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Old 08-16-2014, 11:26 PM
 
300 posts, read 392,748 times
Reputation: 218

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Quote:
Originally Posted by emm74 View Post
Usary laws apply to borrowed money, not late fees on rent.

And if you are referencing the Carey Vaughn Brown case, that involves payday lenders - borrowed money. Not rentals, not late fees and not applicable to the discussion here.
No. More and more states are considering late fees, re billing fees, what-ever fees which are applied to past due invoices, monthly rents, etc as "a form of interest". If the combination of fees and/or interest exceed the state celling, then it's usury. More the norm than the exception these days. Th latest trend is for state AGs to target the creditor AND the atty who drafted the contract.

Last edited by blu4u; 08-17-2014 at 12:12 AM..
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Old 08-18-2014, 08:23 AM
 
Location: Southern New Hampshire
8,797 posts, read 15,242,125 times
Reputation: 29009
Quote:
Originally Posted by blu4u View Post
No. More and more states are considering late fees, re billing fees, what-ever fees which are applied to past due invoices, monthly rents, etc as "a form of interest". If the combination of fees and/or interest exceed the state celling, then it's usury. More the norm than the exception these days. Th latest trend is for state AGs to target the creditor AND the atty who drafted the contract.
I guess you know more than those who have gone to court and had their leases upheld over and over and over again. They are wrong and you of course are right.

(You sound like a law student who loves to argue with anyone and everyone.)
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Old 08-18-2014, 07:33 PM
 
Location: Tampa (by way of Omaha)
14,247 posts, read 21,010,670 times
Reputation: 9815
Quote:
Originally Posted by karen_in_nh_2012 View Post
I guess you know more than those who have gone to court and had their leases upheld over and over and over again. They are wrong and you of course are right.

(You sound like a law student who loves to argue with anyone and everyone.)
To be fair, these are at the lower court levels where someone who is uninformed can get walked all over. Several years back I had one of the professors in a law class say to me "real law doesn't start until you get to the Circuit Courts".

You'd be surprised at some of the bad case law happening at the lower levels that has to be overturned on appeal.
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Old 08-19-2014, 04:59 AM
 
Location: St Thomas, US Virgin Islands
24,671 posts, read 64,700,490 times
Reputation: 26614
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bosco55David View Post
You'd be surprised at some of the bad case law happening at the lower levels that has to be overturned on appeal.
Why would anyone be "surprised"? It's not confined to the lower levels at all but happens throughout the system at all levels.
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Old 08-19-2014, 10:05 PM
 
300 posts, read 392,748 times
Reputation: 218
Quote:
Originally Posted by karen_in_nh_2012 View Post
I guess you know more than those who have gone to court and had their leases upheld over and over and over again. They are wrong and you of course are right.

(You sound like a law student who loves to argue with anyone and everyone.)
You don't need to be a law student to calculate interest rates. Fifth grade math will do.
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Old 08-20-2014, 05:20 AM
 
8,648 posts, read 16,244,926 times
Reputation: 4602
Quote:
Originally Posted by blu4u View Post
No. More and more states are considering late fees, re billing fees, what-ever fees which are applied to past due invoices, monthly rents, etc as "a form of interest". If the combination of fees and/or interest exceed the state celling, then it's usury. More the norm than the exception these days. Th latest trend is for state AGs to target the creditor AND the atty who drafted the contract.
Until the state pays my property taxes on my rental they need to stay out of my business !
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Old 08-20-2014, 06:24 AM
 
15,725 posts, read 12,309,078 times
Reputation: 13352
Quote:
Originally Posted by blu4u View Post
You don't need to be a law student to calculate interest rates. Fifth grade math will do.
Not so simple. A set of late fees has an internal rate of return (IRR) on the initial shortfall, but the calculation is definitely beyond fifth grade math:

Internal rate of return - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 08-20-2014, 07:39 AM
 
300 posts, read 392,748 times
Reputation: 218
Quote:
Originally Posted by Houston3 View Post
Until the state pays my property taxes on my rental they need to stay out of my business !
Good. Tell that to the judge...when you bring bring your tenant into small claims court.... Let us know how it works.
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Old 08-20-2014, 07:44 AM
 
300 posts, read 392,748 times
Reputation: 218
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
Not so simple. A set of late fees has an internal rate of return (IRR) on the initial shortfall, but the calculation is definitely beyond fifth grade math:

Internal rate of return - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Wowza.

I that the smoke and mirrors ya'll use to intimidate tenants from showing up in court. What other intimadtaions tatic do have up your selve.

Regarding the posted formula: Since late fees are a constant number, all one needs is the ratio side. Fifth grade math.
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Old 08-20-2014, 07:57 AM
 
Location: St Thomas, US Virgin Islands
24,671 posts, read 64,700,490 times
Reputation: 26614
Quote:
Originally Posted by blu4u View Post
Wowza.

I that the smoke and mirrors ya'll use to intimidate tenants from showing up in court. What other intimadtaions tatic do have up your selve.

Regarding the posted formula: Since late fees are a constant number, all one needs is the ratio side. Fifth grade math.
I'm not sure why you're bothering to argue a point which only you brought up and is based on misinformation and a hypothesis. The OP asked a question which was answered in accordance with the mandates of current state landlord tenant laws. If those same laws exist in the state in which you reside and you disagree with them then you can seek to change them.
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