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Old 12-06-2009, 01:36 AM
 
125 posts, read 301,902 times
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Polygamist you guys are discriminated against worse than anything for your belief though you are found in the old testament.
You guys are made out to be some of the worse freaks though you just plainly do out in the open (and I feel you desire to do it legally if the land would let you) what so many others do in hiding.
I look forward to the day that you too will be able to practice your beliefs legally, open and without scorn, just as the gay community wishes to do so with thier beliefs.
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Old 12-06-2009, 04:04 AM
 
Location: S. Wales.
50,088 posts, read 20,738,332 times
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This really adresses the implications of discrimination. I remember a habitual late-comer complained that he was discriminated against because the boss kept telling him to come on time but nobody else.

That's an obvious example. But criminals could equally complain they are discriminated against because the law doesn't go after the non-criminals anything like as much.

So it doesn't come down to discrimination per se as some discrimination is actually neccessary and laudable. Lack of discrimination becomes open to criticism because it fails to distinguish between those who really need to be pulled in and those who don't.

So where's the line to be drawn and what are the parameters for what is fair and reasonable discrimination and what isn't?

Is it just what the law says? But the law has discriminated unfairly and has needed to be changed. Gays, women and racial minorities are obvious examples.

Should people be allowed to practice pologamy, or for that matter, polyandry? If the law says 'no', is the law being unreasonable and should it be changed?

And so, here we are back at 'what touchstone do we use as an arbiter of what is right or wrong, or acceptable and unacceptable?' In the deserved absence of any supposed God - given moral absolutes found in the man -made Holy Books, the Golden Rule comes up again and again as the best that human preference can come up with.

'Don't do to others what you don't want done to you'. And the Hippy - era amendment that I call the 'Platinum Rule': 'Do your own thing so long as it isn't mucking up anyone else's thing'.

Tolerance (in the absence of actual approval) is the key. If there is a fellow who has a load of wives and they are happy with it, I don't see that it's for me to moan about it. Of course, if the wives are NOT happy about it, the man has no business to tell them they have to put up with it - No. No matter what his Holy book says about female subordination.

Similarly, if a woman has several husbands, and they are all content with the arrangement, I for one am not going to shove any book at them and tell them it says on page 3,058 that they have to live differently.

And if a bunch of fellows and dames all want to share a street of houses and swap spouses once a week, I don't see why they shouldn't, so long as they don't do it in the street and scare the horses; and I'd be inclined to tell the law, if it saw fit to stick its nose in, to go trundle its hoop or do something useful like getting an Ex to pay up their back - alimony.

And if anyone rolled up to denounce them from their well -thumbed scriptures, I would like to stand by the garden gate and see the fellow go sailing by at head - height en route for the gutter.

Last edited by TRANSPONDER; 12-06-2009 at 04:11 AM.. Reason: O my typing...and my gramma.
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Old 12-07-2009, 05:05 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
37,470 posts, read 61,415,702 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinkerInTex View Post
Polygamist you guys are discriminated against worse than anything for your belief though you are found in the old testament. ...
The most popular form of household in the OT; on occasion commanded by God; never forbidden in the OT or NT; ....

Yet in the NT there is one usage of a phrase "A widow indeed" which is seen to rather imply that it is better for a young widow to join into another household, rather than to be supported by the church.

Many of Biblical passages do describe such a household. For example, the older wives teaching the young girls, certainly implies that the household has both older and younger wives.

However our culture today appears to forbid 'getting married' to multiple wives.

Pity the Arab who immigrates to the US, and who has not violated any US laws by bringing his pre-existing wives with him.

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Old 12-07-2009, 05:37 PM
 
Location: Nashville, Tn
7,915 posts, read 18,627,765 times
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The concept of polygamy has always been offensive to me because it assumes that women are inferior to begin with and maybe it takes a collection of them to equal one man. I think this is ignorance. It also leads the children of polygamists into the lifestyle and you find fifty or sixty year old men marrying teenagers. It's very well documented that this has happened in the United States. I honestly couldn't care less what the Bible has to say on the subject because they have already revealed that they consider the male so be superior for reasons that are never explained.
Women have proven themselves to be just as intelligent as men (as though that would be a hard thing to do!) and I must say that if this planet had been ruled by women for the last several thousand years I think it's very likely that we'd had fever wars, mass killings, and irrational cruel acts. Sorry, I'm just sick.
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Old 12-07-2009, 06:05 PM
 
Location: Tulsa
2,529 posts, read 4,352,589 times
Reputation: 553
I'm really not so much against polygamy. I think I've mentioned before that I would love to have a few husbands take care of me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
Yet in the NT there is one usage of a phrase "A widow indeed" which is seen to rather imply that it is better for a young widow to join into another household, rather than to be supported by the church.

Many of Biblical passages do describe such a household. For example, the older wives teaching the young girls, certainly implies that the household has both older and younger wives.
It amazes me how one day I can completely agree with you, and another be blown away by how you interpret something...haha.

When Timothy is talking about a widow indeed, he does say we should take care of widows so the church doesn't have to, but he says if any man OR woman have widows...so I don't see how you imply this means a widow should marry a man that is already married.

As for the older women teaching the younger, again, I see no implication that the women must live together or be married to the same man in order for the older to teach the younger. In fact, Titus says the older are to teach the younger to be obedient to their OWN husbands.

So... while I don't know that I think polygamy is sinful, I don't see your reasoning of these scriptures. Tell the truth FB, do you have multiple wives? I was married to a Maniac for 18 years, I know how ya'll are up there! Haha... just kidding!!
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Old 12-07-2009, 06:24 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
37,470 posts, read 61,415,702 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mzjamiedawn View Post
...
It amazes me how one day I can completely agree with you, and another be blown away by how you interpret something...haha.
I love you too.



Quote:
... When Timothy is talking about a widow indeed, he does say we should take care of widows so the church doesn't have to, but he says if any man OR woman have widows ... so I don't see how you imply this means a widow should marry a man that is already married.

As for the older women teaching the younger, again, I see no implication that the women must live together or be married to the same man in order for the older to teach the younger. In fact, Titus says the older are to teach the younger to be obedient to their OWN husbands.

So ... while I don't know that I think polygamy is sinful, I don't see your reasoning of these scriptures. Tell the truth FB, do you have multiple wives? I was married to a Maniac for 18 years, I know how ya'll are up there! Haha ... just kidding!!
I do not currently practice polygamy.

As a student of the Bible, I see nothing wrong with polygamy.

I do know polygamists. I have known polygamists for many years.

Bless you.
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Old 12-07-2009, 06:31 PM
 
Location: Boise
2,008 posts, read 3,327,851 times
Reputation: 735
Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinkerInTex View Post
Polygamist you guys are discriminated against worse than anything for your belief though you are found in the old testament.
You guys are made out to be some of the worse freaks though you just plainly do out in the open (and I feel you desire to do it legally if the land would let you) what so many others do in hiding.
I look forward to the day that you too will be able to practice your beliefs legally, open and without scorn, just as the gay community wishes to do so with thier beliefs.
I would first note that many things are found in the old testament that we don't see as being practical today. So just because something is in the OT doesn't mean it has any place in the 21st century. Also, I find it pretty interesting that when hippies did their free love thing, they caught most of their criticism for this from the church - a little bit of a double standard.

That being said, I actually have no problem with polygamy. Straight up. I don't really care if that's what consenting adults want to do - fine.

I do think that polygamy gets a lot of its bad wrap from cult like groups of weirdo's.

In relation to homosexuals, and especially gay marriage is where I think it gets a little dicey. While there are successful small groups of polygamists, there is no limit as to the number of participants. It is not unheard of for polygamist marriages to include 40+ spouses. Given that those spouses can get married to as many people as they want it can easily deliver a situation where a marriage could consist of a couple hundred people.

I'll be the first to say "if that's what floats your boat...." But in terms of marriage, this is almost nothing like a marriage. It's more like a swingers orgie - which again, I have no problem with.
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Old 12-07-2009, 06:41 PM
 
Location: Tulsa
2,529 posts, read 4,352,589 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
I love you too.

I do not currently practice polygamy.

As a student of the Bible, I see nothing wrong with polygamy.

I do know polygamists. I have known polygamists for many years.

Bless you.
I know ya do...love you too...that's why it's fun to tease you!

Oh... is the keyword "currently"? Haha! I would love to know polygamists. I think it's so interesting to see how they function. I love reading about it. I know, I'm weird.
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Old 12-07-2009, 06:41 PM
 
Location: Nowhere'sville
2,339 posts, read 4,402,828 times
Reputation: 714
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
I love you too.





I do not currently practice polygamy.

As a student of the Bible, I see nothing wrong with polygamy.

I do know polygamists. I have known polygamists for many years.

Bless you.


What is your view on multiple husbands?
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Old 12-07-2009, 07:13 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
37,470 posts, read 61,415,702 times
Reputation: 30424
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaniMae1 View Post
What is your view on multiple husbands?
I have heard of polyandry, but I have never known any. I see no mention of it in the Bible.

In current popular culture, I am aware of one movie which featured it. "Paint your wagon" was a fun movie, I enjoyed it. The only time you get to enjoy Clint Eastwood singing a solo song, "I sing to trees" if I recall correctly, he even cut a record but I think sells were poor.

More females exist than males.

Males die of childhood disease at a higher rate. Males die of 'curiosity' more as pre-teen than females. Males die at a much higher rate once their hormones begin to kick in, then females do. Males historically have tended to hold professions which have killed them [mining, military, industry, etc]. And on the back-side males die younger than females do.

So over-all there are more females than males. At times there have been many more females [mostly after wars].

The Biblical commandment for widows to seek near-kinsmen and to join unto their household. Seems to me to make sense. In terms of stabilizing the society, and always providing for the females.

In that culture, there would rarely be the occurrence of a female by herself. She would always be within a greater household.

In the NT, thought is given to the widows still, and to their needs. Not to old men, just to the ladies.

Males on the other hand are commonly by themselves. Young men often take a long time to settle-down. The thumping chests, competing with others, stupid dares, and risky behavior that does not make for a 'head-of-household'.

I was once in the Plymouth Plantation with my family and I remember being enthralled by a speech that a 'mother' was giving to an audience of girls. She was explaining why girls should always ignore the young men. Young men are full of energy and daring do, but they have no wisdom, they are just as likely to run-off on the next ship in harbor rather than work to support a family. A match-maker would try to match-up each girl with an older men who has settled down, and has built a home, cleared a patch of forest for crops, and was capable to supporting a family.

I have seen examples of polygamy from the Bible, and from among friends. I see how that works for the ladies, and how that works to stabilize society.

I have not seen examples of multiple husbands. So I can not 'see' how that would work, nor the need for such in society.
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