be his position. See post 97. "The Catholic Church condemns the notion of religious liberty."
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Old 07-11-2022, 03:56 PM
 
Location: Northeastern US
20,001 posts, read 13,480,828 times
Reputation: 9938
Quote:
Originally Posted by EscAlaMike View Post
No it doesn't. In the Catholic understanding, a soul cannot be saved apart from the person's will.
And what has / does / will prevent the Church from working mightily to influence or coerce said will?

I understand that, philosophically, coerced will is not fee will. But I have not found ideologues have a good ability to hang onto this concept.
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Old 07-11-2022, 04:00 PM
 
Location: Alabama
13,624 posts, read 7,936,616 times
Reputation: 7104
Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant View Post
And what has / does / will prevent the Church from working mightily to influence or coerce said will?
It's own self?

Napoleon (to a Cardinal): "Your eminence, are you not aware that I have the power to destroy the Catholic Church?”

The Cardinal: “Your majesty, we, the Catholic clergy, have done our best to destroy the church for the last 1,800 years. We have not succeeded, and neither will you.”
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Old 07-11-2022, 04:01 PM
 
9,345 posts, read 4,325,044 times
Reputation: 3023
Quote:
Originally Posted by EscAlaMike View Post
A thing being True or false is not contingent on yours or my belief in it.

Truth and True Religion exists, and it is our responsibility to seek it out.
Sounds like true religion is an assertion that can never be proven. Why aren't Judaism, Lutheran, Mormon, Baptism or Islam not true? Their followers believe that they are.

Setting up a country based on one religion is the Truth and the one true religion sounds like there would be many oppressed people, most of the population in fact. If you do not like a secular society and find itlacks your religious freedom how do you think your proposal would be not much more severe on that?
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Old 07-11-2022, 04:34 PM
 
Location: Northeastern US
20,001 posts, read 13,480,828 times
Reputation: 9938
Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant View Post
And what has / does / will prevent the Church from working mightily to influence or coerce said will?

I understand that, philosophically, coerced will is not fee will. But I have not found ideologues have a good ability to hang onto this concept.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EscAlaMike View Post
Its own self?
Oh! The Church will police itself! Why didn't I think of that? All my concerns are allayed!
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Old 07-11-2022, 04:49 PM
 
Location: Virginia
10,093 posts, read 6,433,756 times
Reputation: 27661
Quote:
Originally Posted by EscAlaMike View Post
♫ It's more than a notion ♫♫


It's your belief; that doesn't make it "THE" truth.
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