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View Poll Results: Should NY force highway Chic Fil A's to remain open?
Yes, travelers need all options on Sundays 5 16.67%
No, Chic Fil A has freedoms 23 76.67%
Undecided 2 6.67%
Voters: 30. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-23-2023, 11:04 AM
 
Location: Northeastern US
19,958 posts, read 13,455,445 times
Reputation: 9911

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@QuakerBaker,

I can see both sides of this one, but the state controls who gets to operate concessions in these rest areas and what restrictions apply, so I tend to lean in the state's direction. From a purely economic standpoint, your point is well taken that since Chic-Fil-A pays the rent they could be closed all the time if they so choose since the state still gets the rent, but the state's "compelling interest" which is the legal standard here, is to have all the square footage serving passers-by at all times, and I think that is legitimate.

It is also a valid argument IMO that if Chic-Fil-A believes in "honoring the Lord's Day", then they should be fine with missing out on some opportunities as a result ... in fact they should be proud to miss out, and not play the "persecution" card. It is almost certain that this proposed law is a result of annoyance with Chic-Fil-A but there's no evidence that it's some form of religious persecution, either.

 
Old 12-23-2023, 11:59 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,766 posts, read 24,270,853 times
Reputation: 32910
Quote:
Originally Posted by ElijahAstin View Post
You’d have a stronger argument if New York were trying to force all privately run businesses to operate daily. But that’s not what’s happening here. I can understand why some lawmakers want vendors in state-operated rest stops to be open daily, for the benefit of the people who use New York’s limited access highways daily and stop and spend money at said rest stops.


Forgive me for shedding no tears for Homophobia Fried Chicken, which can and will continue to operate throughout New York State and elsewhere.
And btw, these are toll roads.
 
Old 12-23-2023, 06:24 PM
 
4,640 posts, read 1,788,660 times
Reputation: 6428
Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant View Post
@QuakerBaker,

I can see both sides of this one, but the state controls who gets to operate concessions in these rest areas and what restrictions apply, so I tend to lean in the state's direction. From a purely economic standpoint, your point is well taken that since Chic-Fil-A pays the rent they could be closed all the time if they so choose since the state still gets the rent, but the state's "compelling interest" which is the legal standard here, is to have all the square footage serving passers-by at all times, and I think that is legitimate.

It is also a valid argument IMO that if Chic-Fil-A believes in "honoring the Lord's Day", then they should be fine with missing out on some opportunities as a result ... in fact they should be proud to miss out, and not play the "persecution" card. It is almost certain that this proposed law is a result of annoyance with Chic-Fil-A but there's no evidence that it's some form of religious persecution, either.
I'm not sure how this whole thing would work, Mordant. I mean, can the state force a private business to remain open IF that business might lose money?

While the state is getting rent, the business has operational concerns. Electricity, heat in the winter, a/c in the summer, employee's salaries, etc. Would Chic-Fil-A get enough business on a Sunday to actually make a profit? How would that even be determined?

Plus, would the business be required to be open 24 hours?
 
Old 12-23-2023, 07:44 PM
 
Location: NMB, SC
43,059 posts, read 18,231,767 times
Reputation: 34929
CFA has 10 restaurants along the tollway .....and 33 year leases.
They are grandfathered in and in 33 years this will all be forgotten....
 
Old 12-23-2023, 09:48 PM
 
Location: Elsewhere
88,515 posts, read 84,705,921 times
Reputation: 114974
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mink57 View Post
I'm not sure how this whole thing would work, Mordant. I mean, can the state force a private business to remain open IF that business might lose money?

While the state is getting rent, the business has operational concerns. Electricity, heat in the winter, a/c in the summer, employee's salaries, etc. Would Chic-Fil-A get enough business on a Sunday to actually make a profit? How would that even be determined?

Plus, would the business be required to be open 24 hours?
Salaries, yes, the other stuff is probably covered under the contract with the Thruway Authority, which owns the facility. I doubt they pay a separate utility bill.

The point of the concession is not just to provide service to travelers but to provide revenue to the NYTA. They lose out on 1/7th of the revenue with a concession that doesn't stay open 7 days, and you can bet that is the underlying reason for this move. Take it from your local moderator who worked for 37 years for a similar authority.
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Old 12-24-2023, 06:27 AM
 
323 posts, read 135,310 times
Reputation: 1326
Let's look at the actual facts of this case.

One, in 2021 the Thruway Authority contracted with an agency (Applegreen) to manage service area leases. Applegreen arranged the leases in question with Chik-fil-A. So all those claiming that 'the state' knew about Chik-fil-A's Sunday policy when 'the state' arranged leases with Chik-fil-A are mistaken, because 'the state' did not arrange those leases; Applegreen did.

Two, the Thruway Authority that concluded the arrangement with Applegreen is not those legislators who have introduced this bill. I trust the notion that every member of state government must provide unwavering and eternal support, without ever proposing any alternative law or policy or practice, to every action ever taken by the executive or the legislative or the judicial branches, is not a notion that is actually held by anyone.

Three, and this is critical, the new law would only affect future contracts of this sort. Let me quote some relevant portions of the bill:
Quote:
§ 390. Contracts for food service. Any contracts entered into for the operation of food services or food concessions at public transportation facilities owned or operated by the authority shall require that such services be provided every day of the week.
Note the requirement. It says nothing about abrogating existing contracts.

Further clarification:
Quote:
§ 3. This act shall take effect on the thirtieth day after it shall have become a law and shall apply to contracts entered into on and after such date;
See? It explicitly applies only to future arrangements.

The bill:
https://legislation.nysenate.gov/pdf/bills/2023/A8336

It seems that the Outrage Industrial Complex failed to mention these details.
 
Old 12-24-2023, 07:33 AM
 
Location: Northeastern US
19,958 posts, read 13,455,445 times
Reputation: 9911
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mink57 View Post
I'm not sure how this whole thing would work, Mordant. I mean, can the state force a private business to remain open IF that business might lose money?
No, Chic-Fil-A has the right to not do business there so the state can't force them to be open on Sunday. They have hundreds of other locations outside the NY state toll road system.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mink57 View Post
While the state is getting rent, the business has operational concerns. Electricity, heat in the winter, a/c in the summer, employee's salaries, etc. Would Chic-Fil-A get enough business on a Sunday to actually make a profit? How would that even be determined?

Plus, would the business be required to be open 24 hours?
The other businesses there consider it worth the concession rights to have to be open 7 days, although my guess is that people travel on Sundays to get home for work on Monday and there's probably plenty of Sunday business.

I have no idea whether they are open at night, but again really this is just a sort of real estate leas / concession rights situation where in exchange for the facilities you get the business and adhere to whatever other restrictions or requirements that the property owner decides to impose. I would guess that being closed on Sundays is uncommon enough in the past 30 years that it wasn't considered necessary to make explicit at the time these arrangements were originally done.
 
Old 12-24-2023, 08:55 AM
 
Location: Oklahoma
17,777 posts, read 13,670,239 times
Reputation: 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mink57 View Post
Would Chic-Fil-A get enough business on a Sunday to actually make a profit?
This post reminds me of something that happened with my then 17 year old step son.

We had a lake house we lived in at that time. On our side of the lake there was a small store/bait shop by the boat ramp... and that was pretty much all we had on our side. All the other commercial stuff was on the other side of the lake.

It was a Monday ...July 4th and I asked him if he would drive over to the little store and get a few items so we could could out.

He looked at me and innocently said... "Are you sure they will be open on the fourth of July?"
 
Old 12-26-2023, 08:22 AM
 
Location: Alabama
13,611 posts, read 7,915,420 times
Reputation: 7093
Chick fil-A = overpriced and overrated.

Food that appeals to children at a grown up price.

If I want a chicken sandwich, an equally good or better one can be had at nearly every other fast food restaurant these days without having to wait in a drive-thru line that's wrapped around the store 3x.

People go on about how CFA is such a great company to work for. Maybe it is at the corporate level, but I worked at a CFA restaurant for a short time while I was in college, and color me unimpressed. Easily the worst job I ever had, and the ownership and management were terrible, condescending jerks.
 
Old 12-26-2023, 08:34 AM
 
Location: Northeastern US
19,958 posts, read 13,455,445 times
Reputation: 9911
Quote:
Originally Posted by EscAlaMike View Post
People go on about how CFA is such a great company to work for. Maybe it is at the corporate level, but I worked at a CFA restaurant for a short time while I was in college, and color me unimpressed. Easily the worst job I ever had, and the ownership and management were terrible, condescending jerks.
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