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I would love to see Amazon come to my home city because it would be so transformational. I just can't imagine it happening with a city so small. 50,000 jobs in the future would mean a ridiculous amount of growth. Housing shortages, poor public transit, and other infrastructure challenges like the airport seem like major impediments. Even with currently low housing prices (compared to major metros), they would have to surge in a huge way. 50,000 jobs = 150k people increase, maybe more.
But I'll keep my fingers crossed for ROC!
As I understand it, those figures are spread out over 10 or more years. I'm sure we could easily create housing for say 10-15,000 new citizens per year
I agree, the execution wasn't good, but as a start up business they didn't give it enough time to work the bugs out. Keep in mind that the original plan included commercial baggage. The government failed in that regard in getting all of the approvals. I also recall that the late Bill Nojay was running the bus system at the time and really gave the private ownership a hard time. I think adjusting the schedule to maybe once a day would hopefully insure a full boat. Maybe 2 smaller boats would have been better.
I personally think that NYS should have been the operator, even if it had a small loss.
The potential to create a direct connection with Toronto, to me anyway is a no brainer.
(Seattle has a lot of ferries, but none as cool as ours was)
Yup, I remember them banking on a bunch of commercial traffic that never panned out.
I also think that the direct link would have attracted business to the area, like what we are talking about now. You can easily drive, catch the train or bus, fly or take the ferry to Toronto.
I would love to see Amazon come to my home city because it would be so transformational. I just can't imagine it happening with a city so small. 50,000 jobs in the future would mean a ridiculous amount of growth. Housing shortages, poor public transit, and other infrastructure challenges like the airport seem like major impediments. Even with currently low housing prices (compared to major metros), they would have to surge in a huge way. 50,000 jobs = 150k people increase, maybe more.
But I'll keep my fingers crossed for ROC!
You make it sound like an influx of people and money is a bad thing for this area?
I find it ironic that we complain that Rochester/Upstate in general is the arm pit of America but when a proposal like this comes along y'all are like NIMBY.
As I stated before in the thread, the infrastructure, airport and public transit system are "easy" fixes. There has to be a demand for that sort of thing in the first place in order for us to get funding and companies to actually expand flight offerings and what not.
You make it sound like an influx of people and money is a bad thing for this area?
I find it ironic that we complain that Rochester/Upstate in general is the arm pit of America but when a proposal like this comes along y'all are like NIMBY.
As I stated before in the thread, the infrastructure, airport and public transit system are "easy" fixes. There has to be a demand for that sort of thing in the first place in order for us to get funding and companies to actually expand flight offerings and what not.
I never said it would be bad. And I'm not suggesting Rochester should say NO if Amazon selected the city.
But, infrastructure fixes are NOT easy nor are they cheap; why does everything think they the are? And growth can be painful as many boomtowns can attest. My only point was to say that per the CRITERIA in the RFP, if you've actually read it, Rochester is not an easy fit compared to the competition. And housing shortages and increases in price, which would most certainly happen if Amazon arrived in ROC, are real things to consider.
But I'll say what I said in the post you quoted, my fingers are crossed for Rochester. It would be great for the city and metro.
You make it sound like an influx of people and money is a bad thing for this area?
I find it ironic that we complain that Rochester/Upstate in general is the arm pit of America but when a proposal like this comes along y'all are like NIMBY.
As I stated before in the thread, the infrastructure, airport and public transit system are "easy" fixes. There has to be a demand for that sort of thing in the first place in order for us to get funding and companies to actually expand flight offerings and what not.
No one said Rochester or Upstate was the arm pit of anything.
Where is the money for infrastructure, airport, and public transit going to come from? We're talking hundreds of millions if not billions. These are NOT easy fixes. Have you watched Atlanta? Have you experienced Atlanta or Charlotte? Both grew rapidly literally overnight and have spent hundreds of millions trying to catch up.
Widening highways is not easy. It takes years and years and years. It takes court battles using emanate domain. Numerous bridges have to be rebuilt before a highway can even be widened. I did experience some of the insane growth in Charlotte when I lived in SC. NC still working on widening highways. They have plans that will take decades and by then, those plans won't be enough. NY has this issue around Albany on I87 as well.
Expanding flights isn't a piece of cake. It's also not up to the airport. It's up to the airlines. There would need to be a massive expansion at the airport to bring in tons of flights. That's millions of dollars.
Where does all of this money come from? People say oh it's an easy fix, but never say how to fix it or where the money will come from.
No one said Rochester or Upstate was the arm pit of anything.
Where is the money for infrastructure, airport, and public transit going to come from? We're talking hundreds of millions if not billions. These are NOT easy fixes. Have you watched Atlanta? Have you experienced Atlanta or Charlotte? Both grew rapidly literally overnight and have spent hundreds of millions trying to catch up.
Widening highways is not easy. It takes years and years and years. It takes court battles using emanate domain. Numerous bridges have to be rebuilt before a highway can even be widened. I did experience some of the insane growth in Charlotte when I lived in SC. NC still working on widening highways. They have plans that will take decades and by then, those plans won't be enough. NY has this issue around Albany on I87 as well.
Expanding flights isn't a piece of cake. It's also not up to the airport. It's up to the airlines. There would need to be a massive expansion at the airport to bring in tons of flights. That's millions of dollars.
Where does all of this money come from? People say oh it's an easy fix, but never say how to fix it or where the money will come from.
Yes, I am not sure why some posters think the infrastructure challenges will be easy. Taxes would be a large source for that burden, and to your point, that doesn't speak to the experience of the construction and the time it takes.
Another element in this will be corporate welfare. Amazon will expect whatever city they choose to bend over and scream their name. While it will be worth it in a lot of ways, I wouldn't take the infrastructure, housing and tax implications lightly. And the smaller the city, the more that's felt.
Yes, I am not sure why some posters think the infrastructure challenges will be easy. Taxes would be a large source for that burden, and to your point, that doesn't speak to the experience of the construction and the time it takes.
Another element in this will be corporate welfare. Amazon will expect whatever city they choose to bend over and scream their name. While it will be worth it in a lot of ways, I wouldn't take the infrastructure, housing and tax implications lightly. And the smaller the city, the more that's felt.
I watched Charlotte expand I85 and I77....it was literally years of construction nightmares. It SUCKED! Traffic was already a huge issue and then you add in years of construction. OMG! It was a total nightmare. It also cost a fortune. I know NC sold bonds to pay for part of it. Part of it became a toll road - yeah we want more of those here! NOT.
No city can put all of their eggs in one basket. I've watched cities do that. Schenectady comes to mind. Ge was there to build the city over a century ago. Where is GE now? Schenectady never figured out how to capitalize on that and bring in other companies. They put all of their eggs in the GE basket. They've been in a major hole for decades because of that. Every time another GE building is torn down and they're reassessed, taxes go up for everyone else instead of trying to figure out how to do the same with less or how to being in new things to make up the difference. This wasn't even all under one administration.
It's sad because no one has figured out how to fix their problems. There's potential there, but no one has figured out how to make the corrections they need. There are some areas of the city that are gorgeous....amazing architecture. A really nice college - Union College and a community college. A historic theater. Central Park is a nice park and has a gorgeous rose garden. Auburn reminds me of Schenectady in many ways.
I watched Charlotte expand I85 and I77....it was literally years of construction nightmares. It SUCKED! Traffic was already a huge issue and then you add in years of construction. OMG! It was a total nightmare. It also cost a fortune. I know NC sold bonds to pay for part of it. Part of it became a toll road - yeah we want more of those here! NOT.
No city can put all of their eggs in one basket. I've watched cities do that. Schenectady comes to mind. Ge was there to build the city over a century ago. Where is GE now? Schenectady never figured out how to capitalize on that and bring in other companies. They put all of their eggs in the GE basket. They've been in a major hole for decades because of that. Every time another GE building is torn down and they're reassessed, taxes go up for everyone else instead of trying to figure out how to do the same with less or how to being in new things to make up the difference. This wasn't even all under one administration.
It's sad because no one has figured out how to fix their problems. There's potential there, but no one has figured out how to make the corrections they need. There are some areas of the city that are gorgeous....amazing architecture. A really nice college - Union College and a community college. A historic theater. Central Park is a nice park and has a gorgeous rose garden. Auburn reminds me of Schenectady in many ways.
The national problem is anemic job growth. Jobs that people can live on vs. minimum wage. It's led to states/cities/municipalities playing a game of cut-throat politics and corporate welfare strategy to attract companies and make their locality financially stable. That's not even accounting for all the privately held debt that's propping up the private sector....that represents good jobs (e.g. GM, housing, etc.).
And to your point, career politicians are not interested in driving difficult choices and telling people no. It's something that has to really fail to course correct IMO.
Amazon would really help Rochester, but the problems still exist, and too many eggs in one basket is a bad place to be. We know that from Kodak, B&L, etc.
Widening highways is not easy. It takes years and years and years. It takes court battles using emanate domain. Numerous bridges have to be rebuilt before a highway can even be widened. I did experience some of the insane growth in Charlotte when I lived in SC. NC still working on widening highways. They have plans that will take decades and by then, those plans won't be enough. NY has this issue around Albany on I87 as well.
Rochester's infrastructure is just fine and can easily support another 50,000. We have highways built for 3 million people with a population of 1 million. Rochester has 7 expressways of 3-4 lanes going East, West, North, South from every which direction. We have a brand new train station. We have major renovations coming to the airport. The airport currently handles 2 million passengers a year with virtually zero delays. It can handle a few thousand more passenger or even a million more like a piece of cake.
We don't need to widen any highways, build any new train stations, or build a new airport. The only thing we fneed is to optimize our bus routes and direct flights from the airport.
look at how long decisions took about downtown. look at Charlotte, the condos on the water. Wasn't that supposedly the remake of charlotte. If you think 50,000 new jobs and a new corporation wouldn't be a big impact, I have a bridge to sell you .Say good by to no traffic ,low housing and the culture of every day life in rochester. The residents now living in Rochester and the suburbs who will not be able to afford it anymore. Where would they go? the low wages associated with the low COL will limit their list. theses are the reason why officials and everyone in the decision making process know Rochester is not truly in the running and will not be the pick With the top employer of Rochester being a supermarket, are the residents really up to the challenges ?
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