More work you put into the project the less you get out (state, engaged)

[TimAZ]

Originally Posted by PAhippo

sometimes the journey is more important than the goal.

And sometimes the gurney is the reward.

Retirement allows time for reflection, most of it useless. We can’t live in the past or the future.

[carnelian]

I agree with Jrkliny. Most people I know put in minimal or no effort
and no risks. They don't like to think much either.



My question is: given that I or someone else has failed to attain 2-3 life goals despite
decades of attempts (such as finding a LTR or fulltime career job worthy of my talent,)
does that mean that person (e.g.me) is a loser, a failure?

Unfortunately, my education occupation is extremely competitive everywhere.

Despite years of prolonged searches and trips, I still haven't moved away, partly from fear and also lack of sufficient money. But that's another story.A lot more I could say.

[carnelian]

If you have not attained your major goals, at this point, after 60 or 70, despite a great amount of effort and time over the years,
does that mean or suggest you have failed or you are a loser?

[silibran]

I think plain old luck has a lot to do with where people end up.

But working hard and making good decisions are also huge factors.

Our health, good or bad, is also a factor. And the way one reacts to difficulties is another.

So, I don’t agree with OP’s premise. Complex problems generally don’t have simple explanations or solutions.

[elnrgby]

Originally Posted by carnelian

The old cliche is that the more you put into something, the more you get out of it.
Teachers, counselors, coaches, everyone says that. It is not always true, I found. Over the years
I have put a great amount of effort into projects, and actually achieved much less. So it is frustrating
and a sort of dead-end,aggravating. maybe a waste of time?
Examples: searching for fulfilling jobs, finding someone to marry, publishing work, moving, etc. If your goal relies on other people, then who knows? Sometimes the things you worry about are NOT the things that end up mattering to you.
P.S. This idea came from Karl Marx, who wrote that about the toiling workers of his time.

Agree?

I generally put most of the effort in assuring that I am doing whatever I am doing the best possible way (and, if it is a team effort, that I am doing it with the best possible people). The effort to avoid mistakes always pays off, at least in my experience. If I am doing something incorrectly, putting more effort into doing it incorrectly will of course not result in a better outcome, but I am generally able to figure out what is incorrect, at least in the realm of activities that I have been interested in pursuing in life.


I do agree with your other post that the age of 60 to 70 is too late to embark on "achievements". It is possible to continue going with something a person has started earlier, out of habit or for fun or for supplemental income, but generally there isn't much new achievement after 60. At that age, wherever you are, you have arrived.

[Dustyroad70]

Originally Posted by carnelian

The old cliche is that the more you put into something, the more you get out of it.
Teachers, counselors, coaches, everyone says that. It is not always true, I found. Over the years
I have put a great amount of effort into projects, and actually achieved much less. So it is frustrating
and a sort of dead-end,aggravating. maybe a waste of time?
Examples: searching for fulfilling jobs, finding someone to marry, publishing work, moving, etc. If your goal relies on other people, then who knows? Sometimes the things you worry about are NOT the things that end up mattering to you.
P.S. This idea came from Karl Marx, who wrote that about the toiling workers of his time.

Agree?

So, if you are getting your information from the likes of "Karl Marx", I would say you are on the wrong track to begin with.

[fluffythewondercat]

Originally Posted by elnrgby

I do agree with your other post that the age of 60 to 70 is too late to embark on "achievements". It is possible to continue going with something a person has started earlier, out of habit or for fun or for supplemental income, but generally there isn't much new achievement after 60. At that age, wherever you are, you have arrived.

I don't agree with that at all. I'm 65 and I'm just hitting my stride. I think it's counterproductive and damaging to believe that once you're 60, you're all washed up.

I could (but won't) name countless Silicon Valley pioneers > 60 who are still innovating and breaking new ground. And I don't think anyone believes Dean Kamen at 68 is all finished.

[TMSRetired]

Originally Posted by carnelian

I agree with Jrkliny. Most people I know put in minimal or no effort
and no risks. They don't like to think much either.



My question is: given that I or someone else has failed to attain 2-3 life goals despite
decades of attempts (such as finding a LTR or fulltime career job worthy of my talent,)
does that mean that person (e.g.me) is a loser, a failure?

Unfortunately, my education occupation is extremely competitive everywhere.

Despite years of prolonged searches and trips, I still haven't moved away, partly from fear and also lack of sufficient money. But that's another story.A lot more I could say.

You didn't fail. You just didn't achieve the goals you set out for yourself for one reason or another.
So set some new goals and have a better plan to achieve them.

Some use the 1-3-5 year rule to achieve their goals.

Failure is simply the opportunity to begin again.
Henry Ford

[Sand&Salt]

Wrong place, wrong time, wrong person---whether that's a spouse or business partner.

All those can ruin well-laid plans and are not your fault. Effort can be beside the point.

Example: Selling a house you built with your sweat in a down market. Without a crystal ball....

[elnrgby]

Originally Posted by fluffythewondercat

I don't agree with that at all. I'm 65 and I'm just hitting my stride. I think it's counterproductive and damaging to believe that once you're 60, you're all washed up.

I could (but won't) name countless Silicon Valley pioneers > 60 who are still innovating and breaking new ground. And I don't think anyone believes Dean Kamen at 68 is all finished.

No, I didn't say you were washed up at 65, in fact I said many people do continue successfully into their senior age with activities they have been doing earlier. I said that people generally do not achieve NEW things past 60. Countless Silicon Valley pioneers > 60 were pioneers in the 1970s and 1980s, now they are just continuing and improving what they pioneered > 35-45 years ago. Their current "innovations" are not of the same caliber as ushering a completely new technological era, as the things they were doing when they were young.