Sent a demand letter, landlord sent back a bill ... (apartment, tenant, renter)
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Question regarding deposits. I am in KS. Hopefully I can keep this brief.
So we moved out of our townhome May 29. When we showed up for our move out inspection, our landlord no showed and when we called after waiting said he was unable to make it, and would call and do our inspection over the phone. We never heard from him again, despite multiple phone calls/messages (have phone records, if that helps?) and even stopping in person to inquire on the status of our deposit on June 24.
Kansas says they have to return your deposit or mail you a itemized list within 30 days. We didn't received anything, so we sent a certified with RR (July 1) demanding our deposit be returned in full.
On July 17th we received a letter back saying they had sent us a bill on June 26th. Which I find it hard to believe they did, considering my husband works for the USPS and the good ol 'lost in the mail' excuse is wildly overused. Also they sent us a bunch of handwritten invoices saying they did thousands of dollars of work on our unit. For example carpet replacement was 450, but handwritten on the invoice is an addition $800 dollars in charges, with a total handwritten on the bottom.
Anyway we lived in the place for 3 years, and the charges they are billing us for are total repainting (850 for the unit, 300 for ceilings), carpet replacement, carpet cleaning, and general cleaning. Along with lightbulbs and blinds and things that we replaced. We have some pictures (maybe 7?) as I didn't take many since this is the first time we have encountered this issue. I do have pictures of the areas they claim to have had to replace carpet. The carpet was undamaged and in good condition, pictures show that as well.
So we were planning to take them to small claims, due to the fact they didn't send us anything in the legal amount of time. However, now these claims and invoices have me worried. I know the charges are unsubstantiated, BUT will that matter? Since they claim to have mailed it in the correct amount of time, will the judge just believe that? The pictures I have show the unit was left in good condition, no holes, stains, dirt etc, but I don't have every room. I have the main areas and bathrooms, but none of the bedrooms (not that they are claiming charges in any of those, but still). I took them on my way out, thinking I would never need to use them. The only pictures they sent us with the invoices are of zoomed in 'holes' (maybe?) that you can't even tell from what they are from. Literally it could be a picture of anything, from anywhere.
Anyway does anyone have any advice? How they think taking it to court would work out? Can a landlord SAY they sent you something when they didn't? What about the handwritten invoices? And will my pictures be enough? Any thoughts are appreciated! Thanks!!!!
In some states, they have to send refunds or collection letters by certified mail. Not all states, though. My state doesn't require this.
If your state requires certified, then in some states, just by not doing so in the allotted time, the tenant wins by default, and is entitled to a full refund, regardless of damages, or even more. The landlord can still sue in small claims for the damages, though. But in other states, like mine, the tenant has to send a demand letter, and the landlord is ok as long as they respond within 3 days. Other states may have other rules.
So the answer for that part of your question could be anything from "they complied with the law by responding to your demand letter" to "they are screwed because they didn't send certified notice, and owe you 3x the deposit back regardless of damages" or pretty much anything in between.
As for the charges themselves, in most (all??) states, they can't charge for full replacement cost on carpet or paint. Those have to be prorated. But the proration laws are different in different states, and could also depend on the quality of the carpet, for example. So if it was cheap, apartment grade carpet, the 3 years you lived there could be the lifespan and you owe nothing. If it was nice, house grade carpet, it could be a 10 year lifespan and you could owe 7/10ths of it.
As for the handwritten notes, in my state, we aren't required to even give copies of bills at all, so that may or may not be relevant. In my state, as long as the charges are reasonable, the landlord can do the work themselves and a handwritten bill is fine. But the charges have to be reasonable and prorated where applicable. The carpet bill could have been just install, with the owner supplying the carpet and pad, and handwriting that in. Other states may require copies of all bills/receipts.
Be glad that you took some pictures. However, if you had any pets, the landlord is going to say that the carpet appeared undamaged, but had a strong pet smell (which is usually not a lie, incidentally). Pictures wouldn't show that.
Normally I don't advise tenants going to small claims with their landlords, as that will show up on your background check for life. If you lose, it will count against you on future rentals. But even if you win, some landlords will hold it against you. But in this case, if they are saying you owe them money, you may end up in small claims anyway, so might as well see if you can get some money back.
I should add, the handwritten invoices are in place of any kind of itemized list of deductions. We don't have anything saying what or where they painted or why, (or what or why they cleaned etc.) just a handwritten invoice saying "repaint -850; ceilings -300". Same with the carpet is says LR carpet-$450. We didn't have any pets either.
So it wont matter that they waited until well after there legally allotted time frame here? (law says 14 days and in no event exceeding 30 days) Just seemed like they got our certified and it made them mad, and they threw together a packet of papers. Of course that is just me speculating. Maybe they had it all together and forgot to mail it.
The handwritten invoices a judge will likely ask for proof of payment and if it is legit they will have it there in court. They sent you pictures which means they documented the damage you left so fighting it could easily cause you to pay their legal fees also. I would tread carefully here because you could easily pay for their lawyer along with the damages, lawyer doesn't have to be present in court in order to be billed they just have to be consulted on the case.
If it is a professional management company I would be willing to bet they sent the deposit bill certified which means legally it is delivered if you got it or not. All the requirements are is to send it to either the last known address or the forwarding address you left them. If you didn't leave a forwarding address all they have to do is send it to the place you were renting and it will come back to them.
If you don't have proof the damage they are claiming is false you have no case. You should have pictures of all windows, doors, floors, ceilings, and walls but the pictures should be obvious what it is looking at and honestly showing pictures of damage (holes used to hang pictures and the like).
You sent a demand letter so now its time to own up to it. If you back down be ready to pay because it will show them you have zero proof and they will sue you in a heart beat.
I should add, the handwritten invoices are in place of any kind of itemized list of deductions. We don't have anything saying what or where they painted or why, (or what or why they cleaned etc.) just a handwritten invoice saying "repaint -850; ceilings -300". Same with the carpet is says LR carpet-$450. We didn't have any pets either.
So it wont matter that they waited until well after there legally allotted time frame here? (law says 14 days and in no event exceeding 30 days) Just seemed like they got our certified and it made them mad, and they threw together a packet of papers. Of course that is just me speculating. Maybe they had it all together and forgot to mail it.
In court, it would be a matter of 'he said, you said' on proof whether the LL did actually send it to you within the 30 days because Kansas does not require that info be sent certified/RR but it doesn't mean it could not be ruled in your favor. Just depends on what is standard for your state judges on who they will side with in that matter. You stated you did finally receive the itemization, etc so if that was via USPS mail then it appears you were getting 'some' of his mail so not sure how a judge would determine who is telling the truth in this case.
The rest as far as the itemized charges, only you can determine if what he charged you for is fair or not because we don't have pics and we didn't see the apt and we don't know for sure what was done and what wasn't, etc, etc.
And as Lacerta stated, there is depreciation on carpet so whatever he charged you for has to be determined whether it was 1) normal wear and tear OR damage and 2) the depreciation of that carpet and not full cost if he replaced any, or all of it. Painting can also be considered normal wear and tear if there was no damage to the walls such as larger than picture nail holes or not too many picture nail holes, crayon, scuff marks or other damage to walls that required all of them to be painted, etc. Again, only you know any of this and pictures will definitely help your case. But to get down to actual details, there is no way we would know or be able to help unless we saw everything.
I suggest you try to find some legal advice in your city/county that might answer some of your questions for free or cheap or someone who knows Kansas laws and rulings on tenant/landlord issues. Or try locating a tenant resource center in your area. They usually give free advice/guidance to tenants. They would need to ask you more specific questions, obtain more details and see your photos, etc in order to help.
The handwritten invoices a judge will likely ask for proof of payment and if it is legit they will have it there in court. They sent you pictures which means they documented the damage you left so fighting it could easily cause you to pay their legal fees also. I would tread carefully here because you could easily pay for their lawyer along with the damages, lawyer doesn't have to be present in court in order to be billed they just have to be consulted on the case.
If it is a professional management company I would be willing to bet they sent the deposit bill certified which means legally it is delivered if you got it or not. All the requirements are is to send it to either the last known address or the forwarding address you left them. If you didn't leave a forwarding address all they have to do is send it to the place you were renting and it will come back to them.
If you don't have proof the damage they are claiming is false you have no case. You should have pictures of all windows, doors, floors, ceilings, and walls but the pictures should be obvious what it is looking at and honestly showing pictures of damage (holes used to hang pictures and the like).
You sent a demand letter so now its time to own up to it. If you back down be ready to pay because it will show them you have zero proof and they will sue you in a heart beat.
"I took them on my way out, thinking I would never need to use them. The only pictures they sent us with the invoices are of zoomed in 'holes' (maybe?) that you can't even tell from what they are from. Literally it could be a picture of anything, from anywhere."
There would be serious question about it. If the OP has pictures of same areas with no holes and the LL has zoomed in pictures of an area where you cannot even tell it's the same unit then it is not the definitive proof that is implied.
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The only pictures they sent us with the invoices are of zoomed in 'holes' (maybe?) that you can't even tell from what they are from. Literally it could be a picture of anything, from anywhere.
