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Old 11-21-2008, 09:03 AM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
33,501 posts, read 37,011,343 times
Reputation: 13972

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What proof about biblical science have you ever provided Campbell? All I have ever seen from you is junk science and links from creation sites or AIG. I asked you to prove bible prophesies other than you favorite east gate thing...I got nothing. What the heck is this paths through the sea thing? Has some assumption been made because the word paths was used? Is it like a birds flight path?
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Old 11-21-2008, 10:27 AM
 
Location: Richardson, TX
8,734 posts, read 13,772,024 times
Reputation: 3807
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
What proof about biblical science have you ever provided Campbell? All I have ever seen from you is junk science and links from creation sites or AIG. I asked you to prove bible prophesies other than you favorite east gate thing...I got nothing. What the heck is this paths through the sea thing? Has some assumption been made because the word paths was used? Is it like a birds flight path?
Psalm 8:8

8The birds of the heavens and the fish of the sea,
Whatever passes through the paths of the seas.


Shipping lanes were already observed at the time this was written, it was not some revelation of something previously unknown, as Campbell would suggest, rather it was a song attributing credit of something widely utilized in trading.

Campbell,
Is it really a good idea to claim things mentioned in the Bible as unknown to "science" as a way to confirm the Bible's veracity, or proof that it is inspired by God, becasue it supposedly mentions things that man would have no way of knowing about until technology was advanced well beyond Biblical times? This opens up more problems such as "science" as found in the Koran. Is the Koran inspired as well, since it mentions pulsars, for instance? Google Science in the Koran. It is opening the proverbial pandora's box, with what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

I remember someone claiming as proof that the Bible was inspired in this same fashion, during the indoor mold frienzy from a couple of years ago, that housekeeping laws in Leviticus 13 already new about the dangers of mold and mildew long before modern science did. These things were already widely known to cause health problems from simple observations. It didn't take modern science to discover that.
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Old 11-21-2008, 03:02 PM
 
418 posts, read 707,615 times
Reputation: 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by PanTerra View Post
Psalm 8:8

8The birds of the heavens and the fish of the sea,
Whatever passes through the paths of the seas.


Shipping lanes were already observed at the time this was written, it was not some revelation of something previously unknown, as Campbell would suggest, rather it was a song attributing credit of something widely utilized in trading.

Campbell,
Is it really a good idea to claim things mentioned in the Bible as unknown to "science" as a way to confirm the Bible's veracity, or proof that it is inspired by God, becasue it supposedly mentions things that man would have no way of knowing about until technology was advanced well beyond Biblical times? This opens up more problems such as "science" as found in the Koran. Is the Koran inspired as well, since it mentions pulsars, for instance? Google Science in the Koran. It is opening the proverbial pandora's box, with what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

I remember someone claiming as proof that the Bible was inspired in this same fashion, during the indoor mold frienzy from a couple of years ago, that housekeeping laws in Leviticus 13 already new about the dangers of mold and mildew long before modern science did. These things were already widely known to cause health problems from simple observations. It didn't take modern science to discover that.
Yes! The next thing we know, Campbell will cite the bible as the revelation that humans needed food and water because someone was eating and drinking in the bible. And then he will demand we disprove his claim!
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Old 11-21-2008, 09:59 PM
 
7,628 posts, read 10,950,024 times
Reputation: 498
Quote:
Originally Posted by PanTerra View Post
Psalm 8:8

8The birds of the heavens and the fish of the sea,
Whatever passes through the paths of the seas.


Shipping lanes were already observed at the time this was written, it was not some revelation of something previously unknown, as Campbell would suggest, rather it was a song attributing credit of something widely utilized in trading.

Campbell,
Is it really a good idea to claim things mentioned in the Bible as unknown to "science" as a way to confirm the Bible's veracity, or proof that it is inspired by God, becasue it supposedly mentions things that man would have no way of knowing about until technology was advanced well beyond Biblical times? This opens up more problems such as "science" as found in the Koran. Is the Koran inspired as well, since it mentions pulsars, for instance? Google Science in the Koran. It is opening the proverbial pandora's box, with what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

I remember someone claiming as proof that the Bible was inspired in this same fashion, during the indoor mold frienzy from a couple of years ago, that housekeeping laws in Leviticus 13 already new about the dangers of mold and mildew long before modern science did. These things were already widely known to cause health problems from simple observations. It didn't take modern science to discover that.
Shipping lanes were already observed at the time this was written?
The paths through the sea was first spoken of in the Bible, and that was about 3,000 years ago. And no, the world was not aware of such global currents until the mid-nineteenth century, it was in 1860 that a pioneer in oceanography, Matthew Fontaine Maaury discovered that the ocean was a circulating system. If you do your homework, you will discover that is true. And it was Maaury who was credited with that discovery. Ocean currents were known, but as far as those currents being thought of as paths through the sea, that was not.

I believe the Koran was inspired by an advanced intelligence, so it would be possible that advanced knowledge could be found there. Yet I do not believe that advanced intelligence is of God, and according to the Scriptures, only an advanced intelligence that comes from the real God will be 100% correct all the time. I do not believe the Koran has that kind of consistancy.

There are many false claims made about the Bible, I try to center my knowledge on the claims that are not false. The Bible is not in error here, it is usually people, who have made false assumptions.
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Old 11-21-2008, 10:49 PM
 
7,628 posts, read 10,950,024 times
Reputation: 498
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnJLethal View Post
Oh I'm sorry Campbell, I missed the part where you apparently satisfied the prerequisites for this discussion.

Impossible Challenge #1 "The Bible rests on Sound Science" - Where was your independent study (aside from "it's written in the bible) that talking serpents and talking donkeys are scientifically possible? Did you make that case already? Men created from dust, women from dustman's rib? Burning bushes not consumed that talk? Men swallowed by whale for three days and lives? Animals all over the world getting on a boat in Israel? Men dead for three days who come back to life? (Please don't cite Dawn of The Dead movie please. ) Etc.

In addition, plenty of books can be written that perpetuate a self-contained prophecy myth. Let's see 1) Dune 2) Star Wars 3) Lord Of The Rings...I'm sure there are many more that other people can suggest. The point is, when you continue a storyline across many books with many authors, we call that a book series...see Spider-Man or X-Men comic books as the colored pictures may help you with this.

You haven't made any case to warrant a real challenge. Nostradamus seems to be making more "predictions" that are relevant to current (recent) events than the bible. Why don't you set-up a religion around him?

You probably wow your circle of friends with your bible knowledge, but around here it's more of the same. We're not impressed.


Well, what's more of the same, is you have ignored every question I have put to you.

1. Paths through the sea was spoken of in the Bible 3,000 years ago. I ask if that was (True) or (False)? Your answer to that question. (NOT GIVEN)

2. I gave prophecies that were spoken of in the Bible, especially the return of the Jews to Israel. I ask if that prophecy was (True) or (Fales)? Your answer to that question. (NOT GIVEN)

3. I told you about historical discoveries that showed the Bible to be correct. I ask if that discovered history was (True) or (False)? Your answer to that question. (NOT GIVEN)

I'm not impressed with your inability to even answer one question.
You can spout of all you want, but unless you are prepared to actually answer a question, you are wasting all of our time. I have given three examples, and you have yet answer or refute even one of them. It's pretty obvious to me, that you lack the intellectual capacity to respond, so I can only assume I am dealing with a youngster here.
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Old 11-21-2008, 10:52 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
33,501 posts, read 37,011,343 times
Reputation: 13972
Quote:
Originally Posted by Campbell34 View Post
Shipping lanes were already observed at the time this was written?
The paths through the sea was first spoken of in the Bible, and that was about 3,000 years ago. And no, the world was not aware of such global currents until the mid-nineteenth century, it was in 1860 that a pioneer in oceanography, Matthew Fontaine Maaury discovered that the ocean was a circulating system. If you do your homework, you will discover that is true. And it was Maaury who was credited with that discovery. Ocean currents were known, but as far as those currents being thought of as paths through the sea, that was not.

I believe the Koran was inspired by an advanced intelligence, so it would be possible that advanced knowledge could be found there. Yet I do not believe that advanced intelligence is of God, and according to the Scriptures, only an advanced intelligence that comes from the real God will be 100% correct all the time. I do not believe the Koran has that kind of consistancy.

There are many false claims made about the Bible, I try to center my knowledge on the claims that are not false. The Bible is not in error here, it is usually people, who have made false assumptions.
Wrong again Campbell....When are you going to realize that there are NO answers in genesis. Just answers twisted to fit the fundie agenda.

The ocean currents were known for hundreds of years before Matthew Maury. Your claim is false. In any case why do you think the paths of the seas refers to ocean currents. I would say it more likely was referring to shipping lanes of those days. By the way this excerpt actually comes from a creationist site...You should appreciate that.

Matthew Maury was born in 1806 and his active career must have started not before at least 1826. He was an experienced sailor and later a famous oceanographer as you say. However, he was not the first to discover ocean currents or "Paths of the Sea" They were known for hundreds and perhaps thousands of years before the time of Matthew Maury. I am attaching a chart published by Benjamin Franklin that shows the Gulf Stream. This chart was published in 1786, 20 years before Matthew Maury was born. Also, Ponce De Leon wrote about the Florida current in the early 1500s, about 300 years before Maury. Your web site and many others on the Internet grossly misrepresent the facts of this case. With due regard for high quality standards, I hope you will see fit to correct your comments to be in agreement with the facts. Incidentally other Christian sources on the Internet state that the story is a myth about how Maury was prompted by the Bible to search for paths of the sea. Whatever the truth about the little story, it is a fact that Maury was by no means the first to realize the importance of ocean currents, nor did he discover them. See the attachment for a photo of Franklin's chart. One last remark; Maury did not need the Bible to inform him about ocean currents because they were well known to sailors of his day.

"Matthew Maury and the Paths of the Sea"
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Old 11-21-2008, 11:02 PM
 
418 posts, read 707,615 times
Reputation: 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by Campbell34 View Post
Well, what's more of the same, is you have ignored every question I have put to you.

1. Paths through the sea was spoken of in the Bible 3,000 years ago. I ask if that was (True) or (False)? Your answer to that question. (NOT GIVEN)

2. I gave prophecies that were spoken of in the Bible, especially the return of the Jews to Israel. I ask if that prophecy was (True) or (Fales)? Your answer to that question. (NOT GIVEN)

3. I told you about historical discoveries that showed the Bible to be correct. I ask if that discovered history was (True) or (False)? Your answer to that question. (NOT GIVEN)

I'm not impressed with your inability to even answer one question.
You can spout of all you want, but unless you are prepared to actually answer a question, you are wasting all of our time. I have given three examples, and you have yet answer or refute even one of them. It's pretty obvious to me, that you lack the intellectual capacity to respond, so I can only assume I am dealing with a youngster here.
Campbell, you are trying to discuss home runs when you can't even make contact with the baseball. Try to get to first base first.

Again, you believe in balloons from biblegod, people rising from the dead, a virgin giving birth, need I go on? We're not on equal footing. I'm on the mountain's peak throwing you down a rope ladder so you can climb up.

This is apparent to all except you and your peeps.
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Old 11-21-2008, 11:38 PM
 
Location: morocco
69 posts, read 149,790 times
Reputation: 27
If you want to know more about Noah Ark you read this :
Noah Ark at Gudi MT (http://www.55a.net/firas/english/?page=show_det&id=335&select_page=2 - broken link)
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Old 11-22-2008, 12:36 AM
 
7,628 posts, read 10,950,024 times
Reputation: 498
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
Wrong again Campbell....When are you going to realize that there are NO answers in genesis. Just answers twisted to fit the fundie agenda.

The ocean currents were known for hundreds of years before Matthew Maury. Your claim is false. In any case why do you think the paths of the seas refers to ocean currents. I would say it more likely was referring to shipping lanes of those days. By the way this excerpt actually comes from a creationist site...You should appreciate that.

Matthew Maury was born in 1806 and his active career must have started not before at least 1826. He was an experienced sailor and later a famous oceanographer as you say. However, he was not the first to discover ocean currents or "Paths of the Sea" They were known for hundreds and perhaps thousands of years before the time of Matthew Maury. I am attaching a chart published by Benjamin Franklin that shows the Gulf Stream. This chart was published in 1786, 20 years before Matthew Maury was born. Also, Ponce De Leon wrote about the Florida current in the early 1500s, about 300 years before Maury. Your web site and many others on the Internet grossly misrepresent the facts of this case. With due regard for high quality standards, I hope you will see fit to correct your comments to be in agreement with the facts. Incidentally other Christian sources on the Internet state that the story is a myth about how Maury was prompted by the Bible to search for paths of the sea. Whatever the truth about the little story, it is a fact that Maury was by no means the first to realize the importance of ocean currents, nor did he discover them. See the attachment for a photo of Franklin's chart. One last remark; Maury did not need the Bible to inform him about ocean currents because they were well known to sailors of his day.

"Matthew Maury and the Paths of the Sea"
I have no doubt that there were those who also made such discoveries, yet it was Maury who published some of the very first publications of the Physical Geography of the sea. In 1855 his book was considered the first extensive and comprehensive book on oceanography. And one of his main contributions, included, (pathways for ships at sea). Knowing about currents was one thing, Maury (actually mapped them). And for that he was nicknamed Pathfinder of the Seas, and Father of modern Oceanography.
We can debate who was the first to discover the reality of such paths, yet once again, I would point out that is was the Bible that first stated that such paths even existed. Some ocean currents were know, yet the idea of many such currents being present was not. And history states that Maury only got the idea to search for them after being sick in bed and his son read to him Psalm chapter 8, verse 8. That is one of those little facts of history. And yes, Ponce De Leon may of mention Florida currents 300 years before Maury, but the Bible spoken of the paths through the sea 2700 years before Ponce De Leon. And that is the main point, such paths through the sea were spoken of (first) in the Bible.
If the Bible was written by simple desert dwellers, how could they possibily know about the paths through the sea?
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Old 11-22-2008, 12:43 AM
 
7,628 posts, read 10,950,024 times
Reputation: 498
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnJLethal View Post
Campbell, you are trying to discuss home runs when you can't even make contact with the baseball. Try to get to first base first.

Again, you believe in balloons from biblegod, people rising from the dead, a virgin giving birth, need I go on? We're not on equal footing. I'm on the mountain's peak throwing you down a rope ladder so you can climb up.

This is apparent to all except you and your peeps.
What is really apparent to all, is you still refuse to answer even one of the three question I have put to you. I'm the one pitching, your the one who refuses to swing the bat. I can't even get you to answer one of those questions with a simple (YES) or (NO). It's not I who has ended the conversation, it is you and your refusal to answer a single question.
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