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Doesnt atheism require the belief that deity does not exist.
Its a belief. It's not knowledge, or verifiable truth.
And to be consistent, theism is a belief in deity. Also with no verifiable proof.
Neither atheist nor theist, can prove their belief.
As the James Webb telescope and it's associated science get closer to the origins of existence, we return tothat fundamental question of causation.
Neither belief system has proof.
That's all.
Obviously the problems associated with theism and atheism, socially, religiously and politically are apparent, and easy to identify.
Do you see how you are twisting my words to suit your argument here?
I say, and I continue to explain I am an atheist because I know of no evidence or proof a god exists...
There is nothing that involves or requires faith for any of that. None any more than I need faith the earth is round because I know of no evidence or proof the earth is flat. Do you? If you need faith for that, then again we're talking two very different things, and what you are talking about is too much a stretch from reality for me.
Again simply put, you don't need to have faith to recognize where we have evidence and proof something is there (or not there). If you know of any evidence or proof a god exists, then I'm not sure faith is needed for that either. Faith is applied perhaps toward what we don't know and/or hope to be true. Faith is not needed when it comes to things we do know, and/or when it comes to recognizing there is no such evidence or proof.
Fair?
Are these differences really so difficult to distinguish or understand?
Doesnt atheism require the belief that deity does not exist.
Its a belief. It's not knowledge, or verifiable truth.
And to be consistent, theism is a belief in deity. Also with no verifiable proof.
Neither atheist nor theist, can prove their belief.
As the James Webb telescope and it's associated science get closer to the origins of existence, we return tothat fundamental question of causation.
Neither belief system has proof.
That's all.
Obviously the problems associated with theism and atheism, socially, religiously and politically are apparent, and easy to identify.
No atheism does not require the belief that a God does not exist. It is a lack of belief in any God's, and in many cases that lack of belief is based on insufficient evidence for the existence of a God. Most atheists are agnostic atheists. Some atheists are gnostic atheists in that the "know" that God does not exist.
Proof is for mathematics and court cases. Most things in life are not proven such as gravity or Custer's Last Stand.
My not believing in a God is as much a theory as my not believing in pots of gold at the bottom of a rainbow is a theory.
No atheism does not require the belief that a God does not exist. It is a lack of belief in any God's, and in many cases that lack of belief is based on insufficient evidence for the existence of a God. Most atheists are agnostic atheists. Some atheists are gnostic atheists in that the "know" that God does not exist.
Proof is for mathematics and court cases. Most things in life are not proven such as gravity or Custer's Last Stand.
My not believing in a God is as much a theory as my not believing in pots of gold at the bottom of a rainbow is a theory.
I honestly think that when atheism is described as "the belief that a God does not exist" this confusion is aggravated about what is a belief and what is not. This is why I always try to stay clear of even using that word belief, because it confuses the issue for some people. Especially for people of faith. People who believe...
This is why I always try to simplify and/or clarify that atheism is NOT a belief. Does NOT require faith. I am an atheist for the simple reason that I know of no evidence, proof or reasonable rationale that demonstrates a god exists. Again, beliefs and faith are no more a part of how most of us reasonable people recognize there is no evidence, proof or justification to think the earth is flat. Same sort of thing is all!
I honestly think that when atheism is described as "the belief that a God does not exist" this confusion is aggravated about what is a belief and what is not. This is why I always try to stay clear of even using that word belief, because it confuses the issue for some people. Especially for people of faith. People who believe...
This is why I always try to simplify and/or clarify that atheism is NOT a belief. Does NOT require faith. I am an atheist for the simple reason that I know of no evidence, proof or reasonable rationale that demonstrates a god exists. Again, beliefs and faith are no more a part of how most of us reasonable people recognize there is no evidence, proof or justification to think the earth is flat. Same sort of thing is all!
Doesnt atheism require the belief that deity does not exist.
Its a belief. It's not knowledge, or verifiable truth.
And to be consistent, theism is a belief in deity. Also with no verifiable proof.
Neither atheist nor theist, can prove their belief.
As the James Webb telescope and it's associated science get closer to the origins of existence, we return tothat fundamental question of causation.
Neither belief system has proof.
That's all.
Obviously the problems associated with theism and atheism, socially, religiously and politically are apparent, and easy to identify.
Of course it requires the belief that a God doesn't exist...and that is what Atheism is, no matter how they try to obfuscate.
There is no such thing as "Lacking Belief" in anything one has considered or contemplated...you necessarily have a "Belief" about it.
That "lack belief" stuff is some of the most ridiculous I have ever heard.
You cannot "lack belief" about anything you have ever considered.
If you have considered it...you have some belief about it.
Either one believes a God exists, or they don't. You DO have a belief about it.
THEISM (Theos--God) = God
ATHEISM (A--No Theos--God) = No God
It is that simple.
But those that lack the guts to take a stand need to find some scam excuse to give them a deferment from taking a stand. That is where that "Lack Belief" stuff comes from.
I honestly think that when atheism is described as "the belief that a God does not exist" this confusion is aggravated about what is a belief and what is not. This is why I always try to stay clear of even using that word belief, because it confuses the issue for some people. Especially for people of faith. People who believe...
This is why I always try to simplify and/or clarify that atheism is NOT a belief. Does NOT require faith. I am an atheist for the simple reason that I know of no evidence, proof or reasonable rationale that demonstrates a god exists. Again, beliefs and faith are no more a part of how most of us reasonable people recognize there is no evidence, proof or justification to think the earth is flat. Same sort of thing is all!
Sounds like your describing an agnostic.
Either there was causality, intelligent design, premeditation, ( fill in the blank) or there was not.
Maybe someday, someone or something will make it through the event horizon, come out the otherside of a worm hole and be able to say, " see I told you ".
I was raised in a borderline cult fundamentalist church, became a staunch atheist (and used to post here regularly during that period of my life), and am now on my own spiritual path which has been a wholly unique experience. I am only just recently processing all of my religious trauma from childhood, and I know I have a long road ahead of me. At the same time, somewhere along the way I realized that I don't have the type of brain that can only believe in what science can measure (not that there's anything wrong with that). But I firmly believe I needed atheism to help me move away from my upbringing. It was the first step that I had to take in recovery, and I've taken a few steps since then. I also firmly believe that, for some, atheism or theism is exactly where they're supposed to be on their journey.
Your story reminds me of author M. Scott Peck's "spiritual maturity scale" where he puts atheism / empiricism above fundamentalism but below the highest level on his scale, which is a non-authoritarian, non-dogmatic, intuitive / mystical sort of theism. This makes a sort of back-handed sense to me given that it IS a "spiritual" maturity scale in which the objective must be some sort of "spiritual" outcome at its pinnacle. I do not agree with it however. I take it more as a useful observation that sometimes people who tend to be constitutionally more open to some spiritual practice, will tend to ultimately circle back to it, in a refined and more egalitarian form than they originally experienced.
I am the more heady type, and doubt that I will boomerang back to theism in any capacity. But I can see how it happens to some folks. At least they are no longer hectoring others to obey their rulesets or follow their beliefs.
I honestly think that when atheism is described as "the belief that a God does not exist" this confusion is aggravated about what is a belief and what is not. This is why I always try to stay clear of even using that word belief, because it confuses the issue for some people. Especially for people of faith. People who believe...
This is why I always try to simplify and/or clarify that atheism is NOT a belief. Does NOT require faith. I am an atheist for the simple reason that I know of no evidence, proof or reasonable rationale that demonstrates a god exists. Again, beliefs and faith are no more a part of how most of us reasonable people recognize there is no evidence, proof or justification to think the earth is flat. Same sort of thing is all!
This stuff is definitionally tricky yes.
A-gnosticism -- "without knowledge" says god is not knowable (not, as some insist on claiming, that the jury is still out but might eventually render a verdict; as Huxley envisioned the concept, it is that the jury is dismissed as there's no case to be made).
A-theism -- "without god" says god is not evidenced and therefore cannot be believed.
So in that sense atheism is about the absence of belief due to a lack of knowledge / evidence. That is why I consider myself an agnostic atheist.
It is also tricky because of differing standards of what is admissible as evidence. To most atheists, the popularity, durability, ancientness or subjective appeal of a thing does not make it evidence. At all. But to many theists especially, all those things and more (holy books, personal experiences, etc) are admissible.
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