Do all providence suburbs feel the same (Warwick, Cranston: home, neighborhood)

[AlfieBoy]

[quote=sandsonik;44469559]

Originally Posted by massnative71

Please tell us all you know about "real RI", and how you learned it. Which parts are not real? Are they mirages, tricks done with lights and mirrors or what?

Is it only the Rhode Islanders in the unreal portion of Rhode Island who are capable of intelligent conversation? What do "real" Rhode Islanders talk about and why isn't it 'intelligent conversation'?

I think the quote tags got mixed prior to you posting and I wonder if the above was intended for me, or where you replying to this:

Originally Posted by massnative71

Really showing your insulation from "real RI" (CH ain't it), otherwise you would understand the irony of what you just said...

[boulevardofdef]

Originally Posted by QuilterChick

There is a tremendous migration from 'New York' natives right here in the bucolic mountains of NC, who quickly say they are from State of New York. Or are 'halfbacks' from NY via FL. They like to point out that they are not from NY City, and will say exactly which NY area they are from -- and feel the need to define "NY'ers" out of embarrassment due to the reputation of many NY'ers to be rude, loud, pushy and brash know it alls. It takes them a long time to assimilate here into a slower, kinder lifestyle, if they ever do. That goes for the NY'ers who move to FL too, and end up coming here as 'halfbacks'.

That may be because they're from parts of the state that aren't near the city. People from other parts of New York State, and New York is a large state by Eastern standards, always take pains to point out that they're not from New York City -- I was talking about people who are, like myself, from the New York metro area. Alternatively, they could just hate where they're from to the point where they're ashamed of it -- after all, these are all people who left.

I'm from Long Island, and the people there are on average louder, pushier and bigger know-it-alls than people from the city, so you'd never see someone trumpeting their Long Island roots as a way of escaping that stereotype. I have this theory that if you start in Manhattan and head east, people are bigger aggressive jerks the farther you go. So in Manhattan, you've got people accusing shopkeepers of deliberately blocking the price readout on the cash register; further east in Queens, you have old ladies telling you off at the supermarket checkout for zoning out and not moving up in line quickly enough; in Nassau County, you have immigrants screaming "You little $@!! You little $@!!" at the guy selling train tickets; and on the East End, you have Lizzie Grubman plowing through a crowd of townies in her SUV while yelling, "Out of my way, white trash!"

[massnative71]

Originally Posted by boulevardofdef

I read something interesting about Rhode Island and suburbs a while back, I believe in a travel book I bought the first time I visited the state. The writer noted that Rhode Island is unique in that outside of Providence, every place is a suburb and no place is a suburb. Everything is firmly in the orbit of Providence, and Providence dominates the state in a lot of ways. At the same time, every single city and town has a distinct identity apart from "suburb of Providence." This isn't true everywhere. I, for instance, grew up in a suburb of New York that wasn't really anything other than a suburb of New York. When traveling, people from there will invariably tell others they're "from New York," meaning the city. I don't get the sense anyone in Rhode Island tells outsiders they're "from Providence," unless they actually are.

Pretty typical for all of New England...

Originally Posted by boulevardofdef

There's no such thing as the "real RI," or the real anywhere. It's all real.

I was making the point that someone like Alfieboy who pretty much confines himself to inner Providence, seemingly lives on an entirely different planet than the typical person residing in Cranston or North Smithfield. That severely limits his ability to respond to a thread such as this.

Originally Posted by sandsonik

Yes, yes. A thousand times YES! No Rhode Islander
considers their town a suburb of Providence. It's a real town that stands independent, has its own identity. It's one thing I learned when travelling; in other parts of the country, if you ask people where they're from they name the nearest known city, even if their town is 30 minutes to an hour away.

A person from Coventry, Warwick or Cumberland would never tell a stranger they are from Providence. They are not. They may not have a problem with being called suburban but it would raise their hackles to hear they are a suburb of Providence because it implies 'just' and it robs them of their identity. When a town has been around for a few hundred years, alongside Providence, and families have roots that go back generations in that town, it's weird to hear it being spoken of only in relation to Providence.

But in other parts of the country with very large cities, there do seem to be bedroom community suburbs that sprung up to serve city workers where that is their identity and it doesn t seem to bother them. Their pride and allegiance may be different.

I am both surprised and very happy that you get this about RI. A lot of out of staters never grasp it.

Yes they have a few hundred years history an identity of their own, but they are still suburbs. There's no rule about suburbia having to resemble the Sunbelt version of it.

Originally Posted by sandsonik

Please tell us all you know about "real RI", and how you learned it. Which parts are not real? Are they mirages, tricks done with lights and mirrors or what?

Is it only the Rhode Islanders in the unreal portion of Rhode Island who are capable of intelligent conversation? What do "real" Rhode Islanders talk about and why isn't it 'intelligent conversation'?

Lighten up, just lighten up...

[AlfieBoy]

Originally Posted by massnative71

...

I was making the point that someone like Alfieboy who pretty much confines himself to inner Providence...

Could be, but Alfieboy also knows a thing or two about urban planning and the social/physical construct of cities. So it is entirely appropriate for me to say that one needs to walk around to observe people and their interactions in an urban/suburban ecosystem --I am well-positioned to make comments as I have never known anything but urban living. So you can see where I view your opinion as limited (if not flawed): you don't have a body of knowledge on urban life, on the working of an interactive social system.

... [he] seemingly lives on an entirely different planet than the typical person residing in Cranston or North Smithfield. That severely limits his ability to respond to a thread such as this.

It's a big world with lots of options and opportunities to live a life that best suits each individual. And this affects how we relate to the environment and to others. For example, in my old city, the notion of owning a car is pretty alien and would invoke incredulity among many -- only 23% of households in Manhattan own a car and less than 25% even have a driver's license. So the worldview of drivers and non-drivers affects where we live, who we hang with, where we dine and almost everything related to distance is a calculated factor in many spects of our lives. So in NYC, you'd be the odd duck; here in Rhody, it's me. So yes, it's a different planet, but it in no way limits my understanding of suburbs. I keep hammering this because it always seems like you need to get info drilled into your head about twenty times before you (maybe) get it.

Originally Posted by MN71

Lighten up, just lighten up...

You made inferences and when called on them you want everyone to dummy up. No, that's poor sport and intellectually weak. Sansonik appropriately inquired:

Originally Posted by sandsonik

tell us all you know about "real RI", and how you learned it. Which parts are not real? Are they mirages, tricks done with lights and mirrors or what?

You believe yourself the Rhode Island expert, you think you have gems of wisdom, so, like, where is this knowledge and keen insight, insight that you, who have never lived in this city or this state, keep proclaiming makes you "unique" and of value to read? Where is it? Show the goods...

[sandsonik]

Originally Posted by massnative71

Yes they have a few hundred years history an identity of their own, but they are still suburbs.

They are independent, autonomous towns.



Lighten up, just lighten up...[/quote]

Meaning....?

[sandsonik]

[quote=AlfieBoy;44469748]

Originally Posted by sandsonik

I think the quote tags got mixed prior to you posting and I wonder if the above was intended for me, or where you replying to this:

Yeah, sorry about that, it's a pain trying to respond and edit posts on this site from a phone.

[QuilterChick]

[quote=boulevardofdef;44469803]That may be because they're from parts of the state that aren't near the city. People from other parts of New York State, and New York is a large state by Eastern standards, always take pains to point out that they're not from New York City -- I was talking about people who are, like myself, from the New York metro area. Alternatively, they could just hate where they're from to the point where they're ashamed of it -- after all, these are all people who left.

I'm from Long Island, and the people there are on average louder, pushier and bigger know-it-alls than people from the city, so you'd never see someone trumpeting their Long Island roots as a way of escaping that stereotype. I have this theory that if you start in Manhattan and head east, people are bigger aggressive jerks the farther you go. So in Manhattan, you've got people accusing shopkeepers of deliberately blocking the price readout on the cash register; further east in Queens, you have old ladies telling you off at the supermarket checkout for zoning out and not moving up in line quickly enough; in Nassau County, you have immigrants screaming "You little $@!! You little $@!!" at the guy selling train tickets; and on the East End, you have Lizzie Grubman plowing through a crowd of townies in her SUV while yelling, "Out of my way, white trash!"[/quote]



Absolutely relate to that paragraph BofD and see that you are 'grounded' in your beliefs as a result of a good upbringing. That is why they have a hard time trying to assimilate here .... they even take their New York (or FL) license plates off their cars shortly after moving in. I have very good friends here from Rochester and upstate NY, who upon first meeting qualified that NY is a very large state and don't want to be lumped in with the pushy loud 'Lawnguyisland' / Manhattan crowd. A high percentage of NY'ers coming halfway back from FL are often just as, or more rude, as they scour our area for 2nd or 3rd homes approaching or exceeding a million $+.

On the other hand we also have wonderful people here who worked very hard, owned business etc., and were just biding their time to get out of NY, NJ, RI, etc. Down to earth, well-grounded friendly folks, who aren't showoffs, and who appreciate the peace and quiet and weather that they find here -- only own one home, and give back generously as benefactors to charitable organizations and land conservation efforts.

To add another reply to the topic at hand though, I would say "no", not all suburbs in RI feel the same -- they are merely suburbs in a very small state. In RI, you could also consider a few of the MA or CT towns suburbs of RI.

[Hollytree]

Merriam Webster's definition of suburb:

Full Definition of suburb
a : an outlying part of a city or town
b : a smaller community adjacent to or within commuting distance of a city
c plural : the residential area on the outskirts of a city or large town

The first definition is the one most often used by urban planners.

[ormari]

Originally Posted by Hollytree

Providence has not annexed surrounding towns as some other cities have. If we do regard surrounding towns/cities as Providence suburbs, then Bristol, Warren, Barrington, East Greenwich, Wickford Village in North Kingstown, Westerly, Chepachet, Newport, Little Compton, Tiverton, (and a couple others I'm sure) have a sense of place- often referred to as walkable town centers.

To me, the distinction is whether we are talking about villages with a town center and a sense of place such as Pawtuxet Village in Warwick, versus a true suburb with no center. To me neither Warwick, Cranston, East Providence, Lincoln, Johnston, North Providence, North Smithfield, Middletown, Portsmouth, etc. have worthwhile town centers which makes them fall more into the suburban category. There are nice areas to live in in all these places however.

This is very well said. Because of the age of the Rhode Island, each of those individual towns and cities have their own unique sense of place. It's why so many of these places aren't suburbs in the more common connotation of the word. Their history pre-exists the dominance of a nearby city, their history stands along with that of Providence. This is not unique to Rhode Island; the same exists in Massachusetts

Originally Posted by massnative71

Maybe there is some new street slang or pop culture lingo definition that I'm not aware of, but this is all I could find:

From Merriam-Webster:

...

The point is that the history is an integral part of why these town/cities aren't common suburbs as found in far younger places, where the suburbs spring up as a result of the city. Places like East Greenwich, Warren, Newport, Lincoln, etc. were distinct entities in and of themselves--first and foremost--before one particular settlement emerged as the demoninant municipality in the immediate area. Hollytree has it right, and (your edition of?) Webster hasn't managed to capture all of the nuance of the word.

[ormari]

Originally Posted by independent man

While East Greenwich & Barrington may win in the RI's Best Public Schools category, I doubt either town center trumps Jamestown Village for excitement or liveliness - especially in the summer!

I defer to your superior knowledge of Jamestown...