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Old 09-26-2022, 09:53 PM
 
Location: Tennessee
32,800 posts, read 27,312,352 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by movin1 View Post
I retired in 2010 at age 57 after working at one job for 34 years. In 2018, I started working full time again. I have an OK retirement income from the first job, but wouldn't want to rely on it given the current inflation rate. I'm tired of the stock market "gamble" and losing money every day. Inflation is eating into my ability to be able to "retire" again, so I guess I'll keep working as long as I can.
At 36 with "below the curve" retirement savings, my best bet seems to be to try to find a state job in a blue state, a federal job, or any other state job with pension benefits, probably in that order. I've basically given up on being able to retire off of defined contribution plans.

I'm doing better than most, as it is. At six figures in a low COL area, no kids, with a very low house payment, and no debt other than the house/car payment, I'm doing better than probably at least 90% of people my age that I know. With any luck, the car will be paid off in about two years.

I'm likely too old to get the investment returns needed to have a comfortable retirement. I've lost a lot of money. I wasn't able to save much until I was 30. 36 is way different than 22, but I couldn't find meaningful, stable work until I was basically 30. I had my first "career-track" job at 27, but people were cycling through left and right.

The issue is that, if anything outside of the "ideal scenario" happens, you're really struggling.

These losses, and some other things, are also causing my previously right-wing politics to shift a bit left on some issues. I can't see myself voting for Biden over DeSantis, but I could maybe hold my nose and vote for Biden over Trump at this point.
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Old 09-26-2022, 10:36 PM
 
6,722 posts, read 3,067,916 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VivienL View Post
Hi, are those deferred fixed income annuities that you have? I'd love to learn more about how you structured them. Like, every 5 years, does a new annuity start paying in addition to the existing annuity? I would love to do this. I'm not seeking to be rich in retirement, just comfortable.
Yes exactly, they are deferred fixed annuities. I bought more and more annuities from my savings (as I earned thise savings), so my annuities are kind of a patchwork. Oh dear... I have told the story so many times here that it getting difficult to keep repeating ... anyway, I am a single woman without kids, do not need to leave inheritance, and I think that is the optimal situation for annuities. You also need fairly solid savings, because annuities are not cheap.

So, the first annuity was actually fixed immediate life annuity, which I bought at the age of 45 because I was traveling for work, was very busy & unable to keep track of bills while traveling, and wanted to assure there was always enough $ in the checking account for automatic electronic monthly bill payments which just started replacing paper checks at that time. That annuity is a life annuity with a beneficiary (ie, if I died within 20 years of starting the annuity payout, the beneficiary would continue getting my annuity payment until 20 years are up). That annuity is only $1k per month, but it comes handy, it has paid for itself (ie, the total payout has equalled the initial premium) sometime earlier this year, meaning that I'll be getting $1k of free money per month til the end of my life (I am 62.5 now, in good health, and from a very long-lived family).

Then I also have a time-limited fixed immediate annuity which started paying out when I was 54-55 (though I was still working a lot at that time too). I got it because I was self-employed, working on contracts, and the job market for older contractors in my field started contracting, so I thought I needed to be fully self-supporting if I fully retired. I did indeed retire at 60, and am living normally right now on the mentioned two annuities. But my second annuity is time-limited for 10 years - sort of like a 10 year bank CD, but with much better interest rates than in the bank, and the ability to take money out in equal amounts every month for 10 years.

At the end of 10 years, when I'll be 65, three other time-limited fixed delayed annuities kick in. One of them pays out for only 5 years, the other two for 15 years.

At the age of 70, two annuities kick in, one time-limited for 10 years (til age 80), and one life annuity (til I die). I also plan to start taking soc security at 70, which is in fact a form of annuity, the best one :-).

At the age of 80, two 15-year time-limited annuities end, but one longevity life annuity starts & goes on til I die (in addition to two ongoing life annuities, one that started at 45, and another at 70).

At the age of 85, additional longevity life annuity starts & goes on til I die. The last annuity (which I bought only because it was super cheap, and because folks in my family tend to live well into their 90s & beyond) starts at 90 & goes on til I die too.

My annuities that start prior to age 70 and at 70 all have a beneficiary in case I die prior to getting back the premium in the form of monthly payouts (because it was not expensive to add a beneficiary for those annuities, and for time-limited annuities there is no cost for adding a beneficiary). The three last annuities starting at 80, 85, and 90 are "life only", ie, if I die before collecting any or some or all of my premium, there is no death beneficiary & the insurance company keeps the premium. This is because after about the age of early 70s, it becomes progressively very expensive to add a beneficiary to an annuity policy.

All of my annuities are with highly rated insurance companies, most of which have existed for more than 100 years. The fixed monthly annuity payout has been paid like a clockwork every month, rain or shine, regardless of what markets are doing. I had paid altogether something like $1.2 million in annuity premiums over my working years, am collecting a payout of about $4k/mo now, which will go up to $6k/mo in 2.5 years (age 65), then to $6.5k + soc security at 70, then to $8k + soc security at 80, then to $10k + ss at 85, and finally to $13k + ss at 90.

The best annuity broker is ImmediateAnnuities.com - they are very knowledgeable & honest, provide detailed explanations, and I'd recommend that you get any annuities through them. The important thing is to get FIXED annuities (and layer them, ie, have them start at different times to compensate for inflation). Variable annuities, while promising a possibility of higher returns, usually have poor returns due to high account fees, and should be avoided (unless you are REALLY financially knowledgeable - but in that case you'd probably be an investor rather than annuitant).
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Old 09-26-2022, 10:50 PM
 
6,722 posts, read 3,067,916 times
Reputation: 9399
Quote:
Originally Posted by VivienL View Post
Hi, are those deferred fixed income annuities that you have? I'd love to learn more about how you structured them. Like, every 5 years, does a new annuity start paying in addition to the existing annuity? I would love to do this. I'm not seeking to be rich in retirement, just comfortable.
I also want to say, annuities (in addition to not requiring any further attention from you after you buy the annuity) pay you progressively more total money the longer you live - you can't outlive them, unlike with investments from which you keep withdrawing money for retirement support. If I died now, I would lose about $250k total that I paid (mostly in my early 50s) for the last 3 annuity premiums, and my designated beneficiary would get back all the other premiums that I have not used so far. But if I live to be 99 (like one of my grandfathers), I will get the total payout of somewhere around $4.5 million over the years (from the $1.2 million total that I paid in premiums), which is totally not bad :-).
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Old 09-26-2022, 10:59 PM
 
Location: Tennessee
32,800 posts, read 27,312,352 times
Reputation: 43193
Quote:
Originally Posted by springfieldva View Post
Things were tighter in the 70's to begin with. People lived much more basic lives. Growing up, it was a rare treat for my family to eat at a restaurant and when we did we went to a place like Pizza Hut. Kids spent their summers riding bikes, swimming at the community pool and catching fire flies. We did our own housework and yard work, washed our own cars, painted our own nails...

People seem to have a lot more disposable income these days, hire more done, spend more on stuff in general. So inflation hasn't hurt the average family in quite the same way that it did back in the 70's.

I was just a kid back during the Carter years but I remember sitting in the long gas lines waiting to get the car filled up. I also remember pinching pennies, mending clothes and wearing hand me downs. And my family was solid middle class.
Sure, if you take the "features" of a house or a car, yes, you probably do get more for the dollar.

But how can you even do an equivalent comparison? Virtually any car is far safer and more reliable than in the 1970s. I've piled 50,000 miles on two year old Forester with no issues. That likely wouldn't have happened in the 1970s with any car. You can't get a similarly low end car to what you had twenty years ago, much less longer. Virtually everything has automatic transmission, Bluetooth, power windows, power locks, etc. You get much more value for the dollar in terms of reliability and features, even on the low end.

I grew up lower middle class. We never worried about food or the basics, but I was an only child. Maybe a once year trip to Myrtle Beach at a basic motel.

I managed to get myself and my girlfriend a five star hotel with a rooftop pool in Sandestin, FL (a bit east of Destin - in an exclusive golf/resort area) for under $200/night, for five nights. Finest hotel I've ever stayed in. My parents and grandparents have never stayed anywhere like that. My guess is that only the multimillionaire uncle has done anything like that - he's done far more than I can do.

Life hasn't been perfect for me, but coming from a lower middle class background in small town Appalachia, I've not done too badly.
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Old 09-27-2022, 12:03 AM
 
Location: Was Midvalley Oregon; Now Eastside Seattle area
11,658 posts, read 5,802,203 times
Reputation: 8598
Quote:
Originally Posted by VivienL View Post
Hi, are those deferred fixed income annuities that you have? I'd love to learn more about how you structured them. Like, every 5 years, does a new annuity start paying in addition to the existing annuity? I would love to do this. I'm not seeking to be rich in retirement, just comfortable.
A nice thing about immediate and deferred, fixed income annuities are that they are backed with corresponding longterm assets.

There are other types of annuities. ImmediateAnnuities.com has an excellent printable pamphlet (Annuity Buyer's Shoppers Guide, pdf).
I have an inquiry with my local credit union. I visited the local Fidelity office last Friday, for deferred income annuities. Implied rates have increased and probably will increase with Federal Reserve interest rate increases but future increases may be limited due to higher retail demand from retired-retiring Boomers and early X-Generation.

We have GLWB Variable and Fixed-Indexed Annuities (2008-2018), which are no longer available with the options we chose. I pretty much ignored immediate and deferred fixed income annuities because interest rates were virtually nonexistent 2008-2018. Low interest rates favored variable-equity based annuities. Obviously, the situation has flipped.

Shop until you drop.
Thoroughly understand your annuities prior to purchase. Because annuity purchase is essentially a nonreversible decision.

Annuities (SS, small pension, and purchased annuities) form a income floor to our retirement.
YMMV
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Old 09-27-2022, 07:10 AM
 
Location: Vermont
7,316 posts, read 3,246,781 times
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I retired in 2020 right as COVID went into full swing. I'd had cancer in 2019 and thought about life going forward. I had a good paying fed job with benefits but I'd also been working my entire life. I never really agonized over whether we'd have enough $$.....the house is paid for and we have no debt.

Had a small but decent pension from another place and would get a 2nd small one from the fed. That one allowed me to pay for/take my insurance with me. so I have medicare and that fed back up. Have a 1/2 way decent 401K and have not taken social security yet. (I will get penalized with the windfall elimination provision so I'm waiting.) Between Hubs and I - he also has a small pension and medical - we are pretty good to go. We don't live extravagantly but we don't want for anything either.

Since I knew we had at least 3 guaranteed checks with COLA coming in, I pulled the plug. I never got into all this annuity and calculation and 'complicated' stuff. maybe foolishly, but so far, so good.
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Old 09-27-2022, 08:28 AM
 
12,529 posts, read 13,005,483 times
Reputation: 19420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
Sure, if you take the "features" of a house or a car, yes, you probably do get more for the dollar.

But how can you even do an equivalent comparison? Virtually any car is far safer and more reliable than in the 1970s. I've piled 50,000 miles on two year old Forester with no issues. That likely wouldn't have happened in the 1970s with any car. You can't get a similarly low end car to what you had twenty years ago, much less longer. Virtually everything has automatic transmission, Bluetooth, power windows, power locks, etc. You get much more value for the dollar in terms of reliability and features, even on the low end.

I grew up lower middle class. We never worried about food or the basics, but I was an only child. Maybe a once year trip to Myrtle Beach at a basic motel.

I managed to get myself and my girlfriend a five star hotel with a rooftop pool in Sandestin, FL (a bit east of Destin - in an exclusive golf/resort area) for under $200/night, for five nights. Finest hotel I've ever stayed in. My parents and grandparents have never stayed anywhere like that. My guess is that only the multimillionaire uncle has done anything like that - he's done far more than I can do.

Life hasn't been perfect for me, but coming from a lower middle class background in small town Appalachia, I've not done too badly.
Back in the 70's my dad worked on our cars - did the oil changes, replaced worn out parts/spark plugs/hoses as needed, replaced wiper blades, brakes, rotated tires. We rarely took our cars to the mechanic. Dad was able to keep our cars going for a long time.

These days with all the computer chips in cars and power everything, many/most repairs require a visit to the repair shop although my husband does what he can at home.

There was an entrenched frugality and a self reliant DIY quality back in the 70's that isn't seen that much today.

Family vacations back then were an extended weekend in a mountain cabin. I was a teenager before I ever saw the ocean even though we only lived a couple of hours away from it. Seashore rentals were simply more money than my parents wanted to spend.

These days, almost everyone takes family vacations often to really nice, exotic places.
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Old 09-27-2022, 08:35 AM
 
Location: New York Area
30,165 posts, read 13,112,287 times
Reputation: 25018
Quote:
Originally Posted by whateverblahblahblah View Post
I was planning on retiring in 5 years or so, but now it looks like it will be more like 10 years since inflation has shot up and the stock market has gone down the toilet. From what I've read, it looks like things will suck for at least the next couple of years, possibly longer, especially if the economy craters. About a year ago, I penciled in 2027 for my retirement year but that just isn't happening unless a miracle occurs.

I've hated working for decades. I hate waking up at an ungodly hour, fighting traffic for 3 hours a day round trip, staring at boring things that I don't care about on a monitor for 8 hours a day, and wearing a fake smile around bosses and coworkers who I don't particularly like and would rather not deal with.

I've been in a bad mood lately, but I figure it's beyond my control, so why worry about it?
In earlier years, 65 was considered retirement age. I am 65 and obviously nowhere near retirement. I think anyone who relies on collecting their livelihood through the efforts of others is making a major mistake.

I am an attorney representing two siblings in a battle with another sibling about their father's estate. Guess what; the legal bills are in the high six-figures or low seven-figures with no end in sight. And all three are focusing their mental energies on carving up a prior fortune rather than generating one themselves. People who rely on the stock market to exist (other obviously than brokers) are a high-class form of a Las Vegas, Atlantic City or Native American casino gambler.
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Old 09-27-2022, 08:54 AM
 
27 posts, read 10,235 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
I think anyone who relies on collecting their livelihood through the efforts of others is making a major mistake.
Isn't that pretty much much the basis of capitalism? What you've described applies to employers, landlords, etc.
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Old 09-27-2022, 01:05 PM
 
Location: Elsewhere
82,211 posts, read 75,529,835 times
Reputation: 105264
Quote:
Originally Posted by springfieldva View Post
Things were tighter in the 70's to begin with. People lived much more basic lives. Growing up, it was a rare treat for my family to eat at a restaurant and when we did we went to a place like Pizza Hut. Kids spent their summers riding bikes, swimming at the community pool and catching fire flies. We did our own housework and yard work, washed our own cars, painted our own nails...

People seem to have a lot more disposable income these days, hire more done, spend more on stuff in general. So inflation hasn't hurt the average family in quite the same way that it did back in the 70's.

I was just a kid back during the Carter years but I remember sitting in the long gas lines waiting to get the car filled up. I also remember pinching pennies, mending clothes and wearing hand me downs. And my family was solid middle class.
Good post! Yes, people bought used cars and drove them for years. Nobody had a landscaper to cut their home lawns unless you paid a neighbor kid to use your own mower. No leaf blowers. You didn't have ten different pairs of shoes. Seeing a person out "jogging" was new, let alone people going to gyms unless they took up boxing or something. Nail salons? No such thing.

This wasn't "we were poor". This is just how most people lived.

The 80s are what changed things. Life became very materialistic. Designer this and that, fancy sneakers, BMWs. A simple marker is that at that time, what used to be a cheap meal--spaghetti or macaroni or noodles--suddenly was called "pasta", and restaurants were charging high prices for it. Lol. In my mind, that is the marker between the middle-class life of the 70s and the Amex "Acquire it!" marketing of the 80s. "Pasta".

Shows like Dallas and Dynasty were the rage, and all of a sudden, everybody wanted to live like the rich. And we haven't stopped.
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Last edited by Mightyqueen801; 09-27-2022 at 01:49 PM..
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