Being charged for prior tenant damage (apartment complex, lease agreement, eviction, deposits)

[JD316632]

To give a brief back story when I moved into my prior apartment no cleaning had been performed outside of the carpets, kitchen was a mess (still had items in the freezer and dishwasher) carpet had stains on it, closet door had a huge crack in it. I noted all of this in my inspection checklist and turned it in. They gave me $200 off the first months rent to compensate for me having to clean before moving my stuff in (this should have been a warning as to what was to come but I was naive as this was my first apartment). Upon moving out I spent the last week once everything was out of the apartment cleaning EVERYTHING. Carpets, windows, floors, etc.

I called the apartment twice since move out, November and December to inquire about my deposit ($99). I was told both times they would get back to me. Now this morning I receive a phone call from a collection agency stating that not only do I owe $171 but if I don't start making payments it will affect my credit. The collection agency has no details as to why the amount is owed, just that it is. So I call the apartment complex and I'm told the following:

1. General cleaning
2. Vertical blinds
3. Oven Trays

Those 3 items came to $270 minus my $99 deposit, I owe $171. I ask them to pull out my inspection sheet where I noted the apartment had not been cleaned, the blinds in the first bedroom were bent back and in the living room there were 2 missing from the vertical blinds. They do not have my inspection sheet. I know I should have been smarter and taken pictures, made copies etc. I'm being wrongfully charged, at this point I'm willing to take the loss of the deposit just to put this behind me. What can I do?

[Lacerta]

There were so many mistakes made here on both sides that it is scary.

Your mistakes:
1. You should have insisted the place was move in ready before moving in
2. You should have taken photos of anything that was not.
3. You should have made them sign that they received your conditions sheet, AND kept a copy for yourself, with their signatures.
4. Not having a walkthrough done at move out
5. Not sending a demand for return of your deposit when it was not forthcoming according to state law (did you give them a forwarding address?)

Their mistakes:
1. Only having a $99 deposit!
2. Not having the place clean and move in ready
3. Not getting the deposit back to you in the required time as per whatever your state law is.
4. Not sending an itemized list of damages to the forwarding address you provided
5. Losing your inspection sheet (giving you the benefit of the doubt that you did, in fact, actually turn it in. In my experience, more than 75% of tenants forget to return it to the office)
6. Apparantly not doing a walkthrough with the last tenant so those things could be charged to them.
7. Turning this over to a collection agency with no attempt to notify you first.

There are likely more that I didn't think of on both sides.

You COULD go to small claims and fight this, but it probably isn't worth your time for that amount of money. And without a copy of your move in sheet, or any photos, you very likely would lose, and then be out the court costs also.

I would just call it a life lesson, pay it and move on with life.

[bentlebee]

A clear sample of a tenant who tried to do the right thing but didn't do everything right....if your story is right (there are always 2 sides to each story)

You should have made and kept a copy of the move in sheet that also should have been signed by the other party. You should have made pictures on move in and move out and have the date on it.

Certified letter of your claim and the property management also should have sent you a certified letter with specifications.

If they haven't sent you one that they can proof of, than you can go to court since the timeframe has passed to give you the sec. dep. statement and what they want to deduct.

If you never received a certified letter I would go to court and file a small claims case because you get your court costs back and you can tell the judge to have them restore your credit score/history and/or get the collecting agency off your back.

[Jillaceae]

Originally Posted by JD316632

Those 3 items came to $270 minus my $99 deposit, I owe $171. I ask them to pull out my inspection sheet where I noted the apartment had not been cleaned, the blinds in the first bedroom were bent back and in the living room there were 2 missing from the vertical blinds. They do not have my inspection sheet. I know I should have been smarter and taken pictures, made copies etc. I'm being wrongfully charged, at this point I'm willing to take the loss of the deposit just to put this behind me. What can I do?

The exact same thing happened to me in college! Our apartment had some pretty bad pre-existing issues, like the last person to paint (which was 3 years before we even moved in) didn't tape, so the dark wood molding was absolutely covered with paint (on the side of the bathroom vanity there was actually a hand mark where someone wiped the paint off their hand onto the wood), and the place just wasn't clean. I was pissed off and very detailed on my move in inspection report, and we did a lot of work cleaning the place up. So we move out, hear nothing and then suddenly are getting threatening calls from a collection agency and finally a lawyer. They were charging us over $1000 for pre-existing damage we had allegedly caused (including getting paint on the wood trim, most of which we had actually removed because it was so ugly, and the rest of which I highly doubt they actually removed.) According to the lawyer, we were "really in bad shape because we never did our move in inspection." I was so mad!

The funny thing was the things they were charging us for weren't even legal charges in Oregon for a unit that has been occupied for over a year. The lawyer told us they were going to take us to court and we said "Go for it. According to state law and your lease agreement you actually owe us $350. We'd be more than happy to see you in court." We never heard from them again.

But it was very stressful. Especially the threatening calls. Follow bentlebee's advice. I wish I had someone like bentlebee at the time! The nice thing about this experience, in the end, is it is a good learning experience. I learned a lot about taking pictures and making copies of things that year!

[manderly6]

I would probably at the least remind them of the fact that they failed to notify you about the charges in and therefore have no claim on them at this point. Tell them you will fight this in small claims court and see what their response is. Maybe you get lucky and they will make it go away. If not, then you need to decide if it is worth fighting or not.

[jamies]

As a landlord. One who tries to be a GOOD landlord, for good tenants. This is my policy:

1) Our units are completely "freshened" or renovated before occupancy. At the minimum a complete cleaning to spotless condition. Paint touched up or repainted. Carpets/flooring clean and in good condition or replaced. Appliances spotless or replaced. Drains cleared. Everything in tip top shape. Our company motto is "to provide a nice home for nice people."

2) Upon move in we fill out a three page checklist that covers everything. Most items are "A or B" condition. We note any deficiencies or issues waiting for resolution (parts or something). Included is a list of estimated repair and cleaning costs.

Note to tenants - it costs a LOT more than you might think to fix and clean things. We charge $70 to clean a stove and oven - it can take 2-3 hours on hands and knees and we have to pay help to clean it. To replace an interior door costs $275 min. To have carpet cleaned in a 2 bedroom with heavy stains is easily $200. So please take care of your units!

3) We video tape the premises, with the tenant there. We use video because it's easy to show in court or send to the judge's and opposing counsel's laptops. If tenant wants a record they can take their own photos at that time. A copy of the tape is potentially supeonable if a court case ever develops.

4) Tenant gets a copy of the Move in forms after both parties sign.

Move-out
15 days prior to end of lease we provide a 4 page "cleaning check list" and offer to do a "pre-inspection" walk through to note any deficencies for the tenant.

At that point how they leave the unit is up to them. If they want the deposit back the unit needs to be spotless. Wear and tear is not old food in the corners of the stove, drawers or floor, or cobwebs clogging the refrigerator coils. It's not mold in the bathtub or toilet because you didn't clean it during the year term of your lease. It's not broken blinds and dents in the door from when your roomate came home drunk and kicked it.

Very seldom do I find tenants who we don't have to have 2-3 people spend 2-3 days cleaning up after. And that is why tenants often don't get their deposits back from landlords. We aren't trying to make money off the deposit. We are trying not to go broke from the costs involved in cleaning up after messy uncaring people.

After the tenant vacates we do a final inspection using the original check list and make a new video tape. Then make repairs or cleaning. Within the legal time limit (In some of our states it's 14 days, other is 21) we issue a check or a deficency payment request. If there are substantial damages such as from an eviction our attorney will file a lawsuit, usually in Superior Court.

[tilli]

If they can't find your move-in inspection sheet there is no way that they can prove that you caused the damage rather than a previous tenant. Check your state's laws. You usually have a small window of time to dispute charges against your deposit and you have to follow the procedure outlined in the laws.

[bentlebee]

Usually you have to dispute it within 15 days of their certified letter...BUT if they didn't send you anything than the OP should go to court.

[nikidijawen]

Originally Posted by Lacerta

There were so many mistakes made here on both sides that it is scary.

Your mistakes:
1. You should have insisted the place was move in ready before moving in
2. You should have taken photos of anything that was not.
3. You should have made them sign that they received your conditions sheet, AND kept a copy for yourself, with their signatures.
4. Not having a walkthrough done at move out
5. Not sending a demand for return of your deposit when it was not forthcoming according to state law (did you give them a forwarding address?)

Their mistakes:
1. Only having a $99 deposit!
2. Not having the place clean and move in ready
3. Not getting the deposit back to you in the required time as per whatever your state law is.
4. Not sending an itemized list of damages to the forwarding address you provided
5. Losing your inspection sheet (giving you the benefit of the doubt that you did, in fact, actually turn it in. In my experience, more than 75% of tenants forget to return it to the office)
6. Apparantly not doing a walkthrough with the last tenant so those things could be charged to them.
7. Turning this over to a collection agency with no attempt to notify you first.

There are likely more that I didn't think of on both sides.

You COULD go to small claims and fight this, but it probably isn't worth your time for that amount of money. And without a copy of your move in sheet, or any photos, you very likely would lose, and then be out the court costs also.

I would just call it a life lesson, pay it and move on with life.

I have had the same, I'm even worse for I had not filled out a form about the mess, because the first management helped me with my deposit, they had allowed me to pay it off in two months ($1000. for the first apartment a one bedroom) the tenants in a two bedroom liked to party a lot, they left their about a mess, about a year later I moved into that apartment, the management did not clean everything. Then the management was sold to a new management and I told them about the dirty parts of the apartment this was about 2-3 months after already living their, I was hoping that they would go to my apartment and clean it and fix the heater and other things I was just told to fill out that form. Now 2011 (I moved into that two bedroom in 2009) they tell me that If I don't fill out a form 10 days after moving into that apartment I can be accountable for the damages anyway, so they have taken $1000. from my deposit (I have been in this building since 2008, first a 1br, then the 2br, and now back to a 1br.,) and now I owe another deposit for this one bedroom that I have moved into in May 2011. I don't think I have to much of a chance since I have not filled out a form, I have pictures of this apartment (the one I just moved into) that shows that the management have not cleaned very well, the kitchen floor looks like people have caused burn marks and some of the kitchen counters are not new, and I even have a picture and the old apartments front door that is still not fix, so if someone moves in they could be accountable for that damage (they have said that I have caused that, its the out side, two other tenants have used my parking space, one tenant told me they where using my parking space to fix their car), basically each apartment is different, some are more clean then others.

[Vickie Asher]

Tenant has made damage to property, turned off electricy, turned off water & garbage before their''
due date is for leaving, do I give them a notice to vacate premise even though they have 2 weeks
rent left? Its obvious there are not going to fix broken window.