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Old 02-19-2024, 07:56 PM
 
Location: Northeastern US
19,956 posts, read 13,450,937 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SickofJersey View Post
I have raised my daughter to believe that the truest gift to God is to be a good honest person and to help others without even the slightest expectation of reward. That is as God-like as anything else we could do.
That's a pretty good statement of the problem space :-) I think you've raised your daughter well. I have to wonder how many people, in or out of church, have this as an actual goal they're putting serious effort into.
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Old 02-19-2024, 08:06 PM
 
Location: Northeastern US
19,956 posts, read 13,450,937 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Horn of ‘83 View Post
If you’re agnostic, why are you teaching your daughter to be God-like?
I think you're missing her point, which is that the core of being a good person isn't religious observance, but selflessly doing good without expectation of recognition or reward. Or as Jesus is supposed to have said, "love your neighbor as yourself -- on this hang all the law and the prophets". Some people think being sanctimonious and pious and judgmental is the same as actually being good. It's not even close.
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Old 02-20-2024, 08:38 AM
 
Location: Beautiful Four Oaks
813 posts, read 440,825 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tzaphkiel View Post
good question. curious to hear the response.
Because I want her to be a good person. And whether God exists or not it is the greatest example of that.

Again, I say what I feel. You can attempt to argue with me or try to back me in a corner. It won't work.

I live my life my way and always try to be fair and honest. I also try my best to teach my daughter the same and let her decide to believe in however she wishes.
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Old 02-20-2024, 08:40 AM
 
Location: Beautiful Four Oaks
813 posts, read 440,825 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant View Post
I think you're missing her point, which is that the core of being a good person isn't religious observance, but selflessly doing good without expectation of recognition or reward. Or as Jesus is supposed to have said, "love your neighbor as yourself -- on this hang all the law and the prophets". Some people think being sanctimonious and pious and judgmental is the same as actually being good. It's not even close.
Thank you mordant, that is exactly what I mean.

Some may be looking for confrontation, but I would rather not be drawn into that.
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Old 02-20-2024, 08:46 AM
 
Location: East Coast of the United States
27,541 posts, read 28,630,498 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWiseShopper View Post
When I think about all the time we spend going to church, bowing, kneeling and praying to a God that may or may not exist; it makes me wonder why we spend so much time doing this when we really have no proof of God's existence and whether our religion is right in its beliefs. How did humans begin to dwell on such things?
I believe it is mainly because of the fear of death.

No human likes the fact that their life has an expiration date.

So, people invent gods, religions, afterlives and heavens to believe in.
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Old 02-20-2024, 09:04 AM
 
Location: Free State of Texas
20,438 posts, read 12,775,263 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant View Post
I think you're missing her point, which is that the core of being a good person isn't religious observance, but selflessly doing good without expectation of recognition or reward. Or as Jesus is supposed to have said, "love your neighbor as yourself -- on this hang all the law and the prophets". Some people think being sanctimonious and pious and judgmental is the same as actually being good. It's not even close.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SickofJersey View Post
Thank you mordant, that is exactly what I mean.

Some may be looking for confrontation, but I would rather not be drawn into that.
Then there is no reason to invoke God.
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Old 02-20-2024, 09:21 AM
 
63,775 posts, read 40,038,426 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Horn of ‘83 View Post
Then there is no reason to invoke God.
The religious who killed Jesus thought it was their responsibility to defend God. God needs no defense or enforcement from any of us!! That misguided attitude about God is and has been the source of too much religious evil, IMO.
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Old 02-20-2024, 09:23 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,759 posts, read 24,261,465 times
Reputation: 32903
Quote:
Originally Posted by SickofJersey View Post
Because I want her to be a good person. And whether God exists or not it is the greatest example of that.

Again, I say what I feel. You can attempt to argue with me or try to back me in a corner. It won't work.

I live my life my way and always try to be fair and honest. I also try my best to teach my daughter the same and let her decide to believe in however she wishes.
Some of our posters attempt to dictate religion by fiat. Glad you wrote the bolded.
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Old 02-20-2024, 09:27 AM
 
Location: Middle America
11,061 posts, read 7,132,082 times
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Sure, plenty of people - in church and completely outside of it - following other's ways, other's ideas, following the crowd. There's plenty of that in politics.

Everyone's different, but I see positives in trying to understand ourselves, others, the universe, God or whatever higher power you might consider. It's not about doing anything specific or like anyone else. It's being true to what is within us - our own special DNA and identity - and what we can contribute. Many would say knowing ourselves as best as possible, as well as knowing others and knowing the universe, is the way towards the "good life". Looking around, the most miserable people are those with extremely limiting thinking and understanding. Someone might have a high degree, or be in a prominent position, and yet still essentially know very little beyond a key area.

This is a much broader matter than just applying it to church religion. Look for examples all around you, and even in your own life. Look for the religion of politics, the religion of power, the religion of money, the religion of the online / connected world, the religion of all the trivial matters of the world made somehow important, etc.

Last edited by Thoreau424; 02-20-2024 at 10:22 AM..
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Old 02-20-2024, 10:23 AM
 
Location: Land of the Free
6,706 posts, read 6,711,443 times
Reputation: 7550
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWiseShopper View Post
When I think about all the time we spend going to church, bowing, kneeling and praying to a God that may or may not exist; it makes me wonder why we spend so much time doing this when we really have no proof of God's existence and whether our religion is right in its beliefs.
This is a good question and one I used to think about a lot.

Religion is personal, everyone has their own reasons. My path to Jesus didn't come from family pressure, friends, or anything like that, but my belief that we should live with purpose and direction. After years of trying to influence my subconscious mind to fill that purpose with affirmations, visualizations, and self-help book tactics, I found success when I embraced God's grace, and the principle of unmerited grace.

For me, Christianity is "right" because of its emphasis on unmerited grace. But it might not be right for others, I'm at strong odds with the Church of England (which my dad grew up with), Catholicism, and Judaism (my mom's religion) for their emphasis on deeds and works.

I don't care whether the biblical stories are true, and I believe the universe and earth are billions of years old. Religion for me is about faith, not facts, and that belief has improved my life.
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