Recent Fatwas (Israel, Jewish, God, Christians)

[elwill]

Originally Posted by Fullback32

I hear what the cartoon is saying, but I would submit that the difference is that women in the West generally have a choice on whether or not they will be exploited. In countries that have strict Islamic law...there is no choice.

and what is the results !
It is quite obvious that where ever there are such -dominated societies, there is always a great deal of illegal sex, boyfriend-girlfriend sexual relationships, bikinis, mini-skirts and other sexually arousing clothes, lust, pornography (on the internet and on TV), homosexuality, sodomy, drugs, alcohol, bastard children (children born out of wedlock), and so on....
if it was okey in your culture and in you religion to be like that , so it's okey
but it dosn't mean that this is best of cultures

we have our own culture , view and religion which make us different , and make us respect a women by veiling them rather than exploitation their bodys in the name of freedom

did your culture really respect the women ? did it secure them ?

Let us begin with rape, when one looks at the statistics of women that are raped in the west one will be disgusted and shocked. In the USA alone which is often highlighted as THE prime example on women's freedom and rights by Christians the state of women raped is one every 2 minutes! Can you believe that? In the USA a lady is sexually assaulted every 2 minutes
Statistics | RAINN | Rape, Abuse and Incest National Network

what about pornography ?
Pornography, porn is one of the largest businesses in the west. Let me ask the western peoples, do you think this sick industry is a form of respect and honor for women? Where men go buy a video to see a lady being naked and fornicating with several men? Is this the respect and honor western speak to us about? Is this the type of freedom western want for our women?!

Well it will never happen, Muslims have honor and respect, we will never want such trash as this in our societies nor will we ever allow it, nor will we ever consider it freedom.

you are free to define the freedom of women as you want , and we are free to find practical defination for the freedom of our women as well

what about the large number of strip clubs in the west?
Is the great respect and honor for women? Where they get up in front of a group of drunk screaming men and take all of their clothes off to be whistled at as if their some toy and animal in a show.

What about the modeling business? Is this the great freedom and respect for women? Where young girls are starving themselves to death to simply stay in shape so they can wear very revealing clothes to please their fashion homosexual designers who produce the clothes. Is this freedom?

What about the advertising business, where women are always used to sell products, they always put a half naked lady beside the product with very sexual flirtations to try and sell the product, is this respect and freedom for women?

What is the most disturbing fact of all is that Muslim women who cover up in the west are abused and attacked, while women who go out and dress half naked are treated properly! So basically in the west to gain respect you have to dress very loosely revealing all to gain the respect of the people, if not then you will be abused, and even physically attacked in some cases.

[sanspeur]

Originally Posted by elwill

and what is the results !
It is quite obvious that where ever there are such -dominated societies, there is always a great deal of illegal sex, boyfriend-girlfriend sexual relationships, bikinis, mini-skirts and other sexually arousing clothes, lust, pornography (on the internet and on TV), homosexuality, sodomy, drugs, alcohol, bastard children (children born out of wedlock), and so on....
if it was okey in your culture and in you religion to be like that , so it's okey
but it dosn't mean that this is best of cultures

You folks are really hung up on sex aren't you? There is nothing illegal or wrong with most of the things you mention...I rather like mini skirts and bikinis, lust is a natural emotion, sex is just fine between consenting adults, either gay or straight....Most of your taboos are straight from the dark ages.

we have our own culture , view and religion which make us different , and make us respect a women by veiling them rather than exploitation their bodys in the name of freedom

You are actually hiding your property I think.

did your culture really respect the women ? did it secure them ?

No women in my culture are not property and are free to dress the way they please and be with who they want.

Let us begin with rape, when one looks at the statistics of women that are raped in the west one will be disgusted and shocked. In the USA alone which is often highlighted as THE prime example on women's freedom and rights by Christians the state of women raped is one every 2 minutes! Can you believe that? In the USA a lady is sexually assaulted every 2 minutes
Statistics | RAINN | Rape, Abuse and Incest National Network

Yes lets talk about rape...In your culture the victim is more often punished than the rapist...Is it any wonder that most women do not report it if they are raped?

what about pornography ?
Pornography, porn is one of the largest businesses in the west. Let me ask the western peoples, do you think this sick industry is a form of respect and honor for women? Where men go buy a video to see a lady being naked and fornicating with several men? Is this the respect and honor western speak to us about? Is this the type of freedom western want for our women?!

Well it will never happen, Muslims have honor and respect, we will never want such trash as this in our societies nor will we ever allow it, nor will we ever consider it freedom.

Do you think Muslims do not watch porn? You are mistaken, as they are huge customers of the porn industry.... According to Google Trends, over all years for which data has been gathered, seven out of the top ten countries searching for the word ’sex’ on the internet are Muslim Countries. In order of viewing, these Muslim countries are : Pakistan, Egypt, Turkey, Algeria, Morocco, Indonesia and Iran.

what about the large number of strip clubs in the west?
Is the great respect and honor for women? Where they get up in front of a group of drunk screaming men and take all of their clothes off to be whistled at as if their some toy.

What about the modeling business? Is this the great freedom and respect for women? Where young girls are starving themselves to death to simply stay in shape so they can wear very revealing clothes to please their fashion homosexual designers who produce the clothes. Is this freedom?

What about the advertising business, where women are always used to sell products, they always put a half naked lady beside the product with very sexual flirtations to try and sell the product, is this respect and freedom for women?

Women are free to choose to do, or not do these things, and yes it is freedom for women...You have a huge problem it seems with the naked female body.

What is the most disturbing fact of all is that Muslim women who cover up in the west are abused and attacked, while women who go out and dress half naked are treated properly! So basically in the west to gain respect you have to dress very loosely revealing all to gain the respect of the people, if not then you will be abused, and even physically attacked in some cases.

I'm not sure this is so, but I do know that women are often attacked by men in some Muslim nations for various reasons, including not being "properly covered" ....Let us imagine a situation where some armed men attacked a group of women to rob and rape them. The women who have witnessed and experienced this crime not only have no right to bear witness, but if they pluck up enough courage to testify, they will be punished with 80 lashes – the punishment for accusation.

Your laws and culture are so dark and primitive, is it any wonder that most of us in the west want nothing to do with Islam?

[elwill]

Originally Posted by sanspeur

You folks are really hung up on sex aren't you? There is nothing illegal or wrong with most of the things you mention...I rather like mini skirts and bikinis, lust is a natural emotion, sex is just fine between consenting adults, either gay or straight....Most of your taboos are straight from the dark ages.

i didn't say about most of things i mentiond to be illegal , i just said illegal sex then mentioned other legal behaviours according to your cultures

No women in my culture are not property and are free to dress the way they please and be with who they want.

i know

Yes lets talk about rape...In your culture the victim is more often punished than the rapist...Is it any wonder that most women do not report it if they are raped?

i'm not talking about punishment of rapist , i'm talking about the consequences of what you consider to be freedom , and show you why such consequences not acceptable in our culture
i'm not against the freedom entirly , i'm against the absolute one , there must be some limits and some restrictions

Do you think Muslims do not watch porn? You are mistaken, as they are huge customers of the porn industry.... According to Google Trends, over all years for which data has been gathered, seven out of the top ten countries searching for the word ’sex’ on the internet are Muslim Countries. In order of viewing, these Muslim countries are : Pakistan, Egypt, Turkey, Algeria, Morocco, Indonesia and Iran.

i didn't say that

Women are free to choose to do, or not do these things, and yes it is freedom for women...You have a huge problem it seems with the naked female body.

in your society you have no right to suicide , if the police knew that you wanna to kill yourself , they will do the best they can to not allow that to happen , right ?
why you havn't freedom to suicide ?

anyway , i believe that women have the freedom to do what they want , but not always
for example she don't have the freedom to cheat her husband with another man , right ?

anyway , what i'm trying to say is that we take under consideration the consequences of existing these behaviours openly and legally within the society , these consequences will inluence and effect and harm the society as whole ( we don't see the consequencies as an individual problems ) so that we prevent it or decreasing it with some restrictions from the beginning

i think that males either can say " we have the freedom to see women naked in our street "
you see , the restrictions against male and female alike

I'm not sure this is so, but I do know that women are often attacked by men in some Muslim nations for various reasons, including not being "properly covered" ....Let us imagine a situation where some armed men attacked a group of women to rob and rape them. The women who have witnessed and experienced this crime not only have no right to bear witness, but if they pluck up enough courage to testify, they will be punished with 80 lashes – the punishment for accusation.

well , i will not argue the wrong information you have about laws of islam , but if you wanna to make comparisons so give me statistics

Your laws and culture are so dark and primitive, is it any wonder that most of us in the west want nothing to do with Islam?

okey

[Jazzymom]

Originally Posted by cncracer

Looking at history I would say the christians also kill you for your disbelief.

yup!

[Fullback32]

Originally Posted by elwill

and what is the results !
It is quite obvious that where ever there are such -dominated societies, there is always a great deal of illegal sex, boyfriend-girlfriend sexual relationships, bikinis, mini-skirts and other sexually arousing clothes, lust, pornography (on the internet and on TV), homosexuality, sodomy, drugs, alcohol, bastard children (children born out of wedlock), and so on....
if it was okey in your culture and in you religion to be like that , so it's okey
but it dosn't mean that this is best of cultures

Maybe not, but I will take freedom and everything that goes along with it (good or bad) any day over tyranny in any form (secular or religious).

Originally Posted by elwill

we have our own culture , view and religion which make us different , and make us respect a women by veiling them rather than exploitation their bodys in the name of freedom

did your culture really respect the women ? did it secure them ?

First, know that (a) I am an American Indian of the Comanche Nation and (b) I am not a Christian. Now, with that out of the way, it will be easier to answer your question.

You better believe that Comanche men respect the women of our tribe, both traditionally and today (and this is true for most native nations in the US). Without the women, our culture would not survive. The women make everything work and without them we would be nothing.

As to securing the women...haha...that is a funny question to me. Comanche women need no "securing". A Comanche woman would cut you from ear to ear and not think twice about it if you get stupid with them. In the old days, the whites would say that is was always better to be fight on the battlefield against Comanche warriors then end up being the captive of the women. Our women, though loving and caring as wives and mothers, can also be the most ferocious force on the planet when need be. Add to that the wisdom of our mothers, grandmas and aunties, our women are highly respected. Because of who they are, a Comanche woman needs no man to tell her what to do and what not to do. A Comanche woman needs no man to "secure" her. The respect the men and women have for each other is mutual.

[elwill]

Originally Posted by Fullback32

Maybe not, but I will take freedom and everything that goes along with it (good or bad) any day over tyranny in any form (secular or religious).

i have to submit that we differe in our thoughts
my only point is that , we think that prohibition of such behaviours will be the best for all in the end
we give most care for the entire society than the individuals

it's not like most of you believe that we make that because we hate them or to treat them as second class

First, know that (a) I am an American Indian of the Comanche Nation and (b) I am not a Christian. Now, with that out of the way, it will be easier to answer your question.

it's great to introduce yourself , and i'm pleased to know you

You better believe that Comanche men respect the women of our tribe, both traditionally and today (and this is true for most native nations in the US). Without the women, our culture would not survive. The women make everything work and without them we would be nothing.

As to securing the women...haha...that is a funny question to me. Comanche women need no "securing". A Comanche woman would cut you from ear to ear and not think twice about it if you get stupid with them. In the old days, the whites would say that is was always better to be fight on the battlefield against Comanche warriors then end up being the captive of the women. Our women, though loving and caring as wives and mothers, can also be the most ferocious force on the planet when need be. Add to that the wisdom of our mothers, grandmas and aunties, our women are highly respected. Because of who they are, a Comanche woman needs no man to tell her what to do and what not to do. A Comanche woman needs no man to "secure" her. The respect the men and women have for each other is mutual.

it's great information
but actually i didn't mean you in personal , nor did i meant christians , i just meant by "you" anyone support the western culture regarding to women

i just defend the thoughts of my culture as you do with your culture ( again i didn't mean you in personal )

[AxisMundi]

Originally Posted by Antlered Chamataka

I may actually agree with you, but this is an interesting yet bizarre perspective. And it "can" be true. Female freedom is just relative.

I'm sorry, AC, there is a world of difference between women who have a chioce whether to be gawked at, and paid handsomly, or women who get stoned to death for things that hardly raises eyebrows in the west.

Culture? Sure, I would love to visit one of the oldest cultures in the world, as soon as the area is SAFE for 50 year old tattooed, earinged men with long hair, and more importantly, safe for my wife!

[AxisMundi]

Originally Posted by Jazzymom

probably so. I think any extremist religious person is capable of killing because they believe they are the only right believers. But at this time in history the Muslim extremists are more noticeable. Christianity had their violent time a few hundred years ago.

Muslim extremists are indeed more noticable, but merely because of a clear reluctance of Christian controlled western media to report on the Christian extremists currently active at this moment.

[Currency Pair Crocodile]

<claps his hands> this is so exciting

Elwill, give'em hell, bro.

[MysticPhD]

The very existence of Fatwas is an abomination of barbaric religious ignorance. It reveals the impotence and absurdity of the so-called God in whose name it is issued. Any God that requires humans to enforce His laws is no God. Anything that is forced or acquired by threat is of no use to God since it has nothing to do with the real motivations and "state of mind" of the person being forced. The man-made interpretations of Yahweh (as described in the OT) and Allah (as described in the Quran) make them out to be egotistical evil monster Gods in the image of man. ONLY Jesus reveals the TRUE Nature of God.