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I think your LL took too long. I don't think you should pay it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by neguy99
There is an interesting question here:
Scenario: A LL receives a check before the due date. But the LL believes something about the check is incorrect, making it, in the LL's mind, invalid. However, the error is NOT something that would usually stop a bank from honoring it, let's say A) the tenant wrote "groceries" in the memo field (bank doesn't care). Or B) the LL thinks the handwriting is not legible enough. Or C) date is incorrect. LL makes no attempt to see if the bank will actually honor it. LL does not tell tenant he deemed the check unacceptable until after the due date.
SHould the tenant owe a late fee in all these scenarios? None of them? Some?
Since the LL didn't make an attempt to see if the bank will honor it, then I don't think the tenant should have to pay the late fee.
Why does the LL care if the tenant wrote the wrong date, doesn't think the handwriting is legible enough, or the date is incorrect? If the check goes through, the LL gets his money (which is his ultimate goal).
Scenario: A LL receives a check before the due date. But the LL believes something about the check is incorrect, making it, in the LL's mind, invalid. However, the error is NOT something that would usually stop a bank from honoring it, let's say A) the tenant wrote "groceries" in the memo field (bank doesn't care). Or B) the LL thinks the handwriting is not legible enough. Or C) date is incorrect. LL makes no attempt to see if the bank will actually honor it. LL does not tell tenant he deemed the check unacceptable until after the due date.
SHould the tenant owe a late fee in all these scenarios? None of them? Some?
For both A & B, LL is in the wrong; those situations are not material to any issues with cashing the check. As for C, it is not incumbent upon the LL to assume what the tenant meant when they placed the incorrect date on the check; it is the tenant's responsibility to get the correct rent payment to the LL. Could a LL investigate further with the tenant to ensure everything is kosher with the check? Sure. But they're under no requirement to do so
I think your LL took too long. I don't think you should pay it.
Since the LL didn't make an attempt to see if the bank will honor it, then I don't think the tenant should have to pay the late fee.
Why does the LL care if the tenant wrote the wrong date, doesn't think the handwriting is legible enough, or the date is incorrect? If the check goes through, the LL gets his money (which is his ultimate goal).
LL isn't required to attempt to cash the check within a timeline for the convenience of the tenant to ensure they don't possibly pay a late fee. It's the tenant's responsibility to ensure payment is on time, end of story.
Should the LL constantly harangue a tenant to ensure payment is made on time? Would tenants like it if a LL was constantly calling them for the rent after the 1st, all in the guise of trying to not have them pay late?
And yes, a LL should care whether the date on a check is correct or not. If you paid May's rent with a check dated for June, what is to prevent you from claiming June's rent has already been paid when June rolls around? Now LL could be locked in a protracted struggle to capture past rent rightfully owed; it's just a whole can of worms that doesn't need to be opened.
LL isn't required to attempt to cash the check within a timeline for the convenience of the tenant to ensure they don't possibly pay a late fee. It's the tenant's responsibility to ensure payment is on time, end of story.
Should the LL constantly harangue a tenant to ensure payment is made on time? Would tenants like it if a LL was constantly calling them for the rent after the 1st, all in the guise of trying to not have them pay late?
And yes, a LL should care whether the date on a check is correct or not. If you paid May's rent with a check dated for June, what is to prevent you from claiming June's rent has already been paid when June rolls around? Now LL could be locked in a protracted struggle to capture past rent rightfully owed; it's just a whole can of worms that doesn't need to be opened.
I like your thinking.
To the OP, this is a classic case of your mistake upon another mistake equalling even more mistakes.
1. You submitted a check and envelope that had the wrong rental period. Had it just been the check, the LL probably would have not even noticed the error, but by also indicating the worng month on the outer envelope, you were instructing the landlord that the check was for that other month, not the current month.
2. You notified the landlrod that same day that it was for the current rent due. Assuming you have proof they got the email and it was a business day for them, you took the appriopriate action to have that check credited for the current month.
3. The landlord is under NO obligation to cash the check as soon as they receive it and can cash them all the last day of the month as far as they are concerned. None of your business. All your are responsible for it to ensure you tendered a legal instrument on the due date. Even with the error of the envelope and check memo, you corrected that by the due date.
4. However, when the landlord did process the check (assuming there didn't notice it before) they dissallowed the check because the date was post adted. A landlord is not required to attempt to cash a post dated check just like a bank is not required to cash it. Unless they have a reason to be concerned, they are encouraged to submit the check for processing, but they are absolutely not required to do so.
So, the real issue is, you will most likely prevail on the issue of the check being valid and legal not because of some regulation, but because its more of a brain fart moment that a judge will most likley just brush away. However, you could end up holfing the bag if after being told of the date issue, you didn't jump to make it right as soon as you could. I have no idea which way a judge would rule, but it's not the fight you want to fight especially if more legal troubles are just hiding behind the next issue.
I still am wondering about my question in the past have you paid rent late? Other then the sublet issue have you had problems such as other neighbors complaining?
I just feel and I could be wrong but there has been other issues that now the LL does not know what is the truth and what is not. Especially since this sounds like an individual and not a huge corporate company I would think he would not want to create bad feelings over a mistake to charge you.
It's $30 or so; is it really worth fighting a protracted battle that would cost more in court filing fees than the cost of the late fee? Especially when considering OP still has an upcoming battle over the renewal or being let out of her lease. Why antagonize a LL in that situation over such a miniscule amount of money compared to what she's trying not to owe?
Which is exactly what I said.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabrrita
However, you could end up holfing the bag if after being told of the date issue, you didn't jump to make it right as soon as you could.
The OP said, "On April 7th I received an email stating that the check had been dated 5/1/2014 and that I should submit a new check. I did so immediately." "Immediately" isn't fast enough?
LL isn't required to attempt to cash the check within a timeline for the convenience of the tenant to ensure they don't possibly pay a late fee. It's the tenant's responsibility to ensure payment is on time, end of story.
Should the LL constantly harangue a tenant to ensure payment is made on time? Would tenants like it if a LL was constantly calling them for the rent after the 1st, all in the guise of trying to not have them pay late?
And yes, a LL should care whether the date on a check is correct or not. If you paid May's rent with a check dated for June, what is to prevent you from claiming June's rent has already been paid when June rolls around? Now LL could be locked in a protracted struggle to capture past rent rightfully owed; it's just a whole can of worms that doesn't need to be opened.
I know that the LL isn't required to attempt to cash the check, but like I said, I personally think he took too long. What's he waiting for?
I know that the LL isn't required to attempt to cash the check, but like I said, I personally think he took too long. What's he waiting for?
It's irrelevant how long a LL takes to cash your rent check. They are not required to cash it as soon as possible for your convenience. Is it a huge pain in the butt? Absolutely; I've had a LL that usually waited until after the 15th to cash rent. Major inconvenience for me because I had to ensure the $$$ were always there in case they decided to cash early (which did happen sometimes). Until and unless residential leases start placing time is of the essence clauses for cashing rent checks, unfortunately there's not much you can do.
As I posted earlier. This is usually not an issue but you and the landlord is not communicating well. How did you leave it with him in the email you sent telling him you mistakenly wrote May on the envelope and check? Did you ask him to go ahead and apply it toward April and confirm that you are good for April? Or was it something like "Hey, mistakenly put May in this month's rent." and nothing else. In the future, when you are communicating with your landlord (by email or text), just confirm things.
Email read as follows:
"I just realized I put "May Rent" on the check. I meant to say April. Sorry if that caused any confusion."
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaniellaG
Have you ever been late on rent before?
no
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaniellaG
How long have you been a tenant?
About 7 months now
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaniellaG
Is this a private landlord or large community?
Private landlord in charge of several properties. I'm unsure how many.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaniellaG
Other then the sublet issue have you had problems such as other neighbors complaining?
No. The only issue I've ever had prior to this is the subject of the other thread that has been linked here.
If I was a landlord and received (on April 1) an envelope marked "May rent" had "May rent" in the check memo and was dated May 1, I might think the tenant was going to be out of town or otherwise incapacitated on May 1 and was giving me the check to hold until then. Of course, if there was no April check, I'd probably follow up to see what was going on with this month's rent.
I think the OP should probably just pay the late fee as a stupid tax, or see if perhaps LL would reduce it by half since both seem to be somewhat at fault.
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