Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
One thing I've never really gotten about my Baptist upbringing is the idea that we die and are judged when reality is that we all live such different existences. Maybe if I'd been born into a different existence, I might have believed/not believed. Circumstances have so much to do with what you believe. We tend to become the religion our parents were and that's luck of the draw. I don't get being judged on that. Not if you only get one shot but most religions teach there is only one shot.
If it wer God's plan we forget, then we'd all forget. Or are you saying God makes mistakes and some remember?
Maybe you're misunderstanding me. On the other hand, maybe I'm misunderstanding you. I'll just try to rephrase what I believe. I believe that all of us lived in Heaven in spirit form (i.e. without physical bodies) before we were born. It was our choice to come to earth and participate in God's Plan for us. At birth our spirits entered into a physical body, but the essence of our spirit did not change. Because He wanted us to learn to understand the difference between good and evil and to learn to trust in Him through faith, He placed a veil of forgetfulness over our memories when we came to earth. After we die, we continue to exist in spirit form until the resurrection when our spirits will re-enter our new immortal bodies. Our spirit is the essence of who we are. It's eternal, whether it is occupying a physical body or not. Someday, our memory of our entire existance will be restored, but for now, we need to learn how to believe without the knowledge of our pre-mortal life.
One thing I've never really gotten about my Baptist upbringing is the idea that we die and are judged when reality is that we all live such different existences. Maybe if I'd been born into a different existence, I might have believed/not believed. Circumstances have so much to do with what you believe. We tend to become the religion our parents were and that's luck of the draw. I don't get being judged on that. Not if you only get one shot but most religions teach there is only one shot.
Most religions have been directed through doctrines and dogma that have nothing to do with the original teachings in the Bible. For example it is more beneficial to read the truth about what the Bible says about death than some Clergyman.
The Bible in fact says at Romans 6:23 - "New International Version"
Quote:
"For the wages sin pays is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord."
This would agree with what was told the first man Adam with regards to disobedience to the command. He was simply told he would die for breaking the command, no mention of going to Hellfire or damnation. This also agrees with the scriptural text mentioned previously at Romans 6:7 - "Holman's Christian Standard Bible"
Quote:
"since a person who has died is freed from sins claims."
Notice that many translations use the english word, free, freed, or justified. The footnote in Holman's uses the term "acquitted". Other translations use this term as well. In a legal case the word "acquitted" means that someone cannot be tried again for the crimes they supposedly did or did'nt do. This also agrees with the meaning given about this very verse in the "Jamieson-Fausset-Brown Bible Commentary"
Quote:
7. For he that is dead-rather, "hath died."
is freed-"hath been set free."
from sin literally, "justified," "acquitted," "got his discharge from sin." As death disolves all claims, so the whole claim od sin, "not only to reign unto death," but to keep it's victims in sinful bondage, has been discharged once for all . . .
So when a person dies, he has already paid the price for sin. In a sense he/she has been given a clean slate. So how can a person be judged in an afterlife with their sinful record of things being wiped clean ??? What basis is there to judge anything ??? Judged on a blank slate of no record ??? It would be impossible to send even the most evil of an individual to such a place as a burning Hellfire. Their death from this life on Earth is adequate. The above true meaning of sins wages being death also harmonizes with the original true meaning of the Hebrew and Greek words of Sheol & Hades as being merely the common grave of mankind and nothing more.
It would be of benefit to separate yourself from such a Clergyman who would diliberately perpetuate such a lie.
I believe that upon death, we are unable to commit sin. We will be judged by what we have done on earth but in heaven, there can be no more sin because you cannot harm a spirit. So, if you are a murderer here on earth, when you get to heaven you would still have the urge but you wouldn't be able to harm anyone because you can't harm a spirit. this earth is not reality whereas heaven is reality. You still have to atone for everything done on earth that was not in harmony with God. Doesn't matter what you believe, it's your actions you will be judged by and you will be your own judge. God has laws and when they are not followed, you "pay to the last farthing" accoring to your deeds and no one is exempt, even those who believe Jesus saved them from their sins.
As to Adam dying, the means he would no longer be able to receive the Gift God gave and he would live as a mortal and be cut off from communication with the spirit world. Death of the body just means shedding the material to become spirit.
In a legal case the word "acquitted" means that someone cannot be tried again for the crimes they supposedly did or did'nt do. This also agrees with the meaning given about this very verse in the ...
Actually, acquitted only means that the person wasn't found guilty. In the U.S., it's the bar against double jeopardy would prevent q retrial in some cases - but not always. For example, an acquittal at a state court wouldn't prevent federal charges for the same actions. In countries that don't have a bar against double jeopardy, an acquitted person can be charged again.
Actually, acquitted only means that the person wasn't found guilty. In the U.S., it's the bar against double jeopardy would prevent q retrial in some cases - but not always. For example, an acquittal at a state court wouldn't prevent federal charges for the same actions. In countries that don't have a bar against double jeopardy, an acquitted person can be charged again.
But the meaning and it's use in the referenced scripture is that of having the record of guilt erased, done with and finished.
However if your belief is that you'll be judged after you die, then by all means feel free to believe in it.
Maybe you're misunderstanding me. On the other hand, maybe I'm misunderstanding you. I'll just try to rephrase what I believe. I believe that all of us lived in Heaven in spirit form (i.e. without physical bodies) before we were born. It was our choice to come to earth and participate in God's Plan for us. At birth our spirits entered into a physical body, but the essence of our spirit did not change. Because He wanted us to learn to understand the difference between good and evil and to learn to trust in Him through faith, He placed a veil of forgetfulness over our memories when we came to earth. After we die, we continue to exist in spirit form until the resurrection when our spirits will re-enter our new immortal bodies. Our spirit is the essence of who we are. It's eternal, whether it is occupying a physical body or not. Someday, our memory of our entire existance will be restored, but for now, we need to learn how to believe without the knowledge of our pre-mortal life.
You still haven't answered the question of why some "remember" past lives (more like invented them in thier imaginations but whatever). Is there a flaw in the veil of forgetfulness so that some remember but others don't?
And, sorry, given how much experience shapes who we are, which we can see first hand in amnesia victims, we aren't who we are without our memories. You are assuming we'd still be who we are without our memories but we know that's not true because we've seen it in amnesia victims. Their personalities don't stay the same. Therefore, I can conclude that if I don't remember a past life, my personality is different because of that lack of memories.
The only value I can see to a past life would be in picking the circumstances of my birth this life (think working off karma). You'd either be working up or down the ladder with each successive life.
Now, I do believe there is a base who we are. Something genetically determined. More of a predisposition than anything else. My older daughter has some of the same quirks her grandfather had even though she hardly knew the man. My younger daughter was born with a personality similar to my sister's. Thinking back to the day they were born, their basic personalities were there. They've been shaped by experience but there is a base personality underneath but that's genetic. You'd need the same genes again (very much family traits here) to duplicate it.
One reason I resist the idea of reincarnation is so much of who we turn out to be is determined by the circumstances of our births and how well our parents raised us. I have no doubt that born into a different family in a different set of circumstances I would not be who I am today. That person doesn't exist because the person typing this does. I think we're born with a genetic predisposition but then experience shapes us. Without memories of those experiences, you lose the shaping.
But the meaning and it's use in the referenced scripture is that of having the record of guilt erased, done with and finished.
However if your belief is that you'll be judged after you die, then by all means feel free to believe in it.
I don't know about any of that. I'm just pointing out that the definition of acquitted doesn't mean there'll be no re-trial.
I don't know about any of that. I'm just pointing out that the definition of acquitted doesn't mean there'll be no re-trial.
It does mean no retrial in this instance. I'm not talking of the civil actions as in the case of O.J., but in the case of criminal, I think everyone understands that law. If you'd like to see some go to Hell after being acquitted of sin, then that is your choice, but that is not what is meant here in this particular scriptural text. I think most get the point about the usage of the English word acquittal here. In most human court cases, even if there were new evidence to come to light, they are not re-tried on any criminal charges for the same item. The acquittal does'nt mean not guilty in this case, it simply means God does'nt re-try them after death and then sentence them to an unbiblical Hell. But again if seeing others suffers makes some feel better, then whatever dude.
Suddenly we are born into this world as a human being, as a baby. As we get older, our consciousness develops more and more. Until one day, we die.
Many people debate what will happen to us after we die. But in order to get a better grasp on that question, we should ask, where were we before we lived?
. "Does God know everything that is going to happen? - Does He have absolute control on the outcome of everything? - If so, how is that fair for us? Where is our free will then?" Answer:
Allah Knows everything that will happen. The first thing that He created was the "pen" and He ordered the pen to write. The pen wrote until it had written everything that would happen. And then Allah began to create the universe. All of this was already known to Him before He created it. He does have absolute and total control at all times. There is nothing that happens except that He is in control of if.
There is a mistake in the question: "Free Will." Allah alone, has Free Will, He Wills whatever He likes and it will always happen as He wills. We have something called, "Free choice." The difference is that what Allah "Wills" always happens and what we choose may or may not happen. We are not being judged on the outcome of things, we are being judged on our choices. This means that at the core of everything will always be our intentions. Whatever we intended, is what we will have the reward for. Each person will be judged according to what Allah gave them to work with, how they used it and what they intended to do with it.
As regards the actual "Judgment Day" - Allah tells us that everything we are doing is being recorded and not a single tiny thing escapes from this record. Even an atom's weight of good will be seen on the Day of Judgment and even a single atom's weight of evil will be seen too.
The one who will bring the evidences against us will be ourselves. Our ears, tongue, eyes and all of our bodies will begin to testify against us in front of Allah on the Day of Judgment. None will be oppressed on that Day, none will be falsely accused.
He could have put everyone in their respective places from the very beginning, but the people would complain as to why they were thrown in Hell without being given a chance. This life is exactly that; a chance to prove to ourselves who we really are and what we would really do if we indeed had a free choice.
Allah Knows everything that will happen, but we don't. That is why the test is fair. Allah
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
