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Old 02-22-2024, 11:00 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heavenese View Post
According to my understanding of the Historical Jesus, He considered those who were poor and suffering as to be having it made. He looked at them as we would look at someone who is successful in their life, maybe have a good job and are healthy, have family and are able to go on vacations with them etc. We would say such people "have it good" or "They got it good"!!! The Historical Jesus is saying those who are poor, afflicted, weeping, "have it good"!!! Why? Because they will inherit God's kingdom. (This coming from the sayings of Jesus and His sermon on the mount.) I haven't found any other religious figure speak about the poor in this way.


Conversely, Jesus looked at the rich, the well-fed and satisfied, and those who enjoyed life with pity. So looking at the world from the Kingdom of God's perspective according to the Historical Jesus, it is a very topsy-turvy outlook on society. Again, I don't know of any other figure who taught being poor had a good aspect to it, much less saying they have it made. I argue this is something unique we can learn from the Historical Jesus.
So may we assume that you live a life that could honestly be described as "poor and suffering"?
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Old 02-22-2024, 11:06 AM
 
Location: North by Northwest
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Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
So may we assume that you live a life that could honestly be described as "poor and suffering"?
Not to mention the fact that the increasingly prominent Prosperity Gospel movement believes the exact opposite.
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Old 02-22-2024, 11:09 AM
 
2,434 posts, read 1,451,233 times
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Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
So may we assume that you live a life that could honestly be described as "poor and suffering"?
I certainly came from a people like that. Yet again I would say for the Historical Jesus' overall message is those who are unsatisfied with this world. Those who are poor and suffering most likely fall into this category.
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Old 02-22-2024, 11:16 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heavenese View Post
I certainly came from a people like that. Yet again I would say for the Historical Jesus' overall message is those who are unsatisfied with this world. Those who are poor and suffering most likely fall into this category.
You avoided answering the question. After all, it wouldn't be a bit impossible for you to give away all your worldly possessions and go and become a street person.

What you wrote above reminds me of a discussion I twice attempted to get going in this forum, but it had do with principles -- and most of the christians here disdain talking about principles -- instead of proving things about Jesus they can't possibly prove. As a result my attempt at discussing principles -- in this case the beatitudes -- died a quick death.
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Old 02-22-2024, 11:40 AM
 
Location: NMB, SC
43,141 posts, read 18,298,681 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
You avoided answering the question. After all, it wouldn't be a bit impossible for you to give away all your worldly possessions and go and become a street person.

What you wrote above reminds me of a discussion I twice attempted to get going in this forum, but it had do with principles -- and most of the christians here disdain talking about principles -- instead of proving things about Jesus they can't possibly prove. As a result my attempt at discussing principles -- in this case the beatitudes -- died a quick death.
Because you go to the extreme...give everything away.

It doesn't have to be like that.
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Old 02-22-2024, 11:47 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
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Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
Because you go to the extreme...give everything away.

It doesn't have to be like that.
Matthew 19:21-24
“If you want to give it all you’ve got,” Jesus replied, “go sell your possessions; give everything to the poor. All your wealth will then be in heaven. Then come follow me.”

That's your bible...not mine.
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Old 02-22-2024, 12:00 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma
17,807 posts, read 13,708,449 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
Matthew 19:21-24
“If you want to give it all you’ve got,” Jesus replied, “go sell your possessions; give everything to the poor. All your wealth will then be in heaven. Then come follow me.”

That's your bible...not mine.
Waving my hand frantically because I know the answer to this one...

And the answer is this...

"That is just for that one rich guy that Jesus was talking to there... and not for anybody else.."

As a result of this particular position... if a Christian brings up another story where Jesus is talking to people...

I just say "That is just for those people that Jesus was talking to right then. It's not for anybody else."

What I have found is that Christians pretty much don't have "not for anybody else" theology except for that one "rich guy" story.
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Old 02-22-2024, 01:09 PM
 
Location: NMB, SC
43,141 posts, read 18,298,681 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
Matthew 19:21-24
“If you want to give it all you’ve got,” Jesus replied, “go sell your possessions; give everything to the poor. All your wealth will then be in heaven. Then come follow me.”

That's your bible...not mine.
That's not what I read:

From NASB
21 Jesus said to him, “If you want to be complete, go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.”


From Codex Sinaiticus (dated 350AD)
21 Jesus said to him: If thou wilt be perfect, go sell thy goods, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven, and come follow me.

https://www.codexsinaiticus.org/en/m...r&zoomSlider=0
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Old 02-22-2024, 01:31 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,855 posts, read 24,359,728 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
That's not what I read:

From NASB
21 Jesus said to him, “If you want to be complete, go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.”


From Codex Sinaiticus (dated 350AD)
21 Jesus said to him: If thou wilt be perfect, go sell thy goods, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven, and come follow me.

https://www.codexsinaiticus.org/en/m...r&zoomSlider=0
Isn't it a shame that bibles don't agree. Pick, pick, pick
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Old 02-22-2024, 01:37 PM
 
Location: North by Northwest
9,352 posts, read 13,017,052 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
Isn't it a shame that bibles don't agree. Pick, pick, pick
Camels and eyes of needles don’t lie.
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