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I don't think it'll ever happen either. It would take some real political leaders to step out and do something like that. Also, most religious groups would be less likely to give up their power now, in order to preserve their definition of marriage.
Thats what they are upset about, not the term marriage, but the power they enjoy because of the term.
Those are some very good points. I have always said the church is more about using the moral to reinforce their power than vice versa. The do of course use their power to reinforce the moral, but more often than not they pick and choose the morals which will work towards the greatest benefit to their power..
That's a good question. As far as I know one is either gay or is not so one could not be recruited into being gay.
That's always been one of the first images in my head when people say that being gay is a choice; that people can be influenced into it through their environment. Every time someone says this I try to picture it from their perspective and I always get an image of a gay recruiter at a mall. He'd have a dark tan, a manicure and some cut off camo shorts and a camo "wife beater" shirt with a little scarf wrapped around their neck. Standing there going "HeEEey wanna do some hot, dirty sinnin' beefcake"...
That seems to be the notions that these people have...
Thanks for your post. You gave an additional dimension to be aware of. I live in "the bible belt" and have been around alot of gays during my life. A lot of the gays I've worked with and known in the community are pretty expressive of their sexuality and life styles and are recruitors for it. I have never been around anyone one has ever bashed them like what you have experienced. I do not feel that you have been fairly treated. Hope it gets better soon.
I live in the Bible Belt as well and have run into and known many gays. Not one has ever recruited anyone nor would they. To suggest this is what gay people do is pretty ignorant.
What did you mean by expressive of their sexuality? Did you mean they acted like they were created by God? Also what is a lifestyle that gays have? Every gay/lesbian person I know has a LIFE, they don't have a lifestyle. A lifestyle is something you choose, like being a cowboy, being gay is not something one chooses ergo it is a LIFE.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lNeE4QEVSw
Portia de Rossi was on The View around the first of the month and prop 8 came up. Portia came across as very passionate that she wanted the term marriage and nothing short of it. The discussion was a brief segment, but I feel Portia's view of the issues was that she felt it is one group trying to tell the others how to live thier lives. If this is what it really all boils down to, I couldn't care less because there are many Gods to many people. No one can make anyone (I guess they can) else worship their God or their God's requirements.
You say you do not want to be intolerant and I respect that, but do you not see that your question itself is of a most intolerant nature? You stated, in a round-a-bout way, that because you believe the term "marriage" to be religious, that gays have no right nor reason to use it- as if it is YOUR term, solely for "hetero" believers. That's silly! Not to mention unfair. Now I would assume that since you posted this topic, that you are not a fan of gay "marriage" so, what difference would it make to you if a gay person could explain to you why the word "marriage" is important to them, or why they "insist" (as you say) on using that as a way to describe their union, be it of a civil nature or a religious one? You know very well it's not about the word- it's about the union itself- that those against gay marriage/union have a problem with. Which I will never understand- I'm still waiting to hear just ONE good reason why gays shouldn't be allowed to marry/join in civil union- whatever. If anyone can give one, please go for it, I'm listening!
Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinkerInTex
An intolerant question? And please no personal attacks please. These forums are for enlightenment.
I did not attack you personally. I pointed out that the query within your post was of an intolerant nature- that isn't a personal attack, just an observation about what you said- I'm sorry if you did not care for my opinion, but I do maintain that it was in fact of an intolerant nature and I explained my reasons for thinking so; the fact that you don't agree is your right to think, but as well it is my right to believe otherwise.
As for when you later mentioned that you have been around gays and that they "recruit"- do you honestly believe that homosexuals think heterosexuals can "become" gay, maybe with some persuasion and guidance? Well, I can tell you that they do not. Period. Although, I should make note of the fact that there are some very disillusioned heterosexuals who actually believe that homosexuality can be "cured"- as if it is a disease or an illness so, for those that are of that mindset then sure, I guess it would stand to reason that they think that heteros might be able to be "converted" as well. But please- ask yourself what it would take for you to suddenly make yourself homosexual. Would that be possible? Of course it wouldn't. You love who you love because that is THE WAY YOU WERE BORN. And gays love who they love because that is how THEY were born. And if you or anyone else believes that simply because they were born different than most people that they shouldn't enjoy the same things in life that others do- marriage being one of them- is a belief that, in my opinion, is not only unreasonable, but as well discriminatory (that is my opinion- not a personal attack on you or anyone else).
I really think we as a society need to get over worrying about who marries who- unless they're your close friends or family, the couple who are getting married, whether straight or gay, are the ONLY ones affected by their union. People I don't know get married every day and not once has my life ever been affected.
Even if the story of Sodom was dealing with homosexuality, what you see there is gang rape, not two loving, consenting adults in a relationship.
This is worth closer notice as it was the words of Jesus.
Ezekial 16:49
King James Bible
Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.
In another verse is abominations mentioned which means idol worship.
There is no mention of homosexuality by Jesus as the sin of Sodom. That was added to translations by the Second Temple of the Jewish Faith beginning in the 2nd-3rd Century and beyond.
Readers often fail to see that God decided to destroy Sodom and 4 other cities before the angels arrived for their wickedness, and for not worshiping Him, or following the Holiness Code in Leviticus.
Oppression of the weak (which could include the gang rape of male strangers to reduce them to the lower status of a woman) is the main sin of Sodom.
Most scholars agree the men of Sodom were wicked heterosexuals or at most bisexual. They had male/male sex in the pagan temples with boy prostitutes.
Regarding the attempted rape of the angels; we can't condemn a sexual orientation exclusively for attempted rape by a few people; straight or gay.
This is one of the most misunderstood stories in the Bible.
The term marriage is a religous term. Marriage is a religous practice belongs to religion.
Please forgive me and pray for me please because I do not won't to be intolerant of anyone, I have no right to be intolerant of others.
I just don't understand why the gay community insist having the term "marriage."
Love thy neighbor, but only if they are a different sex.
Please marriage has been around far longer then Christianity or Islam. But back then it was used as an exchange of property not a union between two people.
I think it's completely wrong to deny two people who love each other the exact same rights as everyone else.
Love thy neighbor, but only if they are a different sex.
Please marriage has been around far longer then Christianity or Islam. But back then it was used as an exchange of property not a union between two people.
I think it's completely wrong to deny two people who love each other the exact same rights as everyone else.
Here's a link which looks at same-sex marriage throughout history:
History of Same-Sex Marriage (http://isocrat.org/history/marriage/gay_marriage_hist.php - broken link)
And a report which details the cost of marriage inequality to children and their same sex parents and has some interesting stats on demographics: http://www.hrc.org/documents/costkids.pdf
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