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Knowingly withholding information about the safety of the unit is not handing ammunition to the shooter. It is minimizing liability.
If you've got a unit with mold in it, you've got a big liability. Even if the cause isn't your fault, even you are planning on fixing it, it's a liability. Withholding information from the tenant about the safety of their unit adds willful disregard to the lack of safety.
I guess it depends on how much of a legal quagmire you want to create for yourself, but compounding one liability with another isn't the way I'd go.
If the tenant wants this information she can pay for a test herself. Otherwise the landlord has no obligation to give it to him/her. The poster has already said she would let the tenant out of her lease, so she has no more obligation then to simply fix the problem.
Tenant wants to break lease and move this weekend, wants prorated rent and full deposit returned even though roommate painted a bedroom illegally(said no paint in lease).
I don't mind her breaking her lease and will even return unused rent and deposit as a gift but I want them to sign something which absolves me of any health issues down the line. In her notice she said "due to concerns about health and damage of possessions" she wants to leave.
How should I word this statement? What is she refuses to sign anything? I just want this whole mess overwith and not to bite me in the butt in the future. I have accomodated every wish she has made, air people, scrubbing the unit twice, scrubbing the air, installing dehumidier, offered her use of my son's unit next door (he is gone till end of December) and to fix bathroomn where mold is coming. What more can I do?
Am I unreasonable to ask for a statement waiving me of liability for future health issues?
Not sure, but at this point I'd be having a consultation with an attorney on whether or not that is wise and specifically on how it should be worded. Such a release is not something that should be drafted by someone with no expertise in legalese, because THAT could come back to bite you in future.
Tenant wants to break lease and move this weekend, wants prorated rent and full deposit returned even though roommate painted a bedroom illegally(said no paint in lease).
I don't mind her breaking her lease and will even return unused rent and deposit as a gift but I want them to sign something which absolves me of any health issues down the line. In her notice she said "due to concerns about health and damage of possessions" she wants to leave.
How should I word this statement? What is she refuses to sign anything? I just want this whole mess overwith and not to bite me in the butt in the future. I have accomodated every wish she has made, air people, scrubbing the unit twice, scrubbing the air, installing dehumidier, offered her use of my son's unit next door (he is gone till end of December) and to fix bathroomn where mold is coming. What more can I do?
Am I unreasonable to ask for a statement waiving me of liability for future health issues?
You can try to get her to sign, but I don't think she will. From her perspective you allowing her to leave isn't really a concession on your part, if she went to court the judge would likely rule she could leave(without penalty) because of the mold, depending on what complaints she has in writing, and how the complaint process works in your state. But I would charge her the damage to the apartment, paint whatever else. Maybe even unpaid rent for less than 30 days notice(not really sure about that).
Sounds like the tenant has been a unreasonable so I don't blame you for wanting to get this, but I don't know if he/she will agree.
Good luck.
Isn't it easier to do the remediation with the unit vacant... easier to schedule and not having tenant's personal items to deal with?
I think I would let the room paint go and start fresh. I would keep it extremely friendly... legal fees can add up fast even if you win in court.
As for "Signing" I still use conditional endorsements on the back of my Deposit Return Checks and my itemized Move Out Closing Statement has a signature line for the tenant to sign.
"Endorsement acknowledges final settlement of all claims and return of all monies due regarding tenancy at "XYZ" Rental.
I'm not an Attourney... an Attorney suggested this as standard practice when I started managing rentals almost 30 years ago.
Last edited by Ultrarunner; 12-12-2009 at 10:34 AM..
Reason: clarity
Tenant wants to break lease and move this weekend, wants prorated rent and full deposit returned even though roommate painted a bedroom illegally(said no paint in lease).
I don't mind her breaking her lease and will even return unused rent and deposit as a gift but I want them to sign something which absolves me of any health issues down the line. In her notice she said "due to concerns about health and damage of possessions" she wants to leave.
How should I word this statement? What is she refuses to sign anything? I just want this whole mess overwith and not to bite me in the butt in the future. I have accomodated every wish she has made, air people, scrubbing the unit twice, scrubbing the air, installing dehumidier, offered her use of my son's unit next door (he is gone till end of December) and to fix bathroomn where mold is coming. What more can I do?
Am I unreasonable to ask for a statement waiving me of liability for future health issues?
Trying to provide safe living conditions is not enough, as a landlord you actually have to succeedin providing safe living conditions. You can try wording a waiver any way you want and you could even see if she is stupid enough to sign it (although she doesn't sound that dumb), but that doesn't make it a legally binding. A landlord is always responsible for creating and maintaining safe living conditions. There is no lease clause or waiver that absolves this responsibility. Furthermore creating such a document doesn't absolve you of guilt, it proves your guilt by its mere existence.
Take this situation as an opportunity. You said yourself that it was going to be impossible to take care of the mold problem if she didn't leave for the holidays. Now she's leaving for good which gives you plenty of time to take care of the problem, and then you can get a new tenant.
Trying to provide safe living conditions is not enough, as a landlord you actually have to succeedin providing safe living conditions. You can try wording a waiver any way you want and you could even see if she is stupid enough to sign it (although she doesn't sound that dumb), but that doesn't make it a legally binding. A landlord is always responsible for creating and maintaining safe living conditions. There is no lease clause or waiver that absolves this responsibility. Furthermore creating such a document doesn't absolve you of guilt, it proves your guilt by its mere existence.
Take this situation as an opportunity. You said yourself that it was going to be impossible to take care of the mold problem if she didn't leave for the holidays. Now she's leaving for good which gives you plenty of time to take care of the problem, and then you can get a new tenant.
How should I word this statement? (snip)
Am I unreasonable to ask for a statement waiving me of liability for future health issues?
The problem you have with asking somebody to "sign away their rights" to potential future claims (health issues related to mold/mildew) is that you're asking a person without professional medical knowledge to sign away stuff that they can't possibly know about in a blanket coverage.
I'm no lawyer, but I've been on landlord end of this type of release. It may work to intimidate a departing tenant who is most interested in getting their money at the time ... and giving them a mindset that they're done with you. But should they actually come down later with "symptoms" (real or imagined), your release statement will be nothing more than a miniscule hurdle for them to overcome to pursue their health claims against you.
You simply can't hold people to a release for which they couldn't possibly know what they were signing away.
IMO, it's better to just quietly get these tenants out of the apartment and then effect the needed repairs without creating any more attention to the structure problems. If your tenant has indicated they simply "want out", it's a lesser problem for you to pay them to be on their way ASAP and not raise a whole bunch of issues related to the defects of the apartment during their stay. Make it as easy as possible for them to leave and be happy in their new place ... wherever that is, but it's out of your liability zone.
Overall, I think you'll find that to be less costly than a confrontation over health issues with the tenant. Arguing over inspection reports merely continues to bring these issues to the forefront, and you want the tenant to focus on other things. In the same vein, bringing them a release statement to sign to get their money/partial rent/deposit back just brings up the health issue all over again. Which impression would you rather have the tenant left with? A worthless release which angers them or the satisfaction of having been able to leave as best as possible?
Tenant wants to break lease and move this weekend, wants prorated rent and full deposit returned even though roommate painted a bedroom illegally(said no paint in lease).
I don't mind her breaking her lease and will even return unused rent and deposit as a gift but I want them to sign something which absolves me of any health issues down the line. In her notice she said "due to concerns about health and damage of possessions" she wants to leave.
How should I word this statement? What is she refuses to sign anything? I just want this whole mess overwith and not to bite me in the butt in the future. I have accomodated every wish she has made, air people, scrubbing the unit twice, scrubbing the air, installing dehumidier, offered her use of my son's unit next door (he is gone till end of December) and to fix bathroomn where mold is coming. What more can I do?
Am I unreasonable to ask for a statement waiving me of liability for future health issues?
Yes, you are. You are also potentially giving her ideas about suing you down the road. Such a waiver might not be enforceable and whether she knows that or not, she can still try to sue you and make your life a living hell.
I broke a lease under similar circumstances many years ago due to mold which eventually ruined hundreds of dollars of my personal possessions and was also a serious health hazard. The landlord tried to blame me for the mold problem and even sent threatening letters, but I laughed at them then ignored them. The mold was absolutely their fault, their problem, their responsibility, and I had all of that in writing. I did not even go after them for my health issues (which took months to clear up) or reimbursement for my ruined possessions (some of which were irreplaceable). I should have, though.
If they had asked me to sign a waiver absolving them of anything, I would have probably sued them immediately for reimbursement of my ruined possessions for no other reason than simple spite.
My advice to you as a former tenant is to get her out of there as cheaply as you can and with as little bad blood as possible, since depending on your local laws she may actually be able to come back on you for health problems due to the mold. As another poster stated it is your responsibility to provide a safe habitable living environment and you have failed to do so despite your best efforts. Just get her out, take care of your mold problem, and move on. If you make things difficult for your current tenant or do things to cheese her off, I would think it would only increase the odds that she'll come after you down the line.
If you have people with health issues you really need to put that above
money and fear of lawyers. Don't let fear control your decisions. It will come back and bite you.
I've been in suites and when you withhold information that pertains to peoples health you will get buried. Use common sense, if it were you or your kids and there is a potential health risk what would you want? Would you want to be left in the dark?
People are much more apt to sue when you are dishonest. If someone does get hurt they are going to have much more motivation to go after you.
You will look very bad in court and well you should.
Horrible advise to withhold.
The reason you have insurance is so you do not have to live your life worrying about lawsuits. Do the right thing and they will never happen.
The guy that said be honest is correct, it will always come back and bite you later. What goes around comes around.
I have a office that has a water problem and one sick employee. I did not know this but she has seen her Dr several times.
The problem is a ceiling tile that I thought a person took care of months ago. The idiot just replaced the tile and never bothered to check for the source of water. Now its a health issue.
Instead of hiding anything I am working to properly fix the problem. Replacing the tile will not cut it. They now will have to fix the source which was the air-conditioner unit. Then air sample before and after.
Her mold titers are up. Her Dr. was afraid to talk about Mold being the source. Why? lawyers. Am I? No way. I don't want her to get sick. I'm going to contact her Dr. with the report to see if whats in the office is what is causing the symptoms.
If she gets super sick and she sues, oh well I'm insured. Now her Dr. (wimp) can maybe talk without the scared look.
This mold thing is insane. Yes its real, yes it can hurt people. The only problem I see is the fear and cover-up.
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