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There had to be ceremonies as the bible talks about dowries, and seeing if the woman was a virgin, feasts, etc
I believe they were given certificates also know as ketubahs.
The reason I believe that is because of Moses later issuing the certificate of divorce.
The reason why I believe there were ceremonies....
When Jacob married
22And Laban gathered together all the men of the place, and made a feast.
Remember that Jews/Hebrews have festivities for many things starting from the bris (circumcision), when the boy is weaned, bar mitzvah, when is ready to join the army at 20, and when he is allowed to be a priest at 30.
[quote=MontanaGuy;5112543]Due to the strangeness of how my mind works I have another peculiar question.
Let's start even further back. I was brought up to believe the Genesis story, but even in my teens I started to worry about certain aspects of it. For instance, we are not told anything about God's personal appearance, whether he was very dark, or very light, or anything in-between. As we are told that he created mankind in his own image, it would be interesting to speculate what the first couple looked like. There I have a slight problem, Montana Guy, since I was also taught not to believe in evolution.
What, then, would you say to this fascinating conundrum? Clearly, the world today is populated with a splendid array of people of all races and colours, but where did they all come from? Say, for instance, Eve was of an Oriental appearance (and we are not told otherwise) - then, being the mother of all women, should we now see no women other than Oriental types - as her descendants? I only ask because you are a self-confessed asker of strange and irrelevant questions, so please help me out here.
Without resorting to the infamous Darwin, who would say that the different races evolved gradually over a long period of time, changing as required by the environment, we must conclude that God created several human ancestors, but not all of them could, of course, be in his own personal image, whatever that may be.
Not a word about this in Genesis, sadly, so I am forced to speculate that the Bible is incomplete, or just plain invention. Oh! and these human variants would have also been invited aboard the Ark in order to survive the flood - but again silence. Is this question off-beat enough to keep you awake at night? - it does me.
I await your reply with great anticipation, thanks.
There I have a slight problem, Montana Guy, since I was also taught not to believe in evolution.
What, then, would you say to this fascinating conundrum? Clearly, the world today is populated with a splendid array of people of all races and colours, but where did they all come from? Say, for instance, Eve was of an Oriental appearance (and we are not told otherwise) - then, being the mother of all women, should we now see no women other than Oriental types - as her descendants? I only ask because you are a self-confessed asker of strange and irrelevant questions, so please help me out here.
I would be more than happy to help you out. Your first problem was that you were taught not to believe in evolution. It's a problem because evolution is a fact and if you can't accept it as such then you're forced to come up with irrational explanations for things that the Bible doesn't explain.
The world is populated by various races of human beings because although modern humans began as a small population in Africa somewhere in the range of 100,000 years ago and were almost certainly dark skinned because they were adapted to that climate over thousands of years there were many migrations of people who slowly populated the world. They were geographically separated from each other and adapted to their new environments which gradually changed such things as skin pigmentation, eye color, and various physical characteristics that we recognize today as race. The differences between human beings genetically speaking are actually quite small even though our physical appearances are sometimes strikingly different when you compare a very dark skinned African individual for example with a blue eyed, blond haired and light skinned individual in someplace like Sweden.
I noticed you stated that I ask stange and irrelevent questions. I admitted that I do come up with some strange ones but I don't think they're irrelevent and see that you've at least thought about some of the things that just don't make sense about the Bible. I've read the entire Bible and it makes no sense to me whatsoever and I would never use it as a source of information for something that needs to be answered by science.
There had to be ceremonies as the bible talks about dowries, and seeing if the woman was a virgin, feasts, etc
It is possible that some form of ceremony may have come into existence somewhere over the passage of time.
There remains only one ceremony in the Bible.
And at that one ceremony only the bride and groom attended.
Quote:
... Remember that Jews/Hebrews have festivities for many things starting from the bris (circumcision), when the boy is weaned, bar mitzvah, when is ready to join the army at 20, and when he is allowed to be a priest at 30.
Sorry, but no I do not 'remember' each of these ceremonies in the Bible.
Could you kindly provide Bible passages where each of these Bible ceremonies occurred?
1. bris (circumcision),
2. when the boy is weaned,
3. bar mitzvah,
4. when is ready to join the army at 20,
5. and when he is allowed to be a priest at 30.
It is possible that some form of ceremony may have come into existence somewhere over the passage of time.
There remains only one ceremony in the Bible.
And at that one ceremony only the bride and groom attended.
Sorry, but no I do not 'remember' each of these ceremonies in the Bible.
Could you kindly provide Bible passages where each of these Bible ceremonies occurred?
1. bris (circumcision),
2. when the boy is weaned,
3. bar mitzvah,
4. when is ready to join the army at 20,
5. and when he is allowed to be a priest at 30.
MontanaGuy, My friend - thanks for the prompt answer.
All I can say is that I am delighted to discover that there is some intelligent life on this forum, (you), having wasted a day arguing with the most rabid fundamentalists, and been shocked to the core with the appalling views some of them hold. Being incurably British, I have to confess that I frequently resort to irony, as exemplified by the post I sent earlier.
It's true that I was brought up in a very religious environment, and therefore know more of the Bible than is good for me, and did, indeed, reject the whole thing after much serious thinking when I was a teenager. I have, I am happy to say, never looked back (I am now in my 50s) - and have enjoyed a full life, with, as the wag said, 'no invisible means of support' (other than my conscience).
I am therefore a little pained that you took my posting seriously, as I am a Darwinist through and through, and see far more beauty in the elegance of this school of thought than ever I found in the confused poetry of Genesis.
Please beware of us Brits in future, we have well earned our reputation for not taking anything too seriously, religion included. But honestly, who could resist a forum discussing whether Adam and Eve were married? It's a bit like discussing whether the moon is made of Emmental or Stilton cheese..
(sorry, mate).
I would be more than happy to help you out. Your first problem was that you were taught not to believe in evolution. It's a problem because evolution is a fact and if you can't accept it as such then you're forced to come up with irrational explanations for things that the Bible doesn't explain.
The world is populated by various races of human beings because although modern humans began as a small population in Africa somewhere in the range of 100,000 years ago and were almost certainly dark skinned because they were adapted to that climate over thousands of years there were many migrations of people who slowly populated the world. They were geographically separated from each other and adapted to their new environments which gradually changed such things as skin pigmentation, eye color, and various physical characteristics that we recognize today as race. The differences between human beings genetically speaking are actually quite small even though our physical appearances are sometimes strikingly different when you compare a very dark skinned African individual for example with a blue eyed, blond haired and light skinned individual in someplace like Sweden.
I noticed you stated that I ask stange and irrelevent questions. I admitted that I do come up with some strange ones but I don't think they're irrelevent and see that you've at least thought about some of the things that just don't make sense about the Bible. I've read the entire Bible and it makes no sense to me whatsoever and I would never use it as a source of information for something that needs to be answered by science.[/quote]
Last edited by brianrees; 10-12-2008 at 04:40 PM..
Due to the strangeness of how my mind works I have another peculiar question.
Let's start even further back. I was brought up to believe the Genesis story, but even in my teens I started to worry about certain aspects of it. For instance, we are not told anything about God's personal appearance, whether he was very dark, or very light, or anything in-between. As we are told that he created mankind in his own image, it would be interesting to speculate what the first couple looked like. There I have a slight problem, Montana Guy, since I was also taught not to believe in evolution.
What, then, would you say to this fascinating conundrum? Clearly, the world today is populated with a splendid array of people of all races and colours, but where did they all come from? Say, for instance, Eve was of an Oriental appearance (and we are not told otherwise) - then, being the mother of all women, should we now see no women other than Oriental types - as her descendants? I only ask because you are a self-confessed asker of strange and irrelevant questions, so please help me out here.
Without resorting to the infamous Darwin, who would say that the different races evolved gradually over a long period of time, changing as required by the environment, we must conclude that God created several human ancestors, but not all of them could, of course, be in his own personal image, whatever that may be.
Not a word about this in Genesis, sadly, so I am forced to speculate that the Bible is incomplete, or just plain invention. Oh! and these human variants would have also been invited aboard the Ark in order to survive the flood - but again silence. Is this question off-beat enough to keep you awake at night? - it does me.
I await your reply with great anticipation, thanks.
Adam and Eve were probably a darker/olivy color skin. From them came all the colors of skin you see today. There is no need for lots of time, just looking at Mendels Laws shows that variation would have been seen in the first offspring. It is even said that when Seth was born he was in the likeness of Adam. Which means the other children previous to Seth were not like Adam or different colors. So, to answer your question no other people were needed to get the different colors of skin or races. The bible is silent on other people on the ark, because there was no other people on the ark. Sorry to blow your theory out of the water.
Montana: last I heard, there are still disputations amongst scientists and others in those groups that cannot agree on some aspects of the evolution theory. As far as I have heard, it is still that: a theory.
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