Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Hello, Mullenite. I'm LDS, too, and would like to welcome you to the forum. It's always nice to see a fellow Latter-day Saint. I hope you won't take offense at this suggestion, but you are not going to win any friends by proselytizing on this forum, nor are you going to win any converts. Trust me, it doesn't work that way.
On the other hand, if you're just trying to give people a reason to bash the Church, you've probably already succeeded.
im not getting into any arguments here,your church is your church and i respect whatever beleifs you may have although i might not beleive in them but as an individual looking for a path to God,i respect you.
however ,instead of going through everything you've said there i just want to point out no.11
i dont think God is made of the same material elements as we are-Jesus took on one of these bodys but the Supreme Person is transcendental to these elements ,in other words His body is made of pure spiritual energy,He is not on the material plane of existence even though the material energy is a part of Him, He is still transcendental to material nature and is never affected bye it but is always in control of it,material nature works under His guidance.
Gods body is supreme and their are no limitations to what this Divine body can do-He can see with his ears,smell with His eyes,hear with His nose in other words any sense can be performed with any of His senses-He can also expand His transcendental body in whatever way He wants -He as an innumerable amount of forms and names-all are supreme-His Brahman feature is the effulgence of His body that pervades the entire cosmos,His Paramatma feature is His localized aspect that exists in the hearts of every living entity and also the atom(the kingdom of God is inside you and all around you)and finally His Bhagavan feature is His personality(God Himself)the personification of pure divine love-everything about God is God-His name,His pastimes,His paraphanelia,and His body so IMO i dont think that God has a material Body.
Dear Mullenite,
I don't believe you have any Bible understanding of what the Church founded by Jesus is.
His Church is built upon the foundation of the Apostles and prophets, with Him as the Chief Cornerstone, and His Foundational Apostles are already laid down as the foundation of His Church, and no one can change that foundation: they are the twelve Apostles who were with Jesus for the time of His ministry on earth, and they witnessed His resurrection.
Matthias was elected to replace Judas, for that reason, that He was with Jesus as a called apostle to be His witness and a witness of His resurretion.
Another who was a witness of Jesus' Gospel and resurrection had to be elected to replace Judas, as one of the twelve, because Judas lost his place and got his name blotted out of the book of Life, as the Psalmist prayed he would.
Act 1:20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick let another take. Act 1:21 Wherefore of these men which have companied with us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us, Act 1:22Beginning from the baptism of John, unto that same day that he was taken up from us, must one be ordained to be a witness with us of his resurrection.
There is no other foundation to the Church Jesus founded upon Himself and His twelve Apostles whom He chose, to witness His life and resurrection.
Last edited by yeshuasavedme; 03-29-2010 at 11:32 AM..
And it is in the Bible that the word of God is to be spoken onto all Life!!!!!!!!!!
I'm having trouble understanding some bible passages, maybe you can help me.
Here's one, where Jesus declared:
"And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes". Luke 12:47
Dear Mullenite,
I also do not believe you have any Bible understandiong of what water baptism is, as ordained by Jesus, and what "baptism for the dead...' is, in context.
The dead who submit to water baptism as Jesus commanded are those bodies of the redeemed, whose bodies are dead because of sin, in Adam flesh.
It is the Adam flesh which is dead and which is submitted to water baptism by the soul wearing it who has been cleansed of sin by the blood atonement of Jesus Christ; and they submit the body to water baptism, by faith, in the sign of its sin nature dying in Jesus' death and then the testimony of its hope of the resurrection in His resurrection.
The entire context of 1 Cor 15 is about the born again in Christ believers dead Adam flesh body rising from the dead; and water baptism is the individual acts of living souls, done in faith, in obedience to Christ, submitting the dead body of Adam flesh they wear into "the baptism of righteousness", done in by their faith in "the hope of the Church", which is that the dead Adam flesh each born again in Christ soul continues to wear until the death of it and will receive changed, at the resurrection of it -or translation of it when Christ Jesus comes in the air to meet them- will be transformed and rise from the dead, alive in Christ.
That is also called the adoption of the body, when it is transformed to the image of the New Man, and which is the time it is made alive. "The body is dead because of sin", and it is the dead Adam flesh body which is submitted to water baptism, by the soul wearing it, by their freewill, only, as a sign of the resurrection hope of its rising in Christ's image!
The [Adam flesh] body is dead because of sin and must needs be made alive/resurrected and or translated at the rapture, for the completion of the salvation of the "whole body, soul, and spirit's perfection". of each human being, born again in Christ.
In Adam all die, and in Christ [those who are born again in Spirit are in Christ] all are made alive -"whosoever will", can be made alive in Christ and their body will be changed to the glorious new man body and will rise from the dead in that image of the Living Son of God. Rom 8:10And if Christ [be] in you, the body [is] dead because of sin; but the Spirit [is] life because of righteousness.
The born again in Christ are alive in spirit, and the Adam flesh is dead in spirit, and we must wear the nature of the Adam flesh until the resurrection and/or rapture/transformation of it.
Water Baptism is for our own dead Adam flesh, which we, alone, can submit to obedience of Christ in water baptism for the hope of the resurrection in transformation of it to the living body of flesh made in the image of Christ's New Man body of flesh of new, human being, creation.
Rom 7:24,25 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death? -I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead [bodies]? But if there be no resurrection of the dead [bodies], then is Christ not risen: And if Christ be not risen, then [is] our preaching vain, and your faith [is] also vain. Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead [bodies] rise not. For if the dead [bodies] rise not, then is not Christ raised: And if Christ be not raised, your faith [is] vain; ye are yet in your sins
Then they also which are fallen asleep [departed the dead Adam flesh body] in Christ are perished. If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.
But now is Christ risen from the dead, [and] become the firstfruits of them that slept.
For since by man [came] death, by man [came] also the resurrection of the dead.
For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
22Then [cometh] the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
The last enemy [that] shall be destroyed [is] death.
For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under [him, it is] manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead [body], if the dead [body] rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead [body]?
And why stand we in jeopardy every hour?
I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die ...
But some [man] will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?
[Thou] fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:
And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other [grain]:
But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.
All flesh [is] not the same flesh: but [there is] one [kind of] flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, [and] another of birds.
[There are] also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial [is] one, and the [glory] of the terrestrial [is] another.
[There is] one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for [one] star differeth from [another] star in glory.
So also [is] the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
...
In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal [must] put on immortality.
So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
O death, where [is] thy sting? O grave, where [is] thy victory?
The sting of death [is] sin; and the strength of sin [is] the law.
But thanks [be] to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.
im not getting into any arguments here,your church is your church and i respect whatever beleifs you may have although i might not beleive in them but as an individual looking for a path to God,i respect you.
however ,instead of going through everything you've said there i just want to point out no.11
i dont think God is made of the same material elements as we are-Jesus took on one of these bodys but the Supreme Person is transcendental to these elements ,in other words His body is made of pure spiritual energy,He is not on the material plane of existence even though the material energy is a part of Him, He is still transcendental to material nature and is never affected bye it but is always in control of it,material nature works under His guidance.
Gods body is supreme and their are no limitations to what this Divine body can do-He can see with his ears,smell with His eyes,hear with His nose in other words any sense can be performed with any of His senses-He can also expand His transcendental body in whatever way He wants -He as an innumerable amount of forms and names-all are supreme-His Brahman feature is the effulgence of His body that pervades the entire cosmos,His Paramatma feature is His localized aspect that exists in the hearts of every living entity and also the atom(the kingdom of God is inside you and all around you)and finally His Bhagavan feature is His personality(God Himself)the personification of pure divine love-everything about God is God-His name,His pastimes,His paraphanelia,and His body so IMO i dont think that God has a material Body.
11. The true church must teach that God and Jesus have bodies of flesh and bone (Luke 24:36-39; Acts 1:9-11; Hebrews 1:1-3)
Latter-day Saints are sometimes accused of having an antibiblical theology because they believe that God is a glorified being of flesh and bones—not just a spirit essence. Some who write anti-Mormon pamphlets insist that the LDS concept of Deity is contrary to what is recognized as traditional Christian doctrine. In this they are quite correct. The traditional view about the Trinity is well over a thousand years old, and time has a way of hallowing ideas, whether or not they are true.
One of the most demonstrable truths from the Bible is the physical, bodily resurrection of Jesus Christ. When Jesus came forth from the tomb, he showed himself to his Apostles. Even they thought him to be a spirit, but he said: “Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.”
Then he showed them his hands and feet, and when they were still skeptical, he asked for meat and honeycomb and ate before them. (Luke 24:36–43.) Then they saw he was no apparition.
Thomas was not present at the first appearance to the Twelve, so he remained skeptical. He told the others: “Except I shall see in his hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into his side, I will not believe.” (John 20:24–25.)
One week later, Jesus again appeared to the disciples. This time, Thomas was among them. The Lord greeted them, then spoke to Thomas: “Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.”
Thomas could only exclaim, “My Lord and my God.” (John 20:26–28.) That day he became a special witness of the Lord’s literal resurrection.
After Jesus was resurrected, more than five hundred also saw him and testified of his physical resurrection. (1 Cor. 15:5–8.) The Apostles, too, were witnesses of his ascension into heaven when two angels told them that Jesus would return in like manner as he had ascended. (Acts 1:9–11.)
We also know that at his second coming, Christ will appear with a physical body. John testified that “every eye shall see him.” (Rev. 1:7.) Zechariah prophesied that “his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives” (Zech. 14:4; italics added), and the beleaguered Israelites “shall look upon [him] whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him.” (Zech. 12:10.) And then “one shall say unto him, What are these wounds in thine hands? Then he shall answer, Those with which I was wounded in the house of my friends.” (Zech. 13:6; italics added.)
Dear Mullenite,
I don't believe you have any Bible understanding of what the Church founded by Jesus is.
His Church is built upon the foundation of the Apostles and prophets, with Him as the Chief Cornerstone, and His Foundational Apostles are already laid down as the foundation of His Church, and no one can change that foundation: they are the twelve Apostles who were with Jesus for the time of His ministry on earth, and they witnessed His resurrection.
Matthias was elected to replace Judas, for that reason, that He was with Jesus as a called apostle to be His witness and a witness of His resurretion.
Another who was a witness of Jesus' Gospel and resurrection had to be elected to replace Judas, as one of the twelve, because Judas lost his place and got his name blotted out of the book of Life, as the Psalmist prayed he would.
Act 1:20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick let another take. Act 1:21 Wherefore of these men which have companied with us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us, Act 1:22Beginning from the baptism of John, unto that same day that he was taken up from us, must one be ordained to be a witness with us of his resurrection.
There is no other foundation to the Church Jesus founded upon Himself and His twelve Apostles whom He chose, to witness His life and resurrection.
Church founded by Jesus is.
3. The true church must have a foundation of Apostles and Prophets (Ephesians 2:19-20)
The Lord instituted the process of organizing the Church through the proper application of priesthood keys and by revelation. Alternatives to this process are not acceptable to Him.
Paul said regarding the bestowal of priesthood authority, “No man taketh this honour unto himself, but he that is called of God, as was Aaron” (Heb. 5:4). Priesthood power is a gift from God for those who spiritually qualify. It is not given upon demand, as Peter’s encounter with the sorcerer Simon illustrates:
And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money,
Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost” (Acts 8:18–19).
Peter rebuked him, saying: Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money.
Thou hast neither part nor lot in this matter: for thy heart is not right in the sight of God (Acts 8:20–21).
One cannot buy priesthood power or obtain it for selfish reasons. It must be bestowed by those with authority. Similarly, specific callings within the Church are extended by those in authority exercising their priesthood keys under the influence of the Holy Spirit. Without this foundation principle in place, the Church could be established differently throughout the world, depending on individual personalities and local customs.
When Paul instructed Timothy, he said, Lay hands suddenly on no man (1 Tim. 5:22). He knew that prayer, pondering, and inspiration must precede the giving of callings.
Paul described the foundation upon which the Church of Jesus Christ stands: Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
“And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone” (Eph. 2:19–20).
Peter exhorted the Saints to “be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, warning that in the last days many would turn away from them: There shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts (2 Pet. 3:2–3).
Prophets reveal the mind and will of the Lord to us so that we do not have to be carried about with every wind of doctrine (Eph. 4:14). Paul taught that if we keep ourselves worthy and protect the purity of this revealed doctrine, great blessings will come: Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee (1 Tim. 4:16).
In 1 Corinthians chapter 12, the Apostle Paul emphasizes that every member is needed to help successfully establish the Church:
For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. …
For the body is not one member, but many. …
And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you. …
Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.
And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues” (1 Cor. 12:12, 14, 21, 27–28). Paul tells us in 1 Corinthians 3:9 [1 Cor. 3:9], For we are labourers together with God: ye are God’s husbandry, ye are God’s building.” Similarly, Peter taught, “Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house … to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ” (1 Pet. 2:5). In the words of a great modern prophet, Brigham Young (1801–77), “When we conclude to make a Zion we will make it, and this work commences in the heart of each person.”
Hey not all of us are going to pick on you OP. I have allways belived that Christ appeared other places than the Mid east. God and Christ can move in and out the world with great ease, not because of them having different bodies(though I am sure they are perfect ) but becuse of being Christ and God they can navigate from our plane to their plane. Oh well now I sound like a nut maybe I will get picked on a bit. Blessings Michelle
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
