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if indeed that is your desire, to discuss "how people can misunderstand, hold false assumptions and misconceptions about people who hold differing opinions" then how about giving examples as an atheist of your own completely misunderstanding, holding false assumptions, and misconceptions you have had about those who believe in God?
which would actually be discussing religion and spirituality in the religion and spirituality section of the forum; and would actually be on topic for a thread about atheists in the religion and spirituality forum.
Fair enough.
All is needed then, is your explanation on how simple disbelief in theistic claim (aka atheism) can lead to
complete misunderstanding, holding false assumptions, and misconceptions about those who believe in God.
Why do I need an explanation?
Because I don't see any connection between not believing and misconception about people, false assumptions about people and complete misunderstanding people.
I don't even see where this connection can come from.
Not believing is about evidence. Not about people.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tzaphkiel
if indeed that is your desire, to discuss "how people can misunderstand, hold false assumptions and misconceptions about people who hold differing opinions" then how about giving examples as an atheist of your own completely misunderstanding, holding false assumptions, and misconceptions you have had about those who believe in God?
Are you asking about individual religious and spiritual groups or people who believe in a higher power as a whole? If the former, then there have definitely been times that I’ve had misunderstandings, false assumptions, and misconceptions.
If the latter, then I’m pretty sure the answer is no—not because I think I’m so all-knowing and perfect—but because I don’t broadly think of “believers” as a collective group. I very much separate the fundamentalists from the non-fundamentalists, for one thing (and I have zero issues with religious people who are not fundamentalists).
I just think it's the one big question we all have isn't it? I can't imagine any athiest or any believer never having experienced doubt. I think fundamentally we like to test ourselves, we test our own methodology and see if it sticks up to people who hold beliefs different than our own. I don't hold anyone in contempt and rather admire the strength of so many people's convictions in the face of scientific advances and the endless march of secularism.
I always posit myself as an agnostic, I can't quite ever shake the feeling that to claim to know either way with certainty is breathtakingly arrogant. I can't say for certain if there's a god, perhaps there's loads of them - it would just make as much sense and perhaps there's none at all, but I think coming here, reading and participating in discussions with people of different faiths and beliefs is very much worthwhile and if only discussions like these were more common place in the wider world we would be living a more peaceful existence.
I'm not inclined to spend time here defending accusations about my intentions or desires any further with you.
In the same way for instance it's like stepping into a pool of quicksand that has no bottom. I've shared what I care to share, including that article about how people can develop false impressions about people who don't share their opinions and points of view. Some appreciated that read. You don't. I am in no way surprised.
I'll not concern myself with that fact any more than I'm going to concern myself with all the rest of your obstinance about one thing or another and everything else. All the best to you as I prefer to sign off now. Make of that what you will and in so doing you will no doubt embarrass yourself further. Or should be embarrassed given the truths of these matters, about me in particular.
I've got better things to do in any case. Cheers!
You have given the impression (whether accurate or not) that YOU do not have any misconceptions, misunderstandings, misperceptions, or false impressions of theists or theism because your atheism is never in question. THAT would be what I think Tzaph is trying to get you to either admit or deny.
Here, in this thread/forum, it's not talking politics. It's talking about how people can completely misunderstand, hold false assumptions and misconceptions about people who hold differing opinions. About anything really; politics, religion, race, sex, gender. A point of consideration that applies across the board. One I believe important to consider enough to include or share that article in this forum too. As previously explained when I did.
Does it really not occur to you that despite your repeated insistence along these lines, me, a good many others and the Mods don't seem to agree with you? How can that continue to go unnoticed or completely dismissed by you? Over and over again! Or rather than incessantly object as you do, why not simply focus on the comments that you would prefer to address? Why always so unnecessarily combative?
I really don't know, but no doubt you have raised the bar when it comes to obstinance beyond the pale! Something's not right in any case...
I've asked the same question, to no avail. This is a person who lives on the internet and is as sour as a dill pickle. Narcissists never recognize that THEY are the problem.
Are you asking about individual religious and spiritual groups or people who believe in a higher power as a whole? If the former, then there have definitely been times that I’ve had misunderstandings, false assumptions, and misconceptions.
If the latter, then I’m pretty sure the answer is no—not because I think I’m so all-knowing and perfect—but because I don’t broadly think of “believers” as a collective group. I very much separate the fundamentalists from the non-fundamentalists, for one thing (and I have zero issues with religious people who are not fundamentalists).
What is your objection to religious people who are fundamentalists?
I just think it's the one big question we all have isn't it? I can't imagine any athiest or any believer never having experienced doubt. I think fundamentally we like to test ourselves, we test our own methodology and see if it sticks up to people who hold beliefs different than our own. I don't hold anyone in contempt and rather admire the strength of so many people's convictions in the face of scientific advances and the endless march of secularism.
I always posit myself as an agnostic, I can't quite ever shake the feeling that to claim to know either way with certainty is breathtakingly arrogant. I can't say for certain if there's a god, perhaps there's loads of them - it would just make as much sense and perhaps there's none at all, but I think coming here, reading and participating in discussions with people of different faiths and beliefs is very much worthwhile and if only discussions like these were more common place in the wider world we would be living a more peaceful existence.
I wish every one of you a happy new year.
Scientific advances have not made a dent in the religious life of humanity. People generally don't want to be reduce by the objectivity of science to the existential level of a piece of rock.
Secularists would insist that humanism is imbued with ethics too. They are a new generation of people that are drifting to the dark side.
Are you asking about individual religious and spiritual groups or people who believe in a higher power as a whole? If the former, then there have definitely been times that I’ve had misunderstandings, false assumptions, and misconceptions.
If the latter, then I’m pretty sure the answer is no—not because I think I’m so all-knowing and perfect—but because I don’t broadly think of “believers” as a collective group. I very much separate the fundamentalists from the non-fundamentalists, for one thing (and I have zero issues with religious people who are not fundamentalists).
i also do not consider either group (atheists or believers) as a generic mass with shared beliefs, attributes, characteristics, behaviors. And i do not consider any behavior to be found only in one group but not in the other group as well. because people are people and the behaviors are found in both groups.
the question was asked (in post #205), because the author of the OP said that was his reason for posting the link to the article. i simply asked the author of the OP for examples from his own life as an atheist, his own misunderstandings, false assumptions, misconceptions he has had about believers. it is a reasonable request.
Last edited by Tzaphkiel; 01-01-2023 at 12:37 PM..
i also do not consider either group (atheists or believers) as a generic mass with shared beliefs, attributes, characteristics, behaviors. And i do not consider any behavior to be found only in one group but not in the other group as well. because people are people and the behaviors are found in both groups.
the question was asked (in post #205), because the author of the OP said that was his reason for posting the link to the article. i simply asked the author of the OP for examples from his own life as an atheist, his own misunderstandings, false assumptions, misconceptions he has had about believers. it is a reasonable request.
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